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Tomasu
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11 Apr 2009, 3:57 pm

^^ I am very sorry to bother everyone, alas it is but that I am rather worried. I have happily been diagnosed with high functioning autism towards the end of February and the lady was very lovely, alas I believe I am cursed with much worry that this is perhaps an incorrect diagnosis. I believe this is perhaps mostly due to the fact that my parents inform me that I was very sociable as a child, and that they believed I was happily 'different' onwards from when I became approximately fourteen years of age. ^^ I perhaps wondered if I may possess a personality disorder such as Schizoid Personality Disorder as opposed to an autism spectrum disorder, I believe mostly due to the happy age. ^^ Alas, I believe it would certainly be happy to I could but me be myself with no need of a label. May I perhaps please but ask for some happy advice?I am very sorry if I am bothering any individual. Thank you.



Zsazsa
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11 Apr 2009, 4:16 pm

You are smart to be cautious...your parents know you best and can assist in any diagnosis as they know your "history" as a child.
Also, mental illnesses, like Schizophrenia, begin in the late teens and twenties just as young people , like yourself, are making
their mark in the world. Your worry and concern is understandable.

Seek a second opinion, and prehaps a third and fourth, from a trained, licensed mental health professional you trust.

Best of luck to you!



Tomasu
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11 Apr 2009, 4:49 pm

^^ Yaye thank you very much for your help Zsazsa. ^^ I believe enquired with my mother, however she often simply states 'that the happy psychologist lady is an expert and would not diagnose me if not completely certain and often that she wishes not to speak with concerning this matter further. ^^ I have informed my happy father and informs me that this is interesting. ^^ However, the psychologist lady had also referred me to a little neurologist and speech therapist to invesigate further. Thus perhaps any little worries shall be blessed there, and I may have the ability to ask further questions to the happy doctors. ^^ Thank you Zsazsa.



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11 Apr 2009, 5:04 pm

I agree with Zsazsa, get a second opinion.

Whatever your mother may think, the so called "experts" expertise vary from person to person.

Example: it took my father over 20 years before he ran into an expert cardiologist with enough skill to properly diagnose my fathers heart problems, all other doctors thought he were faking it to get painkillers!


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zer0netgain
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11 Apr 2009, 8:36 pm

Tomasu wrote:
I believe this is perhaps mostly due to the fact that my parents inform me that I was very sociable as a child, and that they believed I was happily 'different' onwards from when I became approximately fourteen years of age.


I think you may be putting too much emphasis on this.

A child with AS can be very sociable, but a change of environment can bring different responses. I was never an "outgoing" child, but I seemed to enjoy interacting with others (I still do).

However, kids in school were malicious towards me. I never knew why. In time, I became more and more withdrawn, depressed, a loner. Little of it, in my opinion, was the result of AS. I withdrew from others because of how I was mistreated and rejected by others. I always wanted to socialize and have friends, but nobody seemed to accept me.

The teen years are especially harsh for some. Maybe as little kids AS isn't too bad for some but when the maturation process continues and we can't keep up people start singling us out from the group. We fail to fit in and we become different because we aren't traveling in the same circle as most everyone else.



Tomasu
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12 Apr 2009, 3:25 pm

zer0netgain wrote:

A child with AS can be very sociable, but a change of environment can bring different responses. I was never an "outgoing" child, but I seemed to enjoy interacting with others (I still do).

However, kids in school were malicious towards me. I never knew why. In time, I became more and more withdrawn, depressed, a loner. Little of it, in my opinion, was the result of AS. I withdrew from others because of how I was mistreated and rejected by others.


^^ Yaye I believe this occured to me also. At the age of approximately ten years old, my family and I happily moved to a new house, and thus I changed my little school. I believe it was at that time that I began to notice maliciousness towards my happy self. ^^ I believe I too became more withdrawn, yet I became very happy. I realised that the other humans mattered not (who were rather nasty) and I could be happy without the silly humans in question who were mean. ^^ I am now very happy believe as I gained a number of various philosophies. However this seems also to happily fit with Schizoid personality disorder. ^^ I believe my brain feels very squishy for my obsessive thinking on this subject and believe that a second opinion would be happy for me. ^^ Thank you for your help everyone.



TPE2
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12 Apr 2009, 5:13 pm

Some time ago, I wrote a post arguing that the diagnosis of Schizoid PD should have priority over the diagnosis of AS. I imagine that the same logic applyies to HFA:

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt86907.html

Quote:
Another reason for rediagnosing Aspies-with-schizoid-symptons as Schizoids is because the psychiatric diagnosis are made with some purpose: to decide what is the best intervention. Well, I think that the adequate intervention for Aspies-with-schizoid-symptons is the more or less the same that for Schizoids: basically, a “leave him alone!” approach, and, in school age, perhaps to try to put them in small classes, and with many schizoids in the same class (for two reasons: to reduce bullying; and because sometimes schizoids like to have ONE friend).

In contrast, for Aspies-without-schizoids-symptoms, perhaps things like classes of “communication” or “social skills”, watching juvenile “soap operas” etc. (the kind of things that Tony Attwood recommends when he gives lectures to associations of parents of aspies) could be useful (for an Aspie-with-schizoid-symptons, probably this kind of thing is useless: he will consider these as “brainwashing” and will refuse to pay attention).



ToughDiamond
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12 Apr 2009, 6:11 pm

Have you tried a self-diagnosis using the Aspie Quiz or AQ questionnaires?

I don't remember much in my childhood that seems autistic until I was about 9 years old, but I don't think I'm schizoid. My first school seems like a good place for children with AS, because they treated us like individuals and everything was very well-ordered and quiet, and the instructions were always very clear. They kept everything the same all the time, they didn't keep changing things. So I did well and nobody saw any problems in me. I liked the children, most of them were very nice.

I don't think I'm schizoid because I'm not emotionally cold (I can't communicate my love very well but it's there waiting to show itself), I can be secretive but also pathologically honest, and I'm often solitary but I don't want to be alone, I can't give up trying to make friends and to keep them. I don''t like hurting people.

So I think it can happen that you have a good sociable childhood and then the autism shows up when you are older.

When I first got my AS test scores and they said I had AS, I couldnt believe it because of my childhood and because I had a good social life when I was about 25 years old - I had found a nice area to live in where most people were very friendly and they accepted me as I was. The other people make a big difference.

I'm also very glad I don't seem to have anything except AS because I don't like tablets, and they always want to give people tablets for everything except AS.



TPE2
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zer0netgain
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13 Apr 2009, 7:20 am

So much for that schizoid test. It said I definitely was one, but it's wrong. I don't associate with people because of what I've been through, not because I don't desire associations.



MONKEY
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13 Apr 2009, 7:23 am

zer0netgain wrote:
Tomasu wrote:
I believe this is perhaps mostly due to the fact that my parents inform me that I was very sociable as a child, and that they believed I was happily 'different' onwards from when I became approximately fourteen years of age.


I think you may be putting too much emphasis on this.

A child with AS can be very sociable, but a change of environment can bring different responses. I was never an "outgoing" child, but I seemed to enjoy interacting with others (I still do).

However, kids in school were malicious towards me. I never knew why. In time, I became more and more withdrawn, depressed, a loner. Little of it, in my opinion, was the result of AS. I withdrew from others because of how I was mistreated and rejected by others. I always wanted to socialize and have friends, but nobody seemed to accept me.

The teen years are especially harsh for some. Maybe as little kids AS isn't too bad for some but when the maturation process continues and we can't keep up people start singling us out from the group. We fail to fit in and we become different because we aren't traveling in the same circle as most everyone else.


i'm going through the exact same thing, I feel like sinse turning about 12 I feel i've got worse socially because there's so much to keep up with


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ToughDiamond
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13 Apr 2009, 7:48 am

I didn't think much to that schizoid test - too binary, I couldn't honestly give a meaningful answer to most of those questions - I answered, but had to fudge the truth nearly every time. There were syntax errors, popup ads, and it failed to score my results at the end.

This is from Wikipedia:

Schizoid personality disorder (SPD) is a personality disorder characterized by a lack of interest in social relationships, a tendency towards a solitary lifestyle, secretiveness, and emotional coldness. SPD is rare compared with other personality disorders. Its prevalence is estimated at less than 1% of the general population.

DSM-IV-TR criteria
The DSM-IV-TR, a widely used manual for diagnosing mental disorders, defines schizoid personality
disorder as:

A. A pervasive pattern of detachment from social relationships and a restricted range of expression of emotions in interpersonal settings, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by four (or more) of the following:
neither desires nor enjoys close relationships, including being part of a family
almost always chooses solitary activities
has little, if any, interest in having sexual experiences with another person
takes pleasure in few, if any, activities
lacks close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives
appears indifferent to the praise or criticism of others
shows emotional coldness, detachment, or flattened affectivity
B. Does not occur exclusively during the course of schizophrenia, a mood disorder with psychotic
features, another psychotic disorder, or a pervasive developmental disorder and is not due to the
direct physiological effects of a general medical condition.
DSM-IV, which is an earlier version of DSM-IV-TR, does say that a person with Schizoid Personality Disorder may feel sensitive to the opinions of others and may even feel lonely but can not do anything about the loneliness due to the disorder.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid



Tomasu
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14 Apr 2009, 4:51 pm

^^ Thank you very much for all of your help everyone. ^^ Thank you for the happy tests also. I scored 37 on the Autism test, yet was rather scared by the Schizoid test as I found many of the questions difficult to answer. They appeared to simply be the diagnostic criteria, yet in question form. ^^ I thank you very much all the same however. I received a letter to confirm an appointment with a happy neurologist today, therefore perhaps a happy little explanation shall be blessed there. ^^ May I please ask, may brain scans show any signs of Schizoid personality disorder? ^^ I am sorry if this is very silly of me. I believe I remember this is the case, however I may be perhaps confused and considering schizophrenia as opposed to the schizoid personality disorder.



ToughDiamond
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14 Apr 2009, 6:08 pm

Just a minute....... :idea:

DSM-IV-TR says that for schizoid personality disorder to be diagnosed, it must "not occur exclusively during the course of......a pervasive developmental disorder...."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid#D ... __criteria

But Asperger syndrome "is one of the autism spectrum disorders (ASD) or pervasive developmental disorders (PDD)....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspergers_ ... sification

Surely that means that nobody with AS can possibly be diagnosed with schizoid personality disorder?
And when I looked at the Schizoid questionnaire, I thought "most of these things are Aspie traits"

Or is there a mistake in my logic??? :?



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14 Apr 2009, 6:55 pm

ToughDiamond wrote:
Just a minute....... :idea:

DSM-IV-TR says that for schizoid personality disorder to be diagnosed, it must "not occur exclusively during the course of......a pervasive developmental disorder...."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid#D ... __criteria

But Asperger syndrome "is one of the autism spectrum disorders (ASD) or pervasive developmental disorders (PDD)....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspergers_ ... sification

Surely that means that nobody with AS can possibly be diagnosed with schizoid personality disorder?


According to the DSM, yes. However, I suspect that an Aspie-with-schizoid-symptoms can be more similar to a Schizoid than to an Aspie-without-schizoid-symptoms (like I said above)


Quote:


And when I looked at the Schizoid questionnaire, I thought "most of these things are Aspie traits"

Or is there a mistake in my logic??? :?


Well, in many ways, AS is little more than SPD+restricted interests, than it is probable that many (most?) people with AS have also the symptoms of SPD. Some years ago, Sula Wolff even proposed a "Schizoid/Asperger Disorder", considering than AS is basically a severe form of SPD



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14 Apr 2009, 7:03 pm

Something about the relation between AS and SPD:

http://books.google.com/books?id=tHzfAKtazywC&pg=PA33