DEBATING with Curebies: Tips and how are my ideas doing

Post Reply New Topic

see this thread:
http://forum.spacebattles.com/showthread.php?t=142330

looking for extra arguments, in case I am doing something that is not too popular, etc.

I am not looking for a 'personal army' or anything like that. I just want to see how you thin the debate is doing?

EDIT: DEBATING, not Arguing...lol forgot the different terms.

Last edited by Warsie on 05 Jan 2009, 12:20 am, edited 2 times in total.

looks like u need a hand wiv these 'normies' I'm joining the forum so i can shame them.

actually I'm doing fine right now. Just try not to be too overzealous. You don't want to prove them right, given one guy called me 'self-indulgent' and some other stuff. Actually most people seem to be cool, be niiice.

Mainly I'm asking for and ideas and better arguments in case I'm not too correct and whatnot, not a personal army or anything like that.

they are so nasty.

I'm not going to argue wiv them i just wanted to ask why the forum went from being about wot they wud do wiv a scientific discovery to being about slandering each other. no offence but there are faults on both sides.

they thought I was trolling them when I said I would destroy a cure. To be fair, they would have been worse, thankfully, except for Cairon most people stayed civil..

but they asked wot u wud do then because u sed u wud destroy the cure they started to slander u and i thought it was unfair its just u seemed to be adding fuel to the fire by arguing back. i know u were just defending urself but thats wot they wanted they are cyber bullies.

If you looks at the post counts of the people attacking, I'd speculate that saying the sky is blue would cause just as much of an argument.

WHY are you spending so much energy (and creativity) to argue about something that doesn't exist? And will NEVER exist.

AS is genetic. AS is brain anatomy. Neither of these is up for grabs.
They can't 'cure' Williams Syndrome, and they can't cure Autism.

Our rallying cry:"Cure hams, not Autism".

I don't see why you would destroy the cure

Maybe let the people who want it have it, but keep this cure the hell away from me? That's the stance I'd take. maybe that's their problem with it. =/

Curbie this, curebie that...

Come to think of it, to destroy a cure for autism if it was developed is pretty selfish. Not only are there the LFA end of the spectrum, but many people with AS and HFA want a cure.

And I do wish people would quit the ''GENOCIDE!!!1''.

Ahh but LFA's can actually improve. I just heard about a LFA 14 month old boy that made improvements in a matter of months.
I don't know where I stand on this whole cure debate. Right now it doesn't exist so it's just giving families false hope. I think the world needs autism. We wouldn't have as many inventors and scientists without it.
As much as I hate how I communicate with other people and sensory issues I like some of the positive traits I get from being autistic.

LFAs will almost inevitably improve. They're people, and people learn. Has anybody around here been following some of the Autism Hub blogs? Some of them are parents with kids who are currently labeled LFA but constantly learning--I have a feeling many of them will be on these forums in another decade or so. It's not like "LFA" is some sort of prison.

I think a lot of the problem with your debate is that your opponents have got an idea of autism that's unrealistic. It's not surprising, because that's all they'll get from the popular media: Autism is always disabling. Autism means a life without friends. Autistics never learn. Autistics need institutional care. Autistics don't have empathy. Autistics can't understand that other people exist and have feelings. Autistics can't work. Autistics can't marry. Autistics can't live on their own. Autistics can't be happy. Most autistics are low-functioning, and low-functioning means a dead-end life. Etc.

All that is getting between you and the others' ideas: They have a mental concept of autism as a crippling, wholly negative, almost psychotic disorder. You have the experience of a life with autism and see that it's more pluses-and-minuses, something you work with, a neutral part of your life. But if you don't get across to them that autism isn't what they think it is, then they will forever be puzzled that you don't want a cure for something that is obviously an entirely bad thing, and you will forever be annoyed that they seem to want to erase a part of your personality.

You're not seeing eye to eye here.

Thanks for linking that thread, its nice to see the other side once in a while.

I get the feeling that somewhere along 2007 autistic people started confusing the word "cure" with the word "abortion". Discussions usually go:

C-I think a cure would be a good thing
A-How can you support abortion of people just cause they are different
C-I'm not talking about abortion i said cure
A-And abortion is bad because of this... and that...
C-Hey why did you change the subject, i'm talking about a cure...
A-And genocide is evil
C-I wasn't talking about genocide, I...
A-And killing people who is different will stop evolution and...
C-nevermind. see ya.

A couple of good lines i found there about whether to publish or keep secret:

The last one is specially important. I so far get the impression that the cure will open the door to new research into what is a personality, what parts come from nature and what from nurture, the relationship between body and mind and temperature and psychological phenomena.

Other lines justifying the publishing of a cure:


And this one about people who think they are autism and curing autism would kill them:

I understand that viewpoint, in that I think some young people can cling to the diagnosis to the point where it embodies their entire identity- problematic like any clique that makes everyone without their group's defining characteristic an "outsider" not worthy of interaction.

But I think the wording is cheap and derogatory, using loaded terms like "disease" and "disorder" to dismiss any positive qualities the group might have.

The whole situation reminds me a lot of the struggles of certain ethnocentric communities in America- the outsiders complain that the minorities are clinging to language/cultural/economic barriers as a means to refuse to be a functioning part of the mainstream society- refusing to recognize any worth in these "barriers," while the communities sometimes fight back by actively segregating themselves to preserve that which makes them different.

It goes both ways- I think autistic communities need to work towards the idea of the successful "double identity" of immigrant communities- recognizing and celebrating their neurodiversity, but also striving to find their place and how they can function within a mostly neurotypical culture.


Also, Warsie- are you an active member of nearly every forum on the internet? I see you posting all over.

I would destroy it because it would be forced on those who do not want a cure-history gives precedent



they brought it up, I simply used that as an example. They decided to test it and..



whether the LFS want to be cured depends



it is a sucessful and factual argument, as I worked on in here
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt86585.html



That's part of it, yeah

Fernando, yes I did try to connect why a 'cure' might entail abortion and killing as large portions of autism are genetic, and that can be determined, etc..



to be fair, it's the mainstream groups in America that originally forced identity politics and all of that. And given how the mainstream isn't too keen on reparations......




lol nao

Had to lol as some people from other sites noticed me, in irc chatrooms or other forums because I mainly use the usernames Warsie and Star Wars Fan

Then again we visit the same sites. Where else have you seen me at?