obvious traits in AS?

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Can you appear to not have AS and be diagnosed with it?

How apparent is it--do you think?

Would you recognize it right away in someone-child or adult?

thx,

equinn

I think it can depend on age, and severity.

I can appear pretty normal I think...just not on a 24/7 basis. After awhile the mask starts to slip.

It depends on the Aspie. It's obvious in some people, but not in others.

I think it depends on how well the person fuctions and how much someone knows about the behavior. Someone with just a little knowledge probably wouldn't see a lot of people who have AS, but for someone who has worked with people with AS or knows a lot about it I'm sure there are moments where they walk in a public place and they see the signs.

I also believe that you can "appear" NT but still be diagnosed. Some people hide their traits well, but I'm sure it leads to a lot of mental exhaustion. Talking with a specialist about your past and issues you have can make it clear.

The little things by themselves don't give it away; normal people can lack many things people with AS do, it's just that they may lack one or two, here and there, whereas the individual with AS lacks far more.

A lack of nonverbal cues, an odd posture, plus a lack of emotional inflection in the voice can give it away, even in the "highest of functioning" individuals ("highest-functioning" is a misnomer when people equate looking "normal" to "high-functioning", but I'm using it in this case).

If you know what to look for, it's as clear as day; if you don't, it's why people with AS are seen as odd, eccentric, different, etcetera.

This is going by my personal experience.

I agree.

I can get away with appearing reasonably normal but my autistic traits start to show pretty quickly in small things like little hesitations in replying to things whilst I sort out things in my head.

ye, I think maybe you can see it or maybe not. But some (read:most) people on this site is "AS-wannabes"......hahahah.....

"ye, I think maybe you can see it or maybe not. But some (read:most) people on this site is "AS-wannabes"......hahahah....."

You mean--like yourself? I see you don't have a formal diagnosis.

Why in g's name would someone WANT to be on the spectrum. It has its pluses, sure, but as I've observed in my son, it is very difficult in so many other ways. He appears so normal and itsn't always understood. I'm on the edge of my seat with him--all the time.

I think whoever thinks it's a trend, a cool thing to be, is not truly on the spectrum. For those that have autism it's part of who they are and how they think. Fitting in, I see, is the biggest obstacle. My son's visual recall is also proving to be a problem as is his repetitive thought pattern.

I think I was classified as 'classic autistic' when I was a kid. I did not socialize at all, I would run around flapping my arms as if I was trying to fly away, and I made noises rather then speak, even though I was able to talk.

As I got older, the stimming and noise making became less evident, but I rather be in my own world because it felt much safer, I loved spending time in my closet with my cat and I would tell all my troubles to him... mom thought it was creepy and kept bringing me to doctors.... she thought I was sick, but I kept telling her that I just like enclosed spaces.

She never got it. Even to this day.

For me, I am considered a weird freak unless the someone considering knows about autism. Obviousness is linked with awareness, I think. Haha, unless we all walk around in uniform.

why would anyone want to be a "wanna-be"?
that seems so malicious and terrible to say.
I know many people don't understand why i was diagnosed, but i do.
i am very disturbed by this comment.

One of the main things that was noticed by my parents when they searched for help was the fact I started talking at a very young age - First word was Cat, at about 1 years old. Then I just stopped talking. Another was the fact I walked on tiptoe everywhere.

That was very young signs though.

A friend of mine, a daughter of a physciatrist(sp?), didn't recognise me as Aspie when we were close friends(moved apart though now, drifted from my friends, as I always do...). I can be very very normal when I feel like it.

Those were the years I was trying to fit in though...Now I probably would have people noticing I'm very weird, and some how "different" - I don't try and fit in. I'm proud of who I am, and I gave up a while ago on trying to be like everyone else(thanks to another forum I went on that gave me confidence. =) ).

...I went kinda offtopic again. Ah well.

Answer to OP: Yes, you can have AS without it being that apparant. It's as apparant as you make it, when you have a moderate control over it. Depends on the person who recognises, and the person you're trying to recognise AS in, whether you'd recognise it instantly.

Another thing to keep in mind is that whether a person passes for non-autistic depends at least as much on what expectations the people around them have, as on how many traits they have.

A person can have a large number of obvious traits, and yet if other people do not conceptualize these traits as "autistic traits," they will find other explanations.

For instance, I can remember a time in my life (right around preteens-early teens) when I:

• Spent large parts of each day sitting in a chair and staring at a blank wall, and often not responding to other people even if they got in my face.
• Carried around many objects with me that I stared at or played with all the time.
• Had obvious periods of being unable to speak, unable to comprehend what people were saying, and/or unable to move (or move quickly).
• Made repetitive noises and nonsense sounds.
• Flipped things in front of my eyes a lot.
• Repeated several specific phrases in various languages (mostly English and Esperanto though, with a few others thrown in at times), over and over.
• Had great difficulty starting conversations with anyone (and when I did, it was usually by repeating obviously out-of-place phrases like the above), but could join in once they were started, and usually consisted of long monologues pulled from books I'd read and such (which really bored people).
• Had some problems with toileting.
• Had problems with self-care.
• Sang, hummed, and whistled more than usual (and would switch from one to another if people got annoyed enough at one, not understanding it was still annoying)
• Walked in an unusual manner (bent forward, no armswing)
• Had meltdowns and shutdowns a fair amount, at seemingly trivial stimuli
• Had unusual emotional reactions or lack of reactions to things, same with unusual sensory reactions or lack of reactions
• Had particular interests that were just about all I could discuss, when I could discuss anything
• Spun in circles, flapped, chased dust particles, and otherwise unusual actions
• Had trouble making friends, and also couldn't tell if someone wasn't a friend a lot of the time
• Was naive and easily taken advantage of
• Took people literally if I could understand them at all
• Often had a very blank face

And, in general, had a huge number of traits that would peg a person as autistic if a person knew what to look for.

But there are a number of curious things about this that happen when people do not know what to look for.

Generally, when people don't understand something, they also don't know they don't understand it. Because a mechanism steps in that gives them ways to understand what is going on around them, even if those ways are totally wrong. So for each thing that I did that was unusual, it fell into a category that was familiar to them. Often the different things fell into different categories. So there is little to no way someone unfamiliar with autism would see all those things and think "Gee, this person is autistic."

I'll provide a list of other possible "slots" something could go into for each trait I mentioned. All of them are ones that I know people did think at various times, because I heard them say it. And I'm using the words they might use, not the words I would use.

Spent large parts of each day sitting in a chair and staring at a blank wall, and often not responding to other people even if they got in my face.

"She is on drugs."

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

"She wants to be different."

"She wants attention."

Carried around many objects with me that I stared at or played with all the time.

"Those objects are actually for the purposes they were intended for (jewelry, tools, etc) and she is just playing with them to pass the time."

"She is on drugs."

"She is idly goofing off."

"She is ret*d."

"She is crazy."

Had obvious periods of being unable to speak, unable to comprehend what people were saying, and/or unable to move (or move quickly).

"She just doesn't feel like talking right now, just like a bunch of other people here are quiet too." (This would not even be noticed consciously at some times, if everyone was quiet then people would assume I was quiet for the same reasons everyone else would.)

"She didn't hear the person talking to her. She was obviously daydreaming or paying attention to someone else."

"She has a hearing impairment."

"She is emotionally overwrought."

"She is on drugs."

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

"She is unaware of her surroundings."

"She is dead."

Made repetitive noises and nonsense sounds.

"She is being silly for the fun of it."

"She wants attention."

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

Flipped things in front of my eyes a lot.

"She is on drugs."

"She is being silly for the fun of it."

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

Repeated several specific phrases in various languages (mostly English and Esperanto though, with a few others thrown in at times), over and over.

"She is being silly for the fun of it."

"She is crazy."

"She wants to stand out and be different."

Had great difficulty starting conversations with anyone (and when I did, it was usually by repeating obviously out-of-place phrases like the above), but could join in once they were started, and usually consisted of long monologues pulled from books I'd read and such (which really bored people).

"She is really annoying."

"She is boring."

"She doesn't care about other people, she is selfish."

"She is introverted."

"She is smart."

Had some problems with toileting.

This flat-out wasn't noticed by most people, but when other kids had this problem they were teased mercilessly.

Had problems with self-care.

"She just doesn't want to do those things."

"She is crazy."

"She is on drugs."

"She is spoiled."

"She just wants people to do things for her." (I really did know a really messed up guy who, for instance, pretended in his girlfriend's presence to be unable to tie his shoes, so that she would do them for him. The rest of the time, he tied his own shoes.)

"She is irresponsible."

"She lacks discipline."

"She is just a little behind, she's still a kid after all."

Sang, hummed, and whistled more than usual (and would switch from one to another if people got annoyed enough at one, not understanding it was still annoying)

"She is annoying."

"She is being silly on purpose."

"She wants attention."

Walked in an unusual manner (bent forward, no armswing)

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

Otherwise, this got commented on a lot but nobody told me why they thought it was, although I was told by one girl "I hate how you bend over like that," in the same voice and she once told me "I hate how you have those marks on your face in a pattern like that."

Had meltdowns and shutdowns a fair amount, at seemingly trivial stimuli.

"She is immature."

"She is crazy."

"She is on drugs."

"She is too sensitive."

Had unusual emotional reactions or lack of reactions to things, same with unusual sensory reactions or lack of reactions

"She is immature."

"She is crazy."

"She is on drugs."

"She is stupid."

"She is too sensitive."

Had particular interests that were just about all I could discuss, when I could discuss anything

"She is boring."

"She is annoying."

"She is smart."

Spun in circles, flapped, chased dust particles, and otherwise unusual actions

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

"She is having fun being silly."

"She is on drugs."

"She wants attention."

"She wants to be different."

"She is stupid."

Had trouble making friends, and also couldn't tell if someone wasn't a friend a lot of the time

"She is just unpopular."

"Why would someone want to be her friend? What a loser."

"She is a loner."

Was naive and easily taken advantage of

"She is immature."

"She is naive."

"She gets what's coming to her for being that stupid."

"What an idiot."

"Wow she looks like someone who would be fun to mess with."

Took people literally if I could understand them at all

"She is just literal like that."

"She is dumb."

"She is being a smart-ass."

"She couldn't possibly have believed that!"

"She is crazy." (Said by someone who told me a "test for schizophrenia" was whether you took something literally.)

Often had a very blank face

"She is dumb."

"She is on drugs."

"You look stuck-on stupid."

"She is crazy."

"She is ret*d."

"She is very serious."

"She is mature."

And, yes, I've heard all of these out loud, or had them described to me by others.

So that's one thing -- even what one would think would be very visible autistic traits, turn invisible the moment people find other explanations in their head for them. And if they are grouping them all into separate groupings, they may never even notice that they're all related.

Another thing that happens is that it's only a very small amount of things necessary to convince people not to notice certain things.

For instance, if a person says "Hello" and a few small other things like that, then even if they don't talk the rest of the day (and even if that's because they can't talk the rest of the day), people will classify them as someone with no speech trouble. If a person is unable to talk, and is walking around doing their own thing, people will often assume they are able to talk, just have no reason to right then.

The problem is that most people do all this classifying unconsciously. They will claim to have seen things they didn't see (they just interpreted them as meaning this) and to have not seen things they did see (they just interpreted them as something else and forgot about it). I remember one time talking to someone who told me that autistic people can only talk about one thing, so I must be really high-functioning. The thing was, I had only ever talked to that person about exactly one thing, so it was their other categorizing reflexes in action.

I have also observed that environment makes an enormous difference.

I saw a lot of kids who did all the same things, objectively, in several settings: Regular school, gifted classes, psych institutions, and special ed.

The thing was, in regular school, and even more so in gifted classes, those things were excused as eccentricities. If people in special ed or psych institutions did the exact same things, for the same reasons they would be considered symptoms of something. Context matters a great deal, and can mask even extreme "symptoms" if it's the right context. And can pathologize even normal behavior as well (it's been studied that if totally "normal" people go into a psych ward their normal traits will be considered pathologies).

Basically, there's a whole lot to what makes something "obvious" or "non-obvious" to someone, and it's not just (possibly not even mostly) how extreme the trait is. There have been many times in my life when I have done, and had trouble with, the exact same things, but the context has determined how these things were interpreted, more than any change in my behavior.

I feel bad only quoting this tiny part of your lengthy and excellent post, but I have to say... LOL!

As for obvious traits... for people who get to know me, it would have to be my obsessions. I think the only trait that people would really notice about me is my poor posture and sometimes strange body language. People see that and they see that I am quiet in group settings, and they tend to think I am just a little awkward and shy. Usually I am not shy, I am either bored and have nothing to say or when I do have something to say, I can't get it out before someone else has moved the conversation on to something else.

I liked making dens and spending time with are cats i also wanted to spend nightime just sitting outside in the dark garden,which my mother would'nt let me do and also said it was strange.I decided that i felt better with cats and more like them and called people humans.Nearly every photograph of me between the ages of 8-12 im holding a cat.

There are a few people I've spoken to and thought "that person has AS". The first way to detect it is seeing how they react to eye contact or whether they look slightly away from me in conversation. Also a reluctance to make any sort of small talk, or a lack of recognisable body language. That said, there are some people I've spoken to who lacked all of these characteristic traits yet still were diagnosed with AS. So I can't say I have it 100% down.