Dude syndrome seems girlish

Post Reply New Topic

Autism is described as being overly male because of:
1. Logical mind
2. Bad social skills
3. Need to be in control
4. Narrow interests and focus
5. Childishness
It's exagerated male traits and related to male hormones. That's why it's more diagnosed in boys.
So what's with the dislike of sports and hypersensitivity(girly much?)?

But surely these are stereotypes of male and females behaviours and traits...

The characteristics of autism are sometimes referred to as being more stereotypically male, and there are theories regarding the cause - I'm not familiar with anything that proves what you say conclusively if at all. If you pay attention to the other qualities of sensory overload, getting overwhelmed by input and action, tactile sensations, etc... then it's fairly evident where those would come from.


M.

I agree with Marcia, the above attributes are neither male nor female, but just the extent of the attribute in question. Tony Attwood says there are probably just as many female Aspies as male, but they present (their symptoms) differently from boys and they fade into the background more in social situations.

Girlie or GirlyFunction: adjective
Date: 1886
1: girlish
2usually girlie : featuring scantily clothed women <girlie magazines> <girlie show>

Girlish
adjective
Date: 1565
: of, relating to, or having the characteristics of a girl or girlhood


so I think you meant "girlish"

Merle

Would also add that the 'dude' syndrome also occurs in girls and may manifest notably differently, such as (but certainly not in all cases) finding themselves under the 'social protection' of kindhearted, socially adept girls. Reference - attwood. Typing on iPod so cannot elaborate or link.

The idea that not liking sports is "girly" is complete BS, there are reasons people don't like sports. Many of them have had experiences in school and outside of school of all the BS that comes along with 'sports'.

Sports in general are not logical to my mind, given the state of the world. Things that stick in my craw are the ridiculous salaries of sports players and the general stupidity of people who watch sports or go to sports events and pay that ridiculous money to these guys and girls. If we took all the sports fans in the world and put their money towards something genuinely constructive, the world would be a much better place. We pay people who don't add much of anything to the world riduclous sums, and we pay the best scientists and engineers peanuts.

Many people in sports were genetically endowed with the propensity to be good at them given training, i.e. the capacity for sports excellence and interest in sports was there, so the winning and losing aspect of sports has more to do with the characteristics of the persons or people playing that they were born with the capacity with, which is exceedingly dull. You already know why the outcomes of any sports event are already inherent in the characteristics of the persons and the environments at the time they won or lost, if you were able to measure them all.

I also really hate the whole idea of the public spectacle and competition "winners and losers", the whole mentality of "winners and losers", competitiveness is stupid, primitive and base in and of itself.

Aggressiveness and competitiveness is primitive, someone with a high IQ is not going to be fond of a culture that breeds bullying and looking down on those who "lose", and sports has those aspects in spades. A logical person would simply stay away from things that are complete wastes of time instead and act as a breeding ground and re-enforcer of general stupidity instead of doing something to solve or help with the worlds most pressing problems.

Given the state of the world, I would rather spend my time solving real issues then wasting my time watching or playing sports, I have nothing against sports as games between friends as a past time in and of themselves, but as a commercial industry I find it a cultural breeding ground towards people of mediocre character.

The only really NON-Aspie thing about me is how much I love playing, and how good I am at, sports. But then again, I've been described as the tomboy to end all tomboys, so....

Here's the DSM-IV criteria for autism. I have put the things on your list in bold:

I) A total of six (or more) items from (A), (B), and (C), with at least two from (A), and one each from (B) and (C)

(A) qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:
1. marked impairments in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body posture, and gestures to regulate social interaction
2. failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level
3. a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interests, or achievements with other people, (e.g., by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest to other people)
4. lack of social or emotional reciprocity ( note: in the description, it gives the following as examples: not actively participating in simple social play or games, preferring solitary activities, or involving others in activities only as tools or "mechanical" aids )

(B) qualitative impairments in communication as manifested by at least one of the following:
1. delay in, or total lack of, the development of spoken language (not accompanied by an attempt to compensate through alternative modes of communication such as gesture or mime)
2. in individuals with adequate speech, marked impairment in the ability to initiate or sustain a conversation with others
3. stereotyped and repetitive use of language or idiosyncratic language
4. lack of varied, spontaneous make-believe play or social imitative play appropriate to developmental level

(C) restricted repetitive and stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests and activities, as manifested by at least two of the following:
1. encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus
2. apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals
3. stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g hand or finger flapping or twisting, or complex whole-body movements)
4. persistent preoccupation with parts of objects

(II) Delays or abnormal functioning in at least one of the following areas, with onset prior to age 3 years:

(A) social interaction
(B) language as used in social communication
(C) symbolic or imaginative play

(III) The disturbance is not better accounted for by Rett's Disorder or Childhood Disintegrative Disorder



So, unless I'm missing something, only two of the things on your list are "autistic traits". The DSM criteria for Asperger's is a little different, but not in any significant way relating to this topic.

Sounds like Simon Baron-Cohen's "male brain" theory. I don't know if those are the specific traits he focuses on, but in my skimmings of that theory it does sound like he picks and chooses certain stereotypic traits but not others. I don't know if the debate about his theory is more for or against him these days, though. Personally, I think it's bunk.

generalizations yes

I always wanted to be in control when I was a kid so I was very bossy because I was very inflexible. Everything had to be my way. Other peoples way was wrong. I even wanted them to play with my stuff a certain way.

Define Childishness, I am pictureing child like interests. That would be me then.

Define logical mind, do they mean math or logical as in wanting to know why in everything like why this and why that and need a logical explination to everything or else they won't listen. That was me alright. If you didn't tell me why I couldn't do something, I'd do it anyway.

I seem to fit the whole thing in my childhood. My bf says I still want to be in control so he can tell I would make a good mother. My social skills aren't as bad as they were when I was a kid.

The reason it is diagnosed in men more is because it is easier to see it in men than women. Also it appears different than in men than women. If a boy has AS and is having a hard time socializing with the other kids on the playground his reaction is typically physical which makes people notice, and therefore lead to a diagnosis. However with girls, if we are socially inept at a young age we are quiet, and mothered by the other girls sometimes. This does not bring any attention. I imagine that the teacher is relieved that there is a naturally quiet kid in the room. Therefore that little girl does not get diagnosed since she is not bringing attention to herself.

Also the notion that all guys have to like sports and are insensitive is socially imposed guys like sports and don't show their feelings because they are taught so if they are male. So one big thing with AS is that tacit social rules don't translate well therefore they might not get that message to like sports and to be insensitive.

Sport is a modified form of dancing so the NT guys can hide their not so male brains and still have fun.

I, personally, wouldn't describe any of the above as masculine. I don't really think much of the whole "extreme male brain" thing.
I'm guessing you don't either

I have AS and I love sports, especially baseball. I wouldn't want to be stereotyped as a "nerdy", unathletic bookworm.

I guess with the inherent clumsiness of AS, elementary school boys with AS automatically fall behind when it comes to PeeWee sports and gym class. Being the last picked for dodgeball in the 1st grade is the start of a snowball effect that leads to a gradual building hatred of sports that by the time one enters middle-school, he has completely turned on team sports. Being humiliated by being the last chosen for games in elementary years leaves a mental scar. Even if one becomes interested in athletics later, his peers are too far advanced and wants nothing to do with him for any serious team sports.

With me, I was always decent when it came to fitness and athletics so I did fine in gym class and keeping up with the pack. I played baseball my whole youth and played 4 sports in high-school. My main struggles with AS were in the academic/social realm(eye contact/organinzation/friends/parents/social life.)