Lets get real about what autism really means, hmm?

Post Reply New Topic

Post subject: The plan for autism explains the S.E.T.I. conundrum?
The search for intelligent life kicked off due to various calculations (including by that famous autistic science writer, Isaac Azimov) that indicated that, even using the most conservative estimates, there should be 100K technical civilizations in our Galaxy at any one time, and that we should now be receiving hundreds of radio waves from past technical activity on other planets.

It isn't happening! This suggests two possibilities; that we are unique in achieving our level of technology (highly improbable) or else, all those previous calculations are flawed.

One candidate is that all those I've seen have assumed that, once our current status has been reached, then any such society will survive at least a thousand years, but history tells a different story! All our previous cycles of civilization, even the most enduring, have never lasted much more than a thousand years in total, including the run up to technology.

Suppose the psychodynamics of any intelligent race ensures this is always true, and that the period cannot vary, irrespective of the technological level? What, even if repeated dark ages are inevitable with the same old frequency, could possibly prevent a future civilization which could build upon the discoveries of the previous, thus ensuring a steady repeat of radio waves into the cosmos?

One thing is the discovery of genetics!

Supposing it's inevitable that the "people" oriented types who always aspire to control society, to the exclusive advantage of their own kind, are automatically at odds with the "thing" oriented people who produce all the developments in science and technology, and would eliminate them at the first opportunity?

One obstacle to such an intent is that eugenics inevitably becomes a dirty word, as it quickly becomes apparent that those who think themselves qualified to decide who's fit to survive, never see their own kind as candidates, nor do they measure "fitness" in terms of the candidates contribution to the common weal (in fact they are only interested in what's good for them, and stuff the gullible majority, who exist only to be exploited) so openly attacking the irritatingly unmanageable free thinkers who produce the technology, could well cause the majority to turn against them.

Clearly, deviousness is required (no problem there!) and a way will be found! What then will be the result? Well, the exterminators would indubitably follow the usual path of increasingly undisciplined self indulgence, which would plummet society into the next dark age, as per the usual schedule. Then you'd expect another civilization to evolve, as usual, except, hold on!; you've just eliminated the genotype of that section of society which is the only one capable of invention and scientific progress...so who's going to invent the wheel (etc.) this time round? History shows all such developments came from a tiny fraction of a percent of the population of that age, indicating that most people just haven't got what it takes; science comes from people who think in a different way, who, as a result, are never considered "normal"!

But is it so easy to kill off the natural scientists, without the population at large noticing? One way would be to start mass education, which is a means of making most people a lot more capable than they would be if left to their own devices, and then manipulating the system so that "science" becomes increasingly a job title for those who are not necessarily the most able, but rather those who display the intent to satisfy the requirements of the establishment, by working hard to acquire the status which is imparted by a PhD.

This would inevitably marginalise the true scientists, a process which could be accelerated by over-emphasizing issues like "social skills", until such time as the public image of a "scientists" has changed, from some weird loner with amazing insights, into a smartly dressed professional, who's "just like me, only smarter" and who achieves by working hard. All that would remain then, would be to construe weirdness as a defect, stir it in with other, genuine, defects, and work to create in the publics eye some kind of chimera so complicated that it would seem the only possible cure is to terminate any fetus which carries the "defective" genes which cause this collective dysfunctionality. Does this process seem at all familiar?

Discuss!

Hahaha...I have a friend who was a grad student in chemistry. It was AMAZING what some of those grad students still couldn't do. I've heard horror stories from him when he worked in a lab as well at his last job. My friend didn't have his PhD, but the project manager was a total idiot.

Radio waves spread out as they traverse space (like water waves through water), becoming increasingly weaker with distance as a result (and the distances between stars are incredible, needless to say); they're probably there, we just haven't aimed our radio telescopes in precisely the right spot yet (that, or radio telescope technology still needs to advance a bit further).

I would have to agree with this, as it is the best, most plausible explanation to the fermi paradox. Though i have to admit the Zoo hypothesis is a fun one too (meaning that the Prime Directive does exist...)

"irritatingly unmanageable free thinkers" I just LOVE this term!!

I like the outlook about how society tries to push out the object-oriented, the creative minds....

Makes you wonder what some of the big reasons WHY are? Maybe because Status-Quo means more money for corporations; and inventions that produce more energy or use less of it, promote true health, promote "rising above mediocrity" all threaten established businesses and future income.

The Almighty Dollar.

That, and pull out the world's supply of "scientists" and employ them in making New-And-Improved Toothpaste and 'CheeZ'-ier Macaroni!


I'm with you, as far as OUR planet goes. As far as others? I'm sure God's got plenty other stuff out there - but we're in quarantine until this whole satan problem gets wiped out.

Wow... that was... drivel.

Actually, we're getting better and better at plugging numbers into the Drake equation, the question then becomes how long does a technological society last, and that's your big variable. I'm somewhat of a pessimist - I say 200 years, putting us about 100 in. I think that for a society to be able to reach our level of sophistication, plentiful fossil fuel supplies and nuclear fuel is required, but is also consumed at such a rate that environmental catastrophe or nuclear war destroys those societies so completely that that race never again achieves high technology (in fact, it can't - the fossil fuels required are consumed).
Incidentally, the numbers I run with for the Drake equation come out with the Milky Way supporting a mere 1.7 technological civilizations, including ourselves, at this time. Which is to say, it's more likely than not that we're the only one in the whole galaxy.

Well, yes, but there is a stronger drive to eliminate warriors. What was the point of Religious Wars? Weak priests getting rid of the strong?

The possible uses of radio were discussed by Tesla, the broadcast of one field that would carry power and communication. On smarter worlds they might listen, and the result would be a radio signal that was all at once, much like a star. It would be like listening to the Internet, without URLs.

Th energy saving of fiber optic, which do not radiate, geo- sattlite which send a weak down directed signal, and technology we have not thought of, would limit broadcast radio to a narrow time frame.

Any culture a hundred years ahead or behind us would be invisable. Our development was speeded up by nine events that killed most life on Earth. Taking warm blooded as a needed step, we only got there recently.

A hundred years before, Azimov would have solved all problems with the steam engine. Even if the math was right, 100K technical civilizations, most of them would be a billion light years away.

The gene pool was mostly used for production, and till recently, everyone produced food. What was wanted was people on the land producing food with as little management as possible. No one was trying to breed a better peasent. They were enough of a danger to Church and State, hence wars to kill off the strong, who could change things. It worked for today, but some girl had seen it first, so the genes continued.

Socially approved science gives you NASA. Still flying a 1968 model, long after leading thought has concluded that manned flight is very limited. Several years in a space station is more than most could take without damage, being born there would present real problems, they could never return to Earth, and there is no where to go. Space is like a Microwave, with very fast rocks.

Some of the rocks are large, a good sized one strikes land every 25,000 years, so figure four hit water. Worldwide flood stories? If it makes a mile wide crater on land, what is the effect of an Ocean strike?

Species in the fossil record show a run of 5,000,000 years to be average, humans are 5,000,000 years old.

Technology in the Universe may be very rare, for the dolphins would have no use for everything we have developed.

There seems to be an excess of Time and Space.

or, maybe they discovered wires before electromagnetic waves and decided using waves for communication was flawed.

Why must another inteligent race advance through exactly the same milestones we have. They may have even had some kind of technichal accident and bypassed what we concider modern or advanced today.

No race in the right mind would intenstionally send radio waves to another star system in hopes of random discovery, thier race would die out before a reply could be recieved through the same medium.

Not really... mostly a religious/political/military combined force that decided to flex its impressive muscle and stamp out any voices of opposition. Someone speaks out against your "church"? Label 'em a Heretic and have 'em tortured and burned in public! That'll teach the masses to get into line!


Hmm.... maybe that's where our current Sheeple philosophy comes from... over a thousand years of "conform or die!"

We are changing out habits a bit, going from broad, continuous high powered transmissions to directed and/or low powered burst transmissions on frequencies that are more easily absorbed in our atmospheres. If this is a common pattern among galactic it would mean that the window of opportunity during which a civilization could be discovered - and thus the chance that it is discovered - is dramatically reduced.