in terms of speaking with my therapist...

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My therapist has noticed that it's difficult for me to express how certain situations make me feel (duh!). But even odder, if I work through a situation in front of him, and he sees the process, he kind of figures all of the emotions I mention are what I feel in a situation. For instance, if I say that I'm unsure about a situation, I will start analyzing it out loud, and I will keep saying things like "I suppose I might feel embarrassed..." "...but if I'm aware that I might be feeling embarrassed, then I suppose it could just be a more nervous reaction than embarrassed upon expressing it..." "...if I'm nervous and nobody understands, then I suppose it would be frustration..."

I'm unsure if I'm explaining it right, but have any of you experienced this? Where WHILE explaining how you feel, and analyzing the situation, it isn't that these emotions/feelings are piling up on top of one another necessarily, but you are just trying to figure out the root emotion/feeling in the situation. So if I start off saying I find a situation frustrating, and eventually deduce that I actually find it humorous in the moment despite initial frustration, he has a hard time understanding that I actually find it more humorous than anything else at the moment, and that frustration doesn't necessarily come into play as much, it was just my first thought as to what I might be feeling when describing a certain situation.

Gah, I'm horrible at explaining this, lol, but I hope somebody understands.

How can I explain this to the therapist so that it will make sense? He seems to be convinced that there might be more to these emotions than I'm aware of, because he notices that I do get wrapped up in analyzing to figure out how I feel rather than just knowing immediately... but when I do feel something in a situation, it is generally pretty temporary and really isn't worth even figuring out at the moment, which is why I have such a hard time recalling something and trying to explain how I feel. He seems to have the idea that my overanalyzing IN THE MOMENT causes the confusion and inability to express it. But really, I'm hardly aware of what I'm feeling most times, I just know that it's uncomfortable and that's about the extent of what I can figure out. It isn't really that I'm overanalyzing in the moment, creating a blockage, as I keep making it sound apparently to him... it's just that I don't really care or notice a lot when it happens. It's when I'm questioned about how I feel that I can't do it well at all. I suppose it does not help when I ask if there is a textbook definition he is looking for in my responses, as any emotion used could have a different feeling attached from one person to the next, so it is impossible to accurately convey what one is feeling at any given moment in time to someone else.

I use a whole 3-5 emotions when conversing with him usually, and for me, for some reason, they are all interchangeable almost, lol. I am just unsure as to what to say for him to understand a bit better (as my wording and explanations are AWFUL), and I'm not sure what he's actually looking for in my responses. I NEVER say "I'm happy when this happens", "this is humorous", or "this is very frustrating"... it's always "I THINK I might be happy... but I suppose I could just be confused too..." lol. Gah! Why do I bother going? I think I wind up more confused in the end trying to gain a bit of understanding about myself and trying to explain things to him, lol.

I think Aspie Autism and PDD are just made up disorders to describe people who have emotions that don't make any sense to psychologists. They like to lump it in the category of disorder because they wish the world and people were easy to understand so they could control them.
At least homosexuality isn't a disorder anymore.

Situations don't make me feel a certain way. My current mood at the moment will affect how I feel about a situation as will the people around me. This is why talking about it later doesn't really make any sense. Either you talk about feelings as you are having them, or you don't really know what you are talking about. I've found keeping a journal helps with this because then you can go back later and read about how you felt. That still doesn't mean it makes sense, but at least you notice a pattern in your thoughts and feelings.

I have troube describing emotion and have come up with the phrase that I am 'deviating form happiness' as a coverall for sadness, anger, frustration etc which I can't individually place.
I would talk matter-of-fact about events to my therapist and after the session he would then have emotional reaction to the 'terrible things' and felt traumatised and couldn't understand that iI really didn't feel anything, they were just events that happened.
I hope your therapist can learn the skills to understand aspies better.

Hi,

Are you saying that you have trouble putting your feelings into words and conveying it effectively and that you're falling over your own words which only makes things worse for you?

jj

My therapist has noticed that it's difficult for me to express how certain situations make me feel (duh!). But even odder, if I work through a situation in front of him, and he sees the process, he kind of figures all of the emotions I mention are what I feel in a situation. For instance, if I say that I'm unsure about a situation, I will start analyzing it out loud, and I will keep saying things like "I suppose I might feel embarrassed..." "...but if I'm aware that I might be feeling embarrassed, then I suppose it could just be a more nervous reaction than embarrassed upon expressing it..." "...if I'm nervous and nobody understands, then I suppose it would be frustration..."

I'm unsure if I'm explaining it right, but have any of you experienced this? Where WHILE explaining how you feel, and analyzing the situation, it isn't that these emotions/feelings are piling up on top of one another necessarily, but you are just trying to figure out the root emotion/feeling in the situation. So if I start off saying I find a situation frustrating, and eventually deduce that I actually find it humorous in the moment despite initial frustration, he has a hard time understanding that I actually find it more humorous than anything else at the moment, and that frustration doesn't necessarily come into play as much, it was just my first thought as to what I might be feeling when describing a certain situation.

Gah, I'm horrible at explaining this, lol, but I hope somebody understands.

How can I explain this to the therapist so that it will make sense? He seems to be convinced that there might be more to these emotions than I'm aware of, because he notices that I do get wrapped up in analyzing to figure out how I feel rather than just knowing immediately... but when I do feel something in a situation, it is generally pretty temporary and really isn't worth even figuring out at the moment, which is why I have such a hard time recalling something and trying to explain how I feel. He seems to have the idea that my overanalyzing IN THE MOMENT causes the confusion and inability to express it. But really, I'm hardly aware of what I'm feeling most times, I just know that it's uncomfortable and that's about the extent of what I can figure out. It isn't really that I'm overanalyzing in the moment, creating a blockage, as I keep making it sound apparently to him... it's just that I don't really care or notice a lot when it happens. It's when I'm questioned about how I feel that I can't do it well at all. I suppose it does not help when I ask if there is a textbook definition he is looking for in my responses, as any emotion used could have a different feeling attached from one person to the next, so it is impossible to accurately convey what one is feeling at any given moment in time to someone else.

I use a whole 3-5 emotions when conversing with him usually, and for me, for some reason, they are all interchangeable almost, lol. I am just unsure as to what to say for him to understand a bit better (as my wording and explanations are AWFUL), and I'm not sure what he's actually looking for in my responses. I NEVER say "I'm happy when this happens", "this is humorous", or "this is very frustrating"... it's always "I THINK I might be happy... but I suppose I could just be confused too..." lol. Gah! Why do I bother going? I think I wind up more confused in the end trying to gain a bit of understanding about myself and trying to explain things to him, lol.

lol, kind of both. I analyze it out loud, and he reads into it that way. So that just makes it confusing.

I'm HORRIBLE at expressing how I feel about pretty much everything, lol, because I really just honestly don't know. It's awful to be pinned to explaining how I feel about something, when it is something that literally just doesn't really matter anymore, lol. They are just things that happened, and that's it, but to be pinned into attaching an emotion to it is almost distressing in itself, because I don't know how I felt in that situation.

In therapy, if you say "I don't know" or "I feel indifferent about just everything the majority of the time", they want to dig to get to the "root" of the problem. Then if you flip flop or analyze it too much, or say "I *probably* felt ______", then they think the same Either way, according to most, you are covering up how you feel about something by not discussing it. I over analyze in an attempt to give the most accurate response.

I kinda get what you are saying. I will share a couple similar experiences.
My first reaction to what I think I feel about something is often wrong. I just don't realize how I feel about something by instinct. I have pretty much no ability to predict how I will feel about something in the future. How I felt about something in the past is so clouded by what I think I should have felt, that I remember them that way until I go back and look at each little piece.

I recently visited a university campus and had no idea how I felt about it. After talking a bit about what I did and possible things I could do if I attended there I realized that I was a bit excited by the idea. It came about it a round about way, but now I am really liking the idea of going away to college.

Recently at my therapist we got to the subject of loss or abandonment and she asked how I felt when my sister moved out west. My brain recalled feeling a bit sad when I would walk upstairs and expect to see her sitting at the computer, but there was just an empty chair. I only recalled it as being a little bit of sadness and wanting to see her now and then.
So as I started to say this I got blind sided with emotions. I started crying and had to stop for a bit. As I was trying to gather my composure enough to continue I was thinking on why I was crying and started to find it to be such an extreme reaction that it was funny. So then I started laughing in between sobs. I don't really remember anything after that until I was on my way home. I think the high emotions swamped out my memory part of my brain. Towards the end my feelings were pretty much towards the happy side of things. Since then for the entire week I have had a little bit of pep and a bit of a smile on my face. I really don't understand emotions at all.

Is your therapist experienced in AS? If not, you need to find one who is. Someone who knows AS will understand that you don't know how you feel about things, and should help you try to figure out how you feel, and from there how to express yourself to other people so that your needs are met in life.

I know exactly what you mean about not feeling anything at the moment of any particular event, and then later being upset and not knowing why or how to explain it, etc. I have to go over and over events in my mind later, in order to process them and figure out how I really feel. I'm in counseling (CBT) and it's helped tremendously. I ran into the same problems in my initial sessions with being unable to really express myself clearly, and worrying that she couldn't follow what I meant. So I started writing down in advance what I wanted to say during the sessions, and that worked wonders. If it's something really detailed, I even send her an email writing it all out in advance of the session, and she's fine with that. She told me lots of her NT patients even do that, because lots of people feel more comfortable expressing themselves in writing. I really think you should give that a try. I think you'll get a lot more out of your sessions that way, and your therapist will probably be relieved to have more information, too. If s/he doesn't agree to this method, I'd think about looking for someone else.

Good luck.

It's almost like you're giving yourself mixed signals. Sort of like crossed wires. From my own experience it's something to do with the original mirroring given in early infancy which scrambled reality and which rendered owning emotions confusing later on in life.

The way to get straight on feeling what you're feeling and connecting the thoughts to emotions and speaking your truth is a matter of coordination. It is said that as below, as above. The body can entrain the mind and the mind can entrain the body. So - I would start getting in touch with my real feelings without interference or intepretation. Then move on to expressing that in movement, song, writing, art, poetry. Whatever you connect with. And just keep on practicing feeling and owning your emotions until you can feel without the need to analyze them. You're in a sense retrainng your mind to recognize authentic emotions and to register their feeling as authentic as well. Getting in touch with your feelings is the first step and you will need some alone time to do this.

There's a lot of literature on the subject btw. If you need titles, I can find a few that would be helpful.

lol, kind of both. I analyze it out loud, and he reads into it that way. So that just makes it confusing.

I'm HORRIBLE at expressing how I feel about pretty much everything, lol, because I really just honestly don't know. It's awful to be pinned to explaining how I feel about something, when it is something that literally just doesn't really matter anymore, lol. They are just things that happened, and that's it, but to be pinned into attaching an emotion to it is almost distressing in itself, because I don't know how I felt in that situation.

In therapy, if you say "I don't know" or "I feel indifferent about just everything the majority of the time", they want to dig to get to the "root" of the problem. Then if you flip flop or analyze it too much, or say "I *probably* felt ______", then they think the same Either way, according to most, you are covering up how you feel about something by not discussing it. I over analyze in an attempt to give the most accurate response.

Yes, I think that is another good chunk of my confusion by far. When I went into therapy to begin with, it was to get some sort of help to be moving forward in life, lol... to try to gain some understanding, direction, etc. It almost seems self-defeating in the purpose of therapy, when one goes in to get help in moving forward, and they are forced to stay in the past rather than actually SOLVING anything at all.

He is a grad student, so I have a feeling he's learning a lot about different types of people, but he's still trying to apply the knowledge he knows to my situation rather than thinking "outside of the box" (of what is normally addressed).

For instance, one of the reasons I wanted to go in was due to constant confusion in attempting to communicate with people.... now how the heck does the past have anything to do with solving why it is currently such a big problem? I mean, I understand that certain things lead up to the way we are today, that is a given. But the problem seems to lie in the fact that I don't think he actually realizes I really have just accepted everything as things that have happened to me. I don't have a ton of issues that has to do with it-maybe one or 2 things, but they are also due to emotional immaturity (I think) moreso than anything that actually happened to me. I've weighed this out in front of him, and he seems to take it from the perspective that I'm trying to avoid it and that I'm simply saying that I accept it so I will not have to talk about it... but I presented him with something upon first going, that had all of the questions I anticipated him asking about-everything from my childhood up until now. It included both negative things that have happened as events, as well as things that I have constantly struggled with in understanding all the way through my life.

I went into great detail of the things in my past, and when he asks about them, I speak slower and quieter. Now, it seems silly that he would have any odd ideas when this happens, as things that were unpleasant at the time, and are unpleasant as a whole (no matter who is being referred to that it happened to), is NOT going to be PLEASANT to talk about, lol. But he always wants to explore it more. I talk about it just fine, I may speak slower, but it is because I am trying to make sure I have the events in order as I talk about them. I talk quieter because it's not exactly a FUN thing to talk about on a regular basis, lol, but it isn't because I've suppressed these things, or have not accepted them. It is just because the acts in themselves are unpleasant and it does not matter who it happened to, they are still unpleasant to talk about.

Of course things like this get read into WAY too much, because I assume any NT who went in and said the same things could very well be suppressing something, or would just not want to talk about such things. The difference is that I just really have no emotional attachment to any of these things-in fact, I laugh about some of them just as anyone would tell another about a humorous event that happened in their day, because they are just so bizarre and random. I'm not scarred from them, I can talk about them with no problem-it just isn't FUN, lol, especially when trying to attach emotions to everything as well as attempting to recall it all. Ugh, it's wearing on the mind.

It's also annoying at times, because I can say "I suppose that one might feel _____ or ____ in this situation" He will immediately attach this to how I feel. I'm constantly having to say "no, I felt I was being pressed to respond accurately, and I can only do so by assuming what others might feel or what they might not feel. I personally feel indifferent towards it." LOL-he often says "well, isn't indifference a sort of a feeling too?" oh geez, lol... here I am, unable to argue it, because I honestly DON'T KNOW, lol. I'm not saying it is or isn't. Then he asks me to describe it, and I always respond with "I think" statements, which he also points out sometimes, and says it's interesting that it's the way I describe it. He's looking for some answer that is like "emptiness in your stomach" or something, and I'm giving him "well, I haven't given it much thought... but I suppose it just feels blank because I can't think of anything to attach to it".

lol-I don't see why that is so odd, as that apparently is another interesting thing about most people with ASD (I learned recently during my son's assessment at the center for autism)-the lady said that most people with any form of autism that she has spoken with often initially describe their emotions in terms of cognition. She said it is not uncommon to hear happy described as lightheaded or bubbly thoughts, and it's common to hear the others described as having to do with thoughts or the brain directly. Hopefully I'll get something sorted out with them after my assessment through them, lol.

He has not specifically stated that he is trying any sort of therapy at all. He just says it's AS most likely (but he's said it quite a few times and he ALWAYS mentions it when I ask about getting it written down for help in college, which I need desperately, by the way, lol), and possibly ADHD, but he wants me to do the assessment through the college he graduated from... which are $350 a pop, before he puts it on paper. He knows I could definitely use some help, as I keep on having to drop out of classes (2 this semester-both I was failing) because I am simply not getting the information (college won't help unless it's written on paper), but he just states what he thinks it is, and won't write it down until after the assessment.

Sorry, I guess I kind of veered off... and I talked a lot >.< lol.

You sound so much like me that it's funny! I tend to think a lot of events in my past were much more comic than tragic, and apparently that's not the "normal" way for females to react. I was never able to develop a "poor me" attitude, nor can I tolerate it in anyone else.

Your counselor doesn't sound bad, but he does sound very inexperienced (being just a grad student). Maybe he's working on some type of thesis on ASDs himself, and he's trying to learn as much from you as you are from him. That's not a problem in itself, unless it makes you nervous. I think the problem is that you worry too much about what he's thinking about you - I used to do the same thing. If you're like me, you've already had a lifetime of other people telling you what you think, because you couldn't explain or defend your actions sufficiently. So by the time we make it into therapy, we're already super-conditioned to assume that everyone's assessments of us are inaccurate in some way, because they usually are! That makes us really defensive when we feel like the therapist is jumping to conclusions regarding how we feel about something. It's really frustrating, I know. The best advice I can give you is to try and relax a little more with that guy and learn not to care so much about what he's thinking. Concentrate on whatever it is you're discussing, and see if you can figure out how you really do feel about it. It will probably feel uncomfortable at first, but it will be helpful in the long run. I'm still working on this myself - it's not easy.

Thanks for the advice I do need to relax more. It's not just him I worry about, lol. That is probably partially why I just don't talk to people much. They always assume that there is a hidden meaning in things I say, and I'm just not motivated enough to sort it out in ways that they understand, then it bothers me if they do think anything, because I CANNOT clear it up, lol. Gah.

I'll try to relax a bit more. Is there anything you do to help with these types of things before going in? I tend to lose focus on trying to figure out how I'm feeling when talking, because he'll comment, then the focus shifts to straightening that out, lol. I guess I am too uptight about it But I suppose that is good to do in therapy, as it shows it's an obvious thing that bothers me (wording things differently than what is intended, or trying to read too much into what I say). That's good for him and me both I guess, but I always get worked up that he might get a false idea of what I'm saying, and go in that direction with it. It's kind of a catch 22 at times, it seems

Ah well, it will get figured out eventually. I'm sure he's learning a lot from me, I know I learn a lot from him (even if I don't realize it at the time, lol).

ROFL about sounding the same as you. My therapist says the same-that isn't a "NORMAL" response to traumatic situations, lol. But I always explain, I'm not particularly laughing at the situation, and I'm sure I wasn't at the time, it's the CRAZY and RANDOM imagery that pops into my mind when explaining it to others, lol. I'm probably one of the few people I know who can say I've been thrown over a couch, and crack up immediately upon the mention of it. I always think "wow, that's so weird to actually be able to say that..." and I picture like, circus clowns throwing each other around, or boxers knocking each other out of the ring, and sometimes some bugs bunny type stuff when it is mentioned, lol. I'm not sure why it's funny, but between the realization that not many can say it, and the hilarious images that run through my mind, I'm sure the combination is potential to cause all kinds of strange responses to things...

Do you think perhaps that you could be majoring in the wrong thing in college? College is an expensive investment, so it is better not to waste the time and money on getting a degree in something you don't even like. Unfortunately, I had to learn the hard way that you cannot force yourself through classes that you don't like for any end result you do not really care about.


>>>>>He has not specifically stated that he is trying any sort of therapy at all. He just says it's AS most likely (but he's said it quite a few times and he ALWAYS mentions it when I ask about getting it written down for help in college, which I need desperately, by the way, lol), and possibly ADHD, but he wants me to do the assessment through the college he graduated from... which are $350 a pop, before he puts it on paper. He knows I could definitely use some help, as I keep on having to drop out of classes (2 this semester-both I was failing) because I am simply not getting the information (college won't help unless it's written on paper), but he just states what he thinks it is, and won't write it down until after the assessment.

They are required classes-History and English Composition, which means I have to repeat both, lol.

In History, it has to do with note taking and being unable to comprehend anything that is strictly lecture. My notes were awful, and I tried explaining to the disabilities teacher. She said they have people who can take your notes for you, and I could get one on one maybe with someone to help me learn, but I must have a diagnosis on papers with a lesson plan of some sort and a list of things I appear to need help with that they could accommodate.

In English Composition, it was mainly due to my structured routine for myself, and some chaotic "rules" I have adopted through life, lol. I've never been good with writing up rough drafts, as my main focus switches a lot. It is stupid to turn in a rough draft simply to get credit for it (in my mind), if I know that my final draft will likely be VERY different, and that is, in fact, the one that I actually NEED edited, not the other, lol. The other problem was just flat out not being able to read into what the teacher was saying. I loved the teacher, as he was very patient and understanding, but he would not actually say EXACTLY what he was looking for, and couldn't really point me in that direction well at all due to neither of us really knowing how to approach the situation.

Those are basically the 2 classes that I am going to have the roughest time with. English composition is a lot about being able to read into symbolism well or spouting out random ideas in some weird sort of order so that they make sense. Since I often don't notice when I'm leaving out pertinent information, my papers are a disaster. I can only smile at the teacher and say "it makes sense to me, I don't really see where you couldn't follow it", because for me, it actually does tie quite logically in the order that I am presenting it in. But I'm always leaving out some underlying thought.

I'm unsure they could help much in English Comp, but I sure could use a nudge in the right direction a lot of the time. Teachers are at a loss and I am at a loss as to what I might need or how they could maybe help...