Those ignorant of their AS--and doing fine

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So many people on here have serious problems with things like awkwardness, deppression, mental illness, rejection, etc. Reading so many, it started to seem that Aspergers is almost a guarantee of not being able to achieve more in life than coping (in the world around them that is, intellectually of course is different). I've been, and am more and more, at a point where no one would guess I have it because the problems are gone and I thrive. its just that each time things crept back before I'd gotten far enough away--but it made me start to think, perhaps there is no hope, perhaps I am doomed to a cycle.

But then I thought: how many people out there DO have aspergers and have no idea because it never incapacitated them--whether because of circumstances or their brains?

Most of the people on WP know they have AS because they or their parents knew something was wrong and searched for answers---and found it. But what if you never had a need to search for answers? In that case, someone might figure it out by chance, but they would not seek an "answer" for their personality. So WP probably gives an impression that AS guarantees problems--but it is misleading.

So out of all the people with AS, you're going to see more problems in a group of people that have it as part of their identity.

I have a friend who is quite popular and socially skilled, but I am fairly sure he has AS for good reasons. He knew what autism was and actually suggested perhaps he had it---but it ended there. He would never come onto WP or try to fix himself. Why should he?

Anyway, I just want to get back to that point where I don't really think about it anymore because I don't need to.

That's your answer. One doesn't have a disorder if it doesn't affect them in the areas of functioning that the professionals deem as important.

I second that.

I don't third it.

For a few reasons.

One of them would still fit within the medical model that the DSM was written under, the rest might not.

The first is, basically, what if a person got to the point where they didn't have trouble in all those areas? Would they stop being autistic for that period of time, even if, later (as often happens), they tire out, can't juggle all the things at once anymore, and begin to have pretty serious problems? That doesn't make sense to me, their neurology has not in that case changed, just their ability to adapt to the rest of the world has. I have watched autistic people of that sort crash in middle age. It's not pretty. Especially when they can get zero help.

The second is, that particular criterion has always bothered me. It denies the fact that there are in fact autistic-friendly niches in the world, that there can in fact be, and that in those niches some autistic people are not functioning as impaired, even if in the pretty hostile environment of the rest of the world they would be. My idea is closer to the social model of disability, where disability is the intersection of a particular kind of person with a particular environment. The DSM runs on the medical model of disability, where disability is entirely intrinsic within the person. I don't agree with them.

There was a man that Simon Baron-Cohen interviewed at great length. He had all the traits of what's now considered to be Asperger's, the same traits a lot of people on this site have. Yet Simon Baron-Cohen would not diagnose him. Why? Because he had found that exact kind of niche. He had the support he needed and the right sort of people around him in his job, to where he had no social or occupational problems.

Think of it another way -- does a deaf person quit being deaf if they live in an area where everyone speaks sign language and everything is equally accessible to deaf and hearing people, where they have a good education, good job, lots of friends, they drive a car, and do everything else the hearing people around them do? Which... of course they're still deaf. Then why would the wiring inherent in being autistic not count as autistic unless a person is having a certain amount of trouble? I have known deaf people who can speak and lipread to the point where they completely pass as hearing in pretty much all situations... but they're still deaf.

And that's the other thing... being autistic is a way people are wired. It's not a set of unrelated problems that just happen to occur together. It's as far as anyone knows a way of processing information that results in certain autistic traits, and whether you see it as mostly a deficit or mostly an ability or neither, it still exists whether or not a person fits into non-autistic society really well by a whole lot of strategies that might not be available to other autistic people for whatever reason.

Basically, the person being able to pass as something else they're really the "something else" they're passing for.

You can do more than cope and can be successful although I'm not sure about being a great socializer and having lots of friends. I've coped all my life and never heard of AS until a year or so ago. Everyone copes so I thought that the coping that I was doing was normal. Had I known that I actually had more to cope with than everyone else I likely would have never achieved as much as I have. I don't know that kids should even be told about AS unless they are absolutely failing at coping.

But what if you don't know you're impaired? What if you turned your impairment into an endearing quality? What if you don't mind being transient in jobs? I have a friend who is like this to a tee.

He can't drive or ride a bike, but doesn't mind. He's environmentally minded anyhow. His main justification for not riding a bike is that it "goes too fast". He rides buses, trains and hitch hikes.
He doesn't care when he looks goofy, out of style, sounds overly formal or has no idea what anyone is talking about.
He obsesses over romantic/sexual relationships when faced with them. However, he can be celibate for years at a time. He can be faithful for years too.
He has a strong sense of morality and holds tight to it, but it's not necessarily correlated to society's laws or norms.
He's incredibly "youthful". I've known him for 20 years (from his early 20's to early 40's) and he hasn't really changed his disposition.
I've never told him my suspicions because I'm sure he'd just wave me off and tease me for labeling him.

anbuend, that's kinda the point. Our different neurological makeup is only a disorder when we cannot function adequately in the areas they expect us to. You still have the underlying genetic differences, you just aren't as severe, or the external factors allow one to function adequately. The thing is, said external factors aren't there for everyone; take away those, and the individual doesn't function adequately. So in a way, they still won't function adequately in reality. It's also down to the individual as well, and their personality, some people are completely happy with what they're restricted in doing, others aren't.

KimJ, you know you're impaired when you want to do things but you're unable to do them (whether it's making friends, having a boyfriend/girlfriend and/or working in your ideal job--no matter one's intelligence level).

But I think you're missing the point that people can choose or live a lifestyle where that impairment flies under the radar. Maybe it's denial of a sort, but when you're young, you imprint on what feels good and what doesn't. You may just think that you're doing what feels best.
I mean, really, Asperger's was unheard of until the 80's-90's and most people still don't know much about it. If you're surrounded by other Aspies or people very similar, then who is to say you're "impaired"? But yeah, put that same person in a crowd of NTs and they don't function as well. I bet there have been a lot more Aspies in the former situation than you're giving credit.

To echo daniels posts, but still responding to the first post, the very nature of this board says that we probably end up with more severely effected people than those who just get on with their lives.

If we were able to "just get out and do it" we probably wouldn't need WrongPlanet in the first place. In fact, an idle fancy of mine for a while has been the chasing of a goal in my adaption to Asperger's. And that is "To reach a point where I no longer need WrongPlanet." Of course that is a worthless goal because it is too broad and there is no time limit set on it. So that remains my "overarching" goal that I am working towards at the moment.

I agree 100%.

I'm not missing the point: it goes down to what the individual wants. Personality has a big effect over how one "handles" their disorder; even if they know they have it or not. I know this; I never said I didn't/don't.

I.e., I'm a little perturbed with my autistic disorder for the simple reason that I'm unable to join the military. I don't really mind that I cannot socialize with people (I never wanted to), nor do I care for material wealth. In fact, I only knew I had a problem when I went to join the military, I wasn't "impaired" beforehand (I was diagnosed with autism at 25).

There's people out there who want to socialize and/or want material wealth, but they cannot do it for they have a neurological disorder. Hence, they're impaired.

But I think the OP is bringing up the topic that there are Aspies out there that have what they want. Which will be different from what you want or I want.

WP is here for those who feel impaired, though I came here to learn more for my son. I had no idea I was Aspie. Though at this point, I recognized I'm impaired. I'd like to have smoother communication skills, less social anxiety and more friends. But I have friends who are clearly Aspie and don't care at all. They love who they are, have found their "niche" and lifestyle.

Wow, Kim, that sounds like me with out the angst! I myself, am almost 60 and a few weeks before I found out about AS (and that was what I had been searching for all my life!) I was just thinking "gee, I seem to have never grown up!" People will meet and greet me as an adult but soon are treating me like a child and I have never understood why. Now I understand.

We didn't know we were 'high functioning' anything back in the day. We were considered 'ret*d' or 'special' depending on the enlightenment of our parents.

Merle

Well yeah, I have that; I have what I want. I'm still impaired however in the context of the disorder itself. That's why we have labels and disorders in the first place; I don't want to socialize, but I still cannot do it. I don't want to go to formal schooling, I still cannot do it, etcetera.

And as I post frequently, most with HFA/AS have no friends and most don't work; I've yet to see many people who don't want those two.

Last edited by Danielismyname on 24 Dec 2007, 1:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

Is a blindperson impaired?!?!?!? You have TWO possible answers, so chose carefully!

1. They AREN'T because they don't know they are blind.
2. They ARE ***SOLELY*** because they know they are.

Well, I was impaired in ways I didn't know about because, like that blind guy, I thought everyone else had the SAME problems.

Steve,

Exactly, how is it that you know you're "blind" if you're not affected by the disorder? If you're not affected by blindness (what blindness entails, i.e., not seeing), you can see right?