Unemotionality Inherently Selfish?

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I was talking to iamlost on #wrongplanet last night, and he had read that Dr. Robert Hare believed psychopaths might not actually be neurologically predisposed to callous behavior but develop an attitude that encourages a closing off of emotions. Because they have emotionally walled themselves off, they can only act selfishly. At least, that's how I understood what iamlost was saying about one of Hare's conjectures.

Anyway, low emotionality is common among aspies in addition to psychopaths. Does that mean we're selfish, or do we have logical principles that can compensate for our lack of emotional connectivity? Is this idea all bunk?

I can't speak for others, but I think I could be seen as selfish because I have a hard time to visualize the needs (be it material or non-material) of others. It's not that I don't want to think about it; I just don't if don't put some effort to it. Other things are just more prominent in my head. Or, on other occasions it has do with logic or seemingly 'asocial' choices. Then the selfishness isn't so much projected by you but by others who need you to be altruistic for their benefit.

So based on my personal experience I'd say yes, without saying that it's a good or a bad feature.

I did say that. It is in the book <u>Without Conscience: The disturbing world of the psychopaths among us</u> by Dr Robert Hare.



Logic has nothing to do with it. And most Aspies are probably not selfish.

Remember, psychopaths don't feel guilt or remorse. Most Aspies do. Low emotionality is not enough to make one a psychopath.

Also, Aspies may not be lacking in empathy but merely in the ability to percieve and/or express it, which is a totally different ballpark altogether.

I don't quite agree with Hare on that point. I've read a couple articles citing research done on true psychopaths who have been shown (I assume postmortem) to have some limbic structural differences.

Of course, I haven't done much reading on all the research out there. But I think it's biological and maybe even damage to the developing brain (my oh-so-typical answer for everything these days, hehe ).

I was saying that we aspies might be unselfish because we compensate for emotion-based altruism (empathy) with logically deduced principles of duty towards others. Of course, some aspies probably are selfish, and much behavior of autistic spectrum disorders is described as "egocentric" or "unempathetic" in the literarure.

What does visualization have to do with other people's needs? I don't see how needs can be visualized, but then again I'm a verbal thinker.

It ssems to me that "selfish" is an ethical category, and ethics (tell me if I'm wrong). emplys intent.My inability
to read other peoples needs sometimes seems to be an inability to read their needs in "real time" or to quickly way consequences and decide how to act.If that was a matter of selfishness, I don't think it would trouble me the way it does...though me dear old mother always told me I was "selfish".Come to think of it,
I also have trouble asserting my own needs (that according to my friends) so no-Idon't think selfish is the right word.

Structual differences aren't the same as organic dyfunction.

And Hare was trying to remind us that psychopath's brains may be different because of their attitudes as they were growing up, rather than the differnces causing those attitudes. The studies are correlational and cannot determine cause and effect,

That could be true, but then I'd have to ask why don't psychopaths have the same principles. They can be just as logical.

The important thing to remember is that logic can be used to justify anything - you still need a sense of morality to judge good and evil. Psychopaths don't have that. I bet most aspies do.

That's just an error because English isn't my first language. What I was trying to say is that I usually don't know about peoples expectations or needs (unless I know that person for a long while of course).

How can anyone truly be deficient of any moral sense? Psychopaths can and do say that something they've done or plan to do is wrong, illegal, or is going to hurt someone. It just doesn't prevent them from doing it. It's really a bit much to think that people who weren't brought up in dark closets could have zero moral sensibility, even psychopaths. Psychopaths just have a twisted attitude to justify their viciousness.

Structural differences aren't absolute evidence of functional abnormalities, but they can certainly be an indicator. Plus, if there's a positive correlation between such structural differences and a common set of behavioral symptoms, it's an even greater indicator of a direct relationship. It's not an absolute, but how often is science ever--especially with the human body?

Everything is structural, even learning. Changes in the relative sizes of brain areas associated with certain parts of the body can occur when the body is trained to do something. There can also be addition of new neurons to parts of the brain where they are in high demand. Hence, differences in the brain structure of psychopaths could have been caused by learning as well as by just being born that way, being born with a sensitivity to environmental damage independent of learning, or suffering environmental damage independent of innate sensitivity.

I believe everyone is selfish, they just develop the pleasure in doing things for others and making others happy. It is like liking strawberries, it is just pleasing to their senses. Finding pleasure in making others happy is not illogical, it is the same as liking chocolate. And i believe everyone is selfish, they just are selfish in non-selfish appearing ways. I am 100% selfish, i just happen to have many likes that make me appear to be a very nice person. But when i don't care about a persons feelings enough, i will do whatever. And i don't feel guilty about it, because i know that guilt is only a self-damaging emotion. Sometimes i will appear like a sociopath because i dont appear to have any empathy, these are cases when i lack the normal "enjoyment in appreciating the preciousness of life" that is a thing like "liking chocolate" that many NT's normally have. I believe sociopaths just have different tastes in human interaction so their selfishness stands out more than a normal persons. They may have developed this taste because they cannot taste sweetness, but only because of that.

I agree that people are inherently egocentric and do things for others because it gets them something they want or enjoy (whether that's conscious or not).

If we didn't get SOMETHING out of being nice, we wouldn't do it.

Though I've found such a hypothesis isn't a pleasurable thought to most people. But, meh. I don't make the world. I jes' says it as I sees it, babycakes.

I myself never think of the needs of other people, it just doesn't come naturally to me. Sure, every now and then I may avoid a certain situation or place with someone because I know they don't like it, but that's just me being nice. Reading what I read, can someone give me a clear definition of what a psychopath is?