Whether & How to "Out" Myself

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I'm a member of a small group and having the usual social difficulties... facial expressions misread, info statements taken as criticism, conversational timing off... and I'm wondering if it would help or hurt if I told them I had AS?

Should I tell them AS or just say something like "I'm just don't read body language well; if you tell me what's going on, I'll be able to fit in better."

What have people's experiences been with small groups, like book clubs or study groups, and their reaction to finding out about the AS?

Did they make you a group 'project' or a scapegoat?

Well...

I've been wondering this for about 20 years now.


In my case it was pretty disastrous saying up front that I'd been assessed for AS in the past.

People in the group either thought that I was either:

A) Lying

B) Trying to stigmatise myself

C) Only little boys get it.


And the only help I got was being referred to a woman who kept asking:

"How does it make you feel?"

Every five minutes.
No practical solutions or courses of action at all.

Maybe I'm partly alexithymic.
She might just as well have asked:

"How does it make you echolocate?"


She didn't know how to deal with me at all.
It wasn't her fault.


In the future, I'll think I'll go for the second option on the poll (but only if things get really desperate). The no label and specific issues strategy. At least then perhaps the more sympathetic folks can understand without being blinded by the label.

Or the social dyslexia analogy.

Or keep my mouth tightly shut because they might think I'm deliberately making excuses to upset them.

I suppose it depends on the situation, country and person you're talking to.

I've found it does more harm than anything useful. Spending my time on studying human communication was entirely more productive. But I guess it could depend on the situation - if these people are people you're going to have to work with on an ongoing basis, you might mention that you have some difficulties with communication and so people need to be very clear and direct in their speech. Most people, I've found, simply can't do it - they do what they do, having learned it at a very early age, without even realizing they are doing it. So they aren't aware enough to check themselves and say, "whoah, s/he's not going to follow that, sorry!" even after you've pointed out that you need for them to be very clear. In my kid's case, she specifically mentioned verbally and in writing to a supervisor that she needed very clear, precise communications. The supervisor found that to be an annoyance, extra work for her (the supervisor), that it was more trouble than it was worth, and the kid is now unemployed again.

A lot of it depends on how impaired the person is, too.

If you can 'mask' 80%+ of your AS, then continue to do so.

If you can 'mask' 50-79% of your AS, then maybe explain some troublesome symptoms when issues arise, or may arise.

If you can 'mask' less than 50% of your AS, then it might just be better to come clean about it.

Most people are willing to accept that "up to 20%" of un-masked AS without explanation. They'll just pass it off as a quirk. The ones that don't are the hyper-sensitive type, and they pretty much dislike most people anyways.

But any much more than that, and people might start getting confused and possibly a little turned-off. A person who falls into the second category is still doing alright. But they might have some particular scenarios or issues that can't be worked around. In that case, explaining selective symptoms might be in their best interest. Giving people a "heads-up" on one or two things might make things a bit smoother. But disclosing the entire thing might give people a wrong impression of the person's limitations, and could just make things more awkward.

If a person can't really hide their AS very well at all, then there are bound to be mis-understandings on a frequent basis with other people. In that case, it might just be better to put a label on it. This approach isn't guaranteed to work though. I only say to try it, because once you appear more overtly AS than you can cover, it's kind of a "nothing more to lose" situation. You're going to alienate people, regardless of whether or not you label yourself. Might as well try to disclose, because youmight find some half-decent people that are willing to understand.

I think I probably mask about 75% of the AS... just can't do the 'office politics' thing, am completely clueless when I've just put my foot in it big time and utterly offended someone or have no idea someone is having a bad day/week, until they bite my head off.

If someone tells me, I know how to express regret, compassion, or straighten out misunderstandings. It's the NT assumption that everyone 'knows' that really seems to be biting me in the backside.

I had a sense that labeling it would be a mistake...

Well, this post will be like walking on eggshells...

Animals react one way when confronted with weakness. It will trigger their primal desire to shun the weak "Our pack member is limping, we should either kill it or leave it on the outside of the group when predators attack the herd" or "Hmm, that runt of the litter isn't getting enough milk. Well, he'll make good food later". DISCLAIMER: I describe this in terms of behavior and do not ascribe cognition to said animals. No intent is made to offend the religious and imply humans are animals. For the purposes of this post, I reference the fact that we are animals in the 'scientific classification' sense.

Some human adults (typically the very intelligent) have sufficiently mastered themselves to be able to accept you, but kids' treatment of other kids, for example, is very close to this baseline (this very "base" line). Do not tell anyone of your age group if you are Jr. High or lower. Be wary, even in high school.

Also, "coming out" runs the risk of becoming a social crutch. If, rather than striving to fit in, you are simply accepted (along with the "defective" brand) as a marginal group member you risk never learning to blend in to society as a whole (if this is important to you (and it is if you care about telling people or not)). As a child I could not mask myself well at all. Now I'm a chameleon. I would have never had the impetus to develop this ability if I just leaned on a disability. DISCLAIMER: This example and this advice applies only if you are wanting to learn. This paragraph does not imply anyone is "defective", but refers to the ingroup social stigma of being accepted by a group, but not having to follow the group's tenets.

BOTTOM LINE: Don't ask, don't tell unless you need something from the social transaction. If your need for companionship is high, you may need to disclose often. If you have a need for government assistance or special programs, you will need to disclose to these people.

Just my opinion, but if you're getting along reasonably well without disclosure, don't do it. If you think disclosure is your last chance not to be fired from a job or cast out of a social group you can try it, but don't expect acceptance. People are much less understanding about this than you would hope.

Over the last year I've tried dropping a few hints to a couple of friends about how draining it is for me to interact in social situations, especially at a party. The reaction I get is often like this: "Well it was a long drive to get there but you can handle the party. That's the fun part." As soon as I hear that I know explaining why the party is so energy draining will not go over well. I think maintaining their illusion of me is less bad than taking a chance of losing the few friends I have.

I'd love to be able to say something like:

"I think it's a trade off.
Perhaps my brain is excellent at paying more attention to details in my physical surroundings.
As a result, I probably miss some subtleties of social communication, body language etc.This means that I find I don't know how to join in a social activity, even though I want to.
I can still get the main gist of what you're saying though.
My social comprehension skills seem to decrease with an increase in social group size. This means that I'm generally better at solo and one to one work.


Perhaps, if we could allow for each other's different perceptions and methods of communication, perhaps we could work something out?"


As an analogy that would be like saying something such as:

"I'm clumsy on court, but really want to play basketball with you folks.
I'm brilliant at reading alone though.
I believe that there's a trade-off between my reading ability and my motor coordination skills.
If you could let me read a rule book on court, perhaps I could keep track of the game better? If you could all slow down and try to pass the ball to me and pick it up for me whenever I drop it, that would be great."

The person who says this would be left on the side bench.
This person would be left out because s/he would stop the flow of the game.

I will sometimes tell people I'm suspected if I am with a group and really making a mess of things. It makes for less bad feeling than if I just keep it to myself, as people can be intolerant if you keep misunderstanding things or take everything someone says too literally. If they hear "ASD" they understand.

Lol!

~
Re topic, I dont know what the solutiion is . I have only just told my parents, who barely reacted at all, but then my parents are hardly NT .

It is different when telling proper NTs, they just dont get it. I think that if you are happy to take on the role of educating others then go for it. Someone has to do it.

But then I dont think I would bother. They are going to think I am just as weird whether I tell them or not.

The funny thing about telling people is, some people are absolutely great about it, open to the idea, want to learn more. Others, telling them is not such a good experience.

How does it make you FEEL? Gotta love that question. NOT!

When I was a teenager, our family did some "family counseling" for various reasons. That phrase, "How does it make you feel?" was so ingrained in us all, it was all I heard from the ages of 12-14. I was never able to answer that question, which of course meant that I was a sullen, uncooperative, manipulative teenager who had something to hide. My mother, who is very wise, and who I love dearly, STILL has a tendency to ask that question as soon as I bring up any topic which is the least bit personal.

It makes me FEEL like I want to sit down with a good movie, and Guinness, and a plate of nachos, and not be asked anymore annoying questions.


As far as the original topic goes, I would be careful about disclosure. People generally don't have ANY understanding of ASD's, so whatever you tell them, they will have to try and make sense out of it using what little knowledge they already have. Now...if I had been ridiculed or bullied all my life for certain obvious autistic traits, like hand-flapping or echolalia, then maybe I would feel okay about explaining those things by saying it's a mild form of autism. In my case, I don't think I really have any obviously visible AS traits that can easily be explained that way. It's more subtle and complex than that, and would require an amount of explanation that I don't think I could manage.

Also, I notice that people really don't want to agree with someone who says they have AS. It's kind of like if someone says, "I have trouble fitting into my old pants because I've gotten too fat", and the other person says, "NOooooo!! ! You're not fat!! !! !" It might be a fact that the person is 50 pounds overweight and doesn't fit into their old clothes, but acknowledging that someone is "fat" is too much like insulting them. I think it's sometimes the same with autism. They don't want to "insult" you by agreeing that you might be on the spectrum, so they'll deny it.

Hmmm, I have mixed reaction to this idea. I'm in my early fifties, wasn't diagnosed until late. I did spend a lifetime trying to fit in, but was a bad chameleon most of that time. ViperAspis, I wonder if it doesn't have something to do with the "% range you fall into" as far as whether that lifetime of learning thing applies. However, I don't know that it would have helped me to disclose when I was younger, if I had known. I might well have done so, since I had no sense of what was appropriate to tell people, and that was the primary reason I wasn't able to even get a job until I was in my early twenties, and never succeeded in holding one longer than a couple of years at most (with low public contact jobs).
Nowadays I'm socializing pretty much with women older than me, and I'm finding that the response I get from them when I do tell is either that they're indifferent to it, or they are curious. Now mind you, these are the "eccentric artistic ladies" who live in the building I moved into a few months back, and they pretty much don't give a damn for social convention, anyway, I guess. A few of them have seemingly spectrum characteristics themselves, and one has even said that after what I've told her, she thinks she might have AS herself, and that she is really glad I told her. Another is a woman who will growl at people in the elevator if she doesn't like them, so you know she doesn't care!
At any rate, although I voted yes in the poll, I think I would lean toward saying that age is probably a huge factor. I don't think it would've been advantageous for me to reveal it when I was younger (even though I probably would have anyway). However, because it was pretty much impossible for me to conceal that there was something "profoundly different" about me (I probably fell into that "less than 50%" category back then), I guess my position was probably pretty much "damned if I did and damned if I didn't", since many people at that age may not be (or have been) as likely to be tolerant as when people get older. There's a paradox there: as I've gotten older, I've gotten much better at "putting on the mask" - however, I've also gotten much less tolerant of doing so. I feel that it causes me a lot more stress now, and I'm a lot less stress tolerant, especially since I have developed multiple severe autoimmune disorders (including MS, which is what put me on disability and living in this building). So ultimately, count me as ambivalent (the poll didn't have a box for that, though).

The past two jobs I have gotten I got specifically because I told them about autism during my interview. So, naturally, tell everyone who you would potentially benefit from them knowing.

These are VERY helpful responses... thanks!
I'm over 50 myself, and my life seems to echo Rylee's to some extent... I can wear the mask and pass well enough for day-to-day stuff, but the developing relationships of small groups waylay me.

Especially the hyper-sensitive folks who just seem to troll for anything that will hurt their feelings... and it seems like there's at least one in every group. I have no intention of hurting someone's feelings (usually). But it seems invariably I get painted as the Big Meanie and I'm trying to figure out how to straighten things out....

So again, I'm talking book clubs, church groups, quilting circles, hiking groups... small social groups.

Tips on finessing these situations? How do I let folks know I'm not mean-spirited, just clueless?

I'm a little thrown by the poll only asking about behaviors -- I guess everyone here is pretty much an Aspie and so much higher functioning than I am that the social problems are the only real problems ? My problems are those, but more so the fact I cannot use paper, read paper print, use telephones very well, and pretty much can only communicate in Internet electronic formats by using Dragon NaturallySpeaking (I have a really hard time handwriting or keyboarding.) I always have to disclose my autism because I require these assistive technology accommodations, or there is not way whatsoever I can perform the work I am able to do. I am a savant, and I do have higher functioning in some areas, but I guess much lower in the impaired areas than others here.

I wish I did not have to disclose for employment or for court participation, but if I don't I just cannot do it. I don't usually disclose, however, in plainly informal social or sports or recreational situations that do not need accommodations and not necessarily for informal dating or such. But, for a more serious relationship, that is different.

As far as employment, however, employers don't just get to reject a person with autism because of disclosing a need for extensive accommodations -- they can be sued under the Americans With Disabilities Act, Title I, and sometimes for capped punitive damages, as well. I wish I were like other eher who can work without the need to disclose. We are not all so lucky.

It might help to mention that you have some social issues, but don't hint at a disability. When I must (after a faux pas, for example), I have sometimes used the following: "Gah! Sometimes I just don't pick up on those social cues. I think I spent too much time hanging around the geek set back in high school ." If I respect the person's judgment and want to emulate them I might add, "What should I have done differently?" People tend to accept this and provide assistance in a matter-of-fact manner which helps me to learn a new script for the next time.