Married to man with asperger's and need some help here!

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I'm curious is some event or experience precipitated this new interest.

There are worse obsessions, but as someone else mentioned, Buddhism can have a special appeal.

I had a casual interest in Buddhism for years, but limited to books I would read once. Some thinking there that resonated and such, but not an obsession, and not wanting to become a monk or seek anything.

Then, seemingly out of the blue, Awakening found me. Quite amazing, quite disruptive. A real double edge sword thing. A major perspective shift that helps immensely with many internal AS issues, but can really throw a wrench into the NT machine integration aspects. Some days I will talk openly, others I will not. I usually limited to sites that are about that stuff, and my fiancée Kim. Mostly, something best kept to myself, but it doesn't work that way for me anymore. No "me" to be concerned with image and such (Aspie heaven?). Kim suffers this well enough, angel, but the strain is apparent.

If he is looking for "Enlightenment", he should be warned. Nothing is gained, all is lost (not as dark as it sounds, it's quite wonderful - but not the escapist bliss of Nirvana so many are after. That is seen, but is only a step. Enlightenment is integration of Samsara and Nirvana - seeing that they were never two). If he has glimpse this, or now abides within, there is nothing to do. Once seen, reality can never again be escaped, though to others it may seem that is exactly the case. Cuckoo!!

It is now my new "obsession", but more a new relation to life. Maybe that's just a story and this is just AS in overdrive. Whatever it is, is not optional. I have no interest in becoming some monk or follow some path (and yet, that is much of what I no do). I am not seeking anything at all. No questions remain. I simply enjoy looking for others with similar experiences, traditions that talks of this stuff, etc. I read a lot on this now. The books I had read before and enjoyed, are new again. Some now clearly BS, others describing quite beautifully that which is so hard to convey. I still favor Zen/Cha'an texts, some Advaita, but find the same thing expressed (and more often misrepresented) in a wide range of texts and traditions. It's not in the books or practices.

There is a lot of stuff being peddled out there. New age Westernized and accessorized dharma and such. He needs to be careful not buy into any particular teacher or teaching, as the best they can do is point (some quite beautifully). On the other hand, if one school grabs him, he has no choice. Read how Pema Chodron became a Buddhist and left her children behind (her books are wonderful). You may have to let him go. Maybe totally, maybe just on certain levels. Maybe there is something in all this for you. No way to know. Just be open that things may not be as they appear, and may turn out better than what we thought we wanted. That does not mean put up with things or ignore them.

Anyway, best you don't get the two of us together in person! *L* Might be useful to him, but not the relationship (or maybe it would be, as I might be able to point to a less delusional/exclusionary approach, who knows. Some of the day to day living stuff I am working out myself. No going back, no more ability to "play the games", so I have to find a way to let curiosity take over and to ride the flow, and somehow make a living along the way).

I have a theory that people on the spectrum, being both less into social BS and more capable of intense focus, have an innate advantage in seeing past false self. The ratio of monks on the spectrum is likely higher than the general populace. I have nothing to back that up, it just feels right. Awakening is not something "normal" or "sane" people want, they only think they do. For NTs the cost is simply too high. All they value, all the social artifice, is seen to be empty (roles still played, but player now aware and not believing they are those roles). For someone on the spectrum, less associated with all that, it can be a different deal. A way to simply live authentically.

Anyway, some outside help is likely a good idea. Maybe traditional counseling, but this could backfire too. I would suggest there are ways to let his current obsession drive much of this. His new path can be the process. Work with the flow he is immersed in rather than trying to stop or divert it. Find a local Sangha (Buddhist community) he can be involved with (people? Yuk!) and see how interested he really is. If resources allow, let him go on a retreat. No some new age spa BS in Cali, but a 4am cold floor, bowl of rice, sitting for hours each day immersion (I suspect he would like this suggestion). They can dispel a great many illusions, or at least better define whatever path he thinks he is on. Buddhism at it's core is more a philosophy than a religion, and it strives to end suffering, which is exactly what is needed here. To work though, life must be engaged, which it seems is the problem. Most here can relate at least to that.

To see how crazy I am, I have started a blog at kgrey dot com

Shorter reply: Is the he attempting to reject/escape "householder" roles via some monk fantasy, or genuinely embracing a "monk" role. This is rarely clear at first. It needs to become so.

Either way you may lose him or, to be more accurate, what ever it is that you believe(d) him to be.

Our beliefs/expectations invite disappointment. Keep this in mind as you go forward.

Sometimes people change when they discover something new and profound in their lives. As another replier stated, living the lifestyle of a monk and being married are not two things that can go together. It sounds like you both need to reevaluate the relationship. I don't think any of this has to be specific to ASD. I have seen NT people "find religion" and change profoundly. That happens sometimes. It isn't fair, however, for him to expect you to remain his partner. I imagine that is not just aggravating, but heartbreaking on a lot of levels. Maybe it's time to move on.

You have to remember, the undiagnosed aspie is struggling to fit other peoples analyses around his world. And they don't. Fit, that is.

Buddhism, especially in its more esoteric forms, holds out the chance of more. It's irresistible. In the heart of zen is the possibility that I'm right and they're all just not sufficiently advanced.

Further along the track, of course, god ceases to exist. Reality is everything. What I percieve is all that there is.

And then, around an unexpected bend, god really doesn't exist. And then there's room for diagnosis.

I know this response is late but I was dealing with separation issues with my ex. Thank you starygrrl for your comments, but you are totally wrong on your assumptions of who I am or my life. My now ex partner pursued me knowing that I had two children (aged 8 and 10) at that time. We had one child together which WE decided to have (it takes more than one person to get pregnant). He also has one child from a previous relationship. I understand more than you think I know about being on the spectrum and sensory issues. I loved him and still do even with his struggles. You talked about me being unsympathetic, rotten, cold hearted and not able to raise my own autistic child for whom I would never want to change. I feel really sorry for persons that lean on an ASD diagnosis for behaviours that are unacceptable... ASD or not. I wish you had asked questions first before presuming you know what I am like. My stepsons mother dumped her son (who is also on the spectum and very aggressive) on me and his father. I supported both of them when I could barely support myself and MY sons. I gave my everything I could and even blamed myself for what he was doing. I never asked for anything in return except love and respect (BTW these are basic human needs). I respect you for your views and hold no resentment...but next time you judge another human please direct it in the right direction.

Harsh words from someone demonstrating what the terms "unsympathetic" and "cold hearted" really mean.
I hope the OP doesn't take your hissy fit to heart.

I have been married to my husband for 6 years. This is my 2nd marriage and his 1st. I have two children that I brought into the marriage and made it clear during our dating that I could not have anymore children. I love kids and being around kids. I love to hear them laugh and watch them discover new things. Sorry I am getting off topic, my husband was 36 and I was 33 when we got married. My son was 14 and my daughter 13.

I don't know what information to put in this post so if anyone can help me please just start asking me questions. I am seeing a counselor now and she believes that my husband has Asperger. I just don't understand.... He is now 42 and I'm 39. There is no emotional support and I feel like I'm losing my mind. I am seeing a counselor now because I just can't seem to cope with things anymore. She had me take the humanmetric test to see what my personality is..... I'm ENFP.....my husband also took it he is an ENTJ....... I've has a really hard time over the last two-three years. Both my grandparents passed away within months of each other. My mothers parents. They were the glue. Sorry again off topic.....My son enlisted in the Army at 18 during his senior year of high school and when my daughter graduated she went to college in Texas to be a missionary. This has all happened within the last 3 years. Since 2009... I have had NO emotional support from my husband during these times. Looking back now I can see that is what I needed and didn't know. I just felt like I wasn't strong and I was doing something wrong because I wasn't handling all the stress I was going through. I was crying all the time. I was looking to my husband for comfort and was getting a cold response, and words like I was being to emotional and I needed to just be happy.

When I started seeing this counselor I took her pictures of our wedding so that she could get a feel for our starting relationship and our families. The counselor looked at the pictures and kept saying that my husband was very withdrawn. That he was not open. She pointed people out in the pictures that were very open and then she ask me if I knew what Autism was. I knew a little about it because I had work around kids with it but I had never really dealt with it. She said she believed my husband my have it and she wanted to meet him. She had one meeting with him and I took her a scrape book of him when he was a teenager. She said that she believed that he had Asperger. Which is a "high-functioning" form of Autism. So here I am trying to find as much as I can about Asperger and Autism. I still don't know if I even believe that is what is happening. Or if my husband just doesn't love me. I am not a good writer and I hope there is someone out there that can read this and help me find out the truth.

Firstly, let me introduce myself. I am 60 yrs old. I am about as Neuro Typical as a human can be with fully functioning empathy and sympathy; an abundance of compassion and caring for the human race; and in the middle of a divorce from my High Functioning Autistic but highly intelligent dentist of a husband, having had my self-esteem and self-confidence systematically destroyed during our 12 years of marriage. I have 3 adult children and 2 grandchildren, one of whom is on the spectrum (though unrelated to my husband). I have researched and read on Autism extensively and, notwithstanding the fact that I can't possibly know what it is like to be autistic, I do understand the effects of autism on my husband's ability to socialise, empathise and, dare I say, even function in a marriage.

Secondly, I have no need for this forum . . . . but of course I do, because I am human and because my heart breaks for some of you, admires others, and wants to reach in and pluck most out of your situations. There is one who I would be divorcing as she is the female version of my husband - not having a sufficiently developed (understandably) Theory of Mind to see/feel what it could possibly be like to be on the receiving end of ASD behaviour and therefore making inappropriate comments.

These forums are dangerous for the NT wife/husband/partner - by the time you are at the stage where you are searching desperately for answers and confirmation of your normality and ability to reason; and having plucked up the courage to share your painful experiences; out of the woodwork comes a reply from someone that, speaking from the perspective of being on the Autistic Spectrum, cannot possibly understand where you are coming from and makes mind-bendingly inappropriate comments that actually make you feel worse. Been there and got a wardrobe full of t-shirts .

So why am I bothering to put finger to key now? Because, in my experience, most counsellors do not have enough of an understanding to support those who are involved with someone on the AS. Also, the diagnosis/label of ASD really doesn't matter if you've tried to understand and act, with no chance of positive change. The answers to all of your questions lie within you . . . it's just that you have become so pulled down by the whole experience that you cannot now see clearly enough. I wouldn't mind betting that if you were talking to someone else in your predicament, you would be able to advise them quite successfully on their possible ways forward?

After years of bending backwards, left, right and inside-out to accommodate the distressing effects of your brush with ASD, and having come to realise that not only will your other half never change (well not enough to satisfy your needs that should be being met within the expectations of your marriage/partnership), you now need to do an emotional needs audit on yourself.

Are your emotional needs being met?

Do you feel safe?
Do you have people in your life who are important to you and to whom you are important?
Do you have wider connections?
Are you comfortable with your status in society?
Do you have a sense of competence and achievement?
Do you have a sense of autonomy and control?
How healthily are your attention needs being met?
Are you being 'stretched' by how you live or the work you do?

All of the above questions come from the Human Givens approach to counselling and it would be my advice to find a counsellor from this discipline if you feel you need help from a therapist as they are well trained in autism related effects. No I'm not a counsellor nor anything to do with this organisation, but it was a Humans Givens counsellor that recognised the possibility of an ASD in my husband and put me on the path to recovery.

The absence of any one or more of the above needs being met can have serious effects on the mental health of a NT person, whether or not they are married to someone on the AS.

So what's the solution? Far be it from me to advocate separation or divorce - there are NT people out there that do survive quite well and are actually happy in the 'mixed marriage.' But, I would say, more than anything, be honest with yourself. Try to remember the person you used to be and evaluate how much you have changed - if it's for the worse then perhaps it's time to step away, for your own sake and perhaps that of your children's. My own children have suffered in this marriage of mine - they watched their beloved mother change from the happy-go-lucky confident and successful business woman that brought them up, to a down-trodden shadow too afraid to voice her own feelings for fear they would not be worth listening to. Even my grandchildren have been affected. My husband decided that my granddaughter (just 9yrs old at the time) should do the washing up on our boat (I wasn't present, I might add). She was expected to and forced to put her hands into water that had come straight from the boats boiler - yes blisters and absolute distress. My daughter rightfully engaged Social Services. I could tell you so much more.

If you are NT and would like to PM me, then please do. I will support you every which way I can. I am in the process of building a website which will be linked to The National Autistic Society in the UK. It will be just for information and help but at the moment there doesn't seem to be anything out there anywhere that supports us, or even gives us statistics/information. Either way the website won't be commercial and I will not be gaining monetarily from it, but I am hoping that the powers that be will recognise that of all of those adults on the AS, some will be married, and of those NT partners a large percentage will not be thriving.

Hi,

With all due respect, I would like to respond to the above quote from the previous post:

Wow. "Dangerous" is a pretty strong word.

I have AS, late diagnosis. I have spent my life "searching desperately for answers and confirmation" that I am a person of worth, not broken, defective, a reject, and all the other labels I have carried. I have have been the target and recipient of both bullying and domestic violence. My self-esteem is entirely trashed. I am reminded all the time that I am "in the minority", I try desperately to "fit" into the "normal paradigms" which has taken a serious toll on my health. I am used to disappointing people because, try as I might: I can't get it "right." I did not ask to be born into this world as I am, I did not enter into a relationship with any intent what-so-ever to cause anyone pain or distress. I am coping as best I can. I need to have somewhere that I can safely express the pain legitimately that I legitimately have, the experiences that only other AS people can understand in a world where we - again - are the minority. Wrong Planet is open to everyone, but I believe is it first and foremost a "safe haven" for people on the AS spectrum, people with other neuro-atypical modes of being, and people who generally just 'do not fit in.' I think it unreasonable to expect that non-AS spouses who post here will not receive some feedback that does not empathize with their situation - though I am not excusing downright nastiness. I have not read the thread provided as an example via the link above, but I think it a provocative and angry act to provide the link. I really get an "us versus" them feel out of the post, whether intended or not. I feel that there should be a safe place for non-AS spouses to discuss their experiences, I am not denying that - and I believe there are sites devoted exclusively to non-AS spouses. Or maybe an exclusively non-AS spouse locked forum could be provided here?

Further, I find the following quote condescending and inappropriate - quite provocative, in my opinion (ad hominen in bold):

" Secondly, I have no need for this forum . . . . but of course I do, because I am human and because my heart breaks for some of you, admires others, and wants to reach in and pluck most out of your situations. There is one who I would be divorcing as she is the female version of my husband - not having a sufficiently developed (understandably) Theory of Mind to see/feel what it could possibly be like to be on the receiving end of ASD behaviour and therefore making inappropriate comments."

Thank You, LM

Last edited by Logicalmom on 27 Feb 2013, 6:53 pm, edited 6 times in total.

i feel for you and i understand what you are going through. Me and my hb have been together 8 yrs our son together is 5 and was diagnosed pdd-nos last yr. I also suspect that my hubby has ASD because of his behavior sound alot like yours and i go through the same thing! i also have a 12yr old daughter that takes the brunt of his frustrations alot as do i he also has 2 children from a former marriage that do not live with us and we only see them every couple of years but i suspect they to have ASD. Any way i understand the way you feel, i got on this site to looking for answers because of my suspicions. I know the feeling you are going through... you feel like you are always trying to be a buffer between him and the kids to protect them and that no one understands..... My hb loves our children but i do realize now he has a hard time handling them unless he is in "Good" mode. He use to be very harsh on my daughter grounding her for weeks at a time for the most insignificant things...screaming, yelling, calling her names or me , still does sometime but over the years i have talk till i was blue in the face. And in the last 2 yrs he has made a conscious effort to change the way he treats my daughter. and he has gotten to the point where 75% of the time he can step back breath gather his thought and TALK with her about situations.she also has learned to kind of read him and his attitudes and knows when to stay away and when to engage him! And in turn there relationship has Gotten way better and closer and he realizes this. It doesn't work all the time there are moments that he does just go off and meltdown and flip. but it is better for my daughter now then it was 2 yrs ago, the problem i have now is my son, the older he is getting the more traits are coming out he is hyperactive and loud and my hb is having a hard time dealing, but again he is consciously trying to control it...... i have been there it is HARD, that is why i'm here also trying to understand, I don't think the obstacles in the relationship will ever go away, it is a choice you have to make and if they are really wanting to stay in the relationship they to i think must make a conscious effort to alter there reactions with your help of course or whatever helps them! We have almost separated several times, but we always "work" through it. Will i be able to do this dance forever i am unsure will he i don't know, but right now we are trying but whats more HE is trying. I wish you good luck in your situation!

I don't think it was intended as a us versus them thing, i think she just understands that references/ info/ sites like this are limited, and even more limited for the love one of people with ASD.....I agree fully there should be a spot that non-AS partners could talk about how they can deal with the issues at hand, and maybe get info and insite from people with ASD that may help us help them. If there are sites devoted exclusively to Nt spouses then they are hard to find and if you know of some it might be helpful to post them or for the site to post them.

sorry double posted!

Last edited by Nat1980 on 27 Feb 2013, 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Well, I can't speak for why he's treating you the way he is, but what's wrong with him talking about enlightenment and exploring Buddhism? Also, people change. They don't maintain the same interests for their entire lives. Maybe he's sick and tired of the old paradigms and concentrating on material BS and wants to see this world change for the better in the same way. Maybe the things you're interested in remind him of the old BS he wants to get rid of, and maybe that disgusts him, as I imagine the old paradigm does. I can relate to this extremely well. In fact, I've felt that way most of my life. Perhaps you could try to look into it or show some interest in it.

I don't know how you've reacted directly toward him in response to the things he's talking about lately. Maybe you acted uninterested, and it hurt his feelings because this is obviously something important to him. That could explain why he's become distant.

I don't agree with getting professional help. I think you just need to talk to him(and by talk to him, I mean listen to what he has to say too).

This hardly sounds like abuse to me. I was abused growing up, and getting yelled and cursed at was the least of my problems... No, it's not nice or right, but I wouldn't necessarily call it abuse... ANY person whose buttons you continue to push is going to snap at some point and do/say things they normally wouldn't do or say. This is no different. And if I kept telling a child to leave me alone, and he/she continued to try and crawl on top of me, I'd be pushing him/her off of me too. Just because he's a parent doesn't mean he has no right to have time to himself away from the kids or that he should be their human friggin' jungle gym.

Okay, so someone said something along the lines of, "blah, you can't possibly know what it's like to be NT and deal with an aspie!"

Okay... That's a true statement, but what's your point? An NT can't possibly know what it's like on the other end either. I'm sure some people out there who are diagnosed use their diagnosis as an excuse to be an as*hole, and that's not right, but a lot of times it seems like you NTs assume that's the way it is with EVERYTHING. Like we just do s**t to piss you off purposely all the time and then use our AS as an excuse, when that isn't even remotely true.

And you know what? We've been treated like s**t our entire lives by almost everyone we've met. Nothing we do is ever good enough, or so it seems... Sorry, I'm not very sympathetic in this whole thing because I know what it's like to be on the side that you don't. You say you understand that your AS partner will be different, but do you really? When you sit there and complain about him not changing very core AS symptoms, you show that you clearly do NOT understand.

Thank you, but I reread the post I quoted and I disagree with you - I stand by my assertion.

A Google search is all that is required to find appropriate resources:

http://forums.delphiforums.com/n/main.a ... 2010979838

http://aspiepartners.com/

http://aspartners.org/

http://faaas.org/

http://aspergerssupport.org.uk/

http://www.aane.org/about_asperger_synd ... tners.html

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Support-f ... 3169059829

http://spouses-with-aspergers-syndrome.meetup.com/