When is joking NOT joking?

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Not long ago, I was in a meeting and misunderstood some things that were said and when I tried to get caught up, someone said to me "get with the program, b***h!"

When I took exception to being referred to as a "b***h", the person claimed they were "only joking". I failed to see the humor in it. To me, for someone to try and excuse rude and boorish behavior by claiming that they were "only joking" does not fly. Rude and boorish is rude and boorish, no matter if the person somehow thought they were being funny.

So my question is ... when is joking NOT joking to you?

Last edited by CaroleTucson on 13 Aug 2009, 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Generally, if I've had a chance to get to know someone and know how they are, I'm likely to give someone the benefit of a doubt with these things. Colorful language like that only bothers me if I think they really mean it as an insult. I guess I'm self centered in that regard: I can listen to anything except someone saying I'm not great.

Welll...I can understand your taking offense to the word coming from someone you may not know well. Within a close-knit group of friends it might have a lot less sting behind it and be considered a joke, but it is quite rude to throw at a stranger who doesn't know you well enough to tell if you're joking or not.

Of course, culture dictates acceptability. In the UK, he might have called you a bloody c**t and been joking - here that word is a filth bomb and a horrible insult under any circumstances.

Oddly, while 'b*tch' is still technically an insult in most usage, it has within the last twenty years come to have different meanings depending on context - (almost all but the original animal breeder's term insulting), but not all to be taken literally or seriously.

Since I swear like a sailor without even thinking, I'm a little on the fence, but in your specific case, I have to agree it was inappropriate and rude. Slap the f**ker's face.

Oh yes - the original question - I think if a person tosses out something that may be interpreted as an insult, they do so at their own risk, both socially and physically. They need to ask themselves 'Am I willing to get punched in the nose for this remark?'

But - when the things a person says begin to wander across the fine line from gentle tease into personal ridicule, they've just become an @sshole.

You said this was in a meeting? Like a business meeting???

If so, I think it was extremely unprofessional and rude. I'm afraid I don't have a very good sense of humor. I don't find insulting another person to be funny - ever.

No, that wasn't funny, I don't care how well you know the person. Anyone I knew well who referred to me like that would quickly find themselves to be an ex-acquaintance. And if this was done in a business setting, I'd say you have good reason to file a complaint against them with their supervisor. It was extremely unprofessional and unbusinesslike behavior and should never be tolerated. Even if this is how they speak to their friends -- yikes! cringe -- what are they going to do when they have a slip of the tongue in front of a client?

I agree with studentM, if the meeting was formal at all, calling you a b***h is grossly innapropriate.

Even if the situation was casual and the name was in jest, I would still consider it very insulting- at the least, over-familiar. Next time, glare daggers at them and say; 'excuse me, but I am *not* your b***h'

Sorta. It's a non-profit association.



Me either. I always thought Don Rickles-type "humor" was grotesque and decidedly not funny.



The supervisor was present, thankfully. I think there are going to be consequences.



I don't think the person consciously intended it as an insult. It wasn't said in a vicious sort of way. Nonetheless, they knew that it at least had the potential for being taken that way, thus their insistence that it was a "joke".

The point is that the fact that you're "joking" is not necessarily an adequate excuse for being insulting. This is context-sensitive, of course, as you point out. I guess that's also saying that humor itself is context-sensitive, but that's nothing new.

Be that as it may, I believe that if you insult someone, it is incumbent on you to make it right, and not try and pass it off under of the pretext that you were joking.

"Sorry Mr. President ... I was only joking when I gave you the finger and mooned you." That doesn't cut it.

From what you describe, I'm thinking this was a case of bad-judgment on that woman's part.

At first I was horrified that someone would call you "b***h" in a meeting, and as I thought about it, I decided that even the "get with the program" sounded a bit unprofessional and out of line. But the more I thought about it, the more I imagined someone saying it playfully, as if they were putting themselves in a some kind of character role. I'm trying to think of an example, but the only one that comes to mind is kind of dumb. Imagine you are at this meeting and trying to decide who is going to be responsible for which tasks. You and another person both want the same job. So she/he does her/his best John Wayne impersonation and says, "There ain't room in this town fer the both of us." If you are familiar with John Wayne, and the impersonation was good enough, then you can see the playful humor in it (or could if it were a better example). If you aren't familiar with John Wayne, or the impersonation is unrecognizable, then you might wonder why the person suddenly said this weird, strangely unkind thing.


I do things like that sometimes. For instance, the other day, my husband offered me a taste of something he was eating. I took a bite and said, "Mmmmmm, now that IS a tasty burger!", in the style of Samuel L. Jackson's character from "Pulp Fiction." It wasn't a burger at all, but my husband and I like quoting movies at each other, and it seemed appropriate. If I had said it in a different context, around people who didn't know me well and hadn't seen that movie several times, then it would have been just plain weird. Maybe the "Get with the program, b***h" comment was something like that, perhaps? I can't remember any specific examples, but I'm sure I've offended people with my remarks, when I thought a certain type of humor was appropriate (because it was in my head, so certainly other people would get it), and it wasn't.

I often wonder if people use "joking" as a way to get out of what they realize was a poor choice of words or a reaction they were not expecting to their choice of words. It sometimes seems to me that people say what they mean, then add "joking" or "kidding" (think of Richard Fish in the TV series "Ally McBeal") so they can get away with it.

I consciously record and remember such incidents and reduce my appraisal of a person accordingly when such things happen. Of course, I would include context but I'm a poor judge of context.

I am unsure of where it derives from, but “get with the program b***h” is a popular (although now slightly dated and fallen from common use) meme. It’s a humorous catch phrase that popped up from some widely distributed media (perhaps a movie or something), kind of like that line from the Terminator II movie, or Mr T (from the A team)’s catchphrase (“I pity the fool”) that people spouted out as humor for a while. It’s like the NT version of echolalia, only more widely distributed (at large in the populace rather than idiosyncratic to an individual).

The most likely reason for this kind of irreverent humor in this circumstance, is to smooth things over socially for the benefit of the person who is in the position of not having understood.

Ik houd niet van sexiste praatjes.

OK, Pandd said something really important: that it is a catch phrase, and probably wasn't intended to be disrespectful. But it was completely inappropriate in a business setting. Lene's response (excuse me, but I am *not* your b***h), is the perfect response, because it is also a catch phrase, so it isn't 'over-reacting', or 'not having a sense of humor'. But I certainly wouldn't have been clever enough to come up with that on the spot. Maybe 2 days later.

Regardless of the persons intent, that sort of language has to be corrected. I have friends (gay and straight) who use 'b***h' in phrases, mostly about other guys. It comes from hip-hop, but it's not acceptable. No matter what the person was thinking, saying it is sexist and dehumanising.

It's like using the N word, or telling me not to be such a fag.

Ik houd niet van sexiste praatjes.

OK, Pandd said something really important: that it is a catch phrase, and probably wasn't intended to be disrespectful. But it was completely inappropriate in a business setting. Lene's response (excuse me, but I am *not* your b***h), is the perfect response, because it is also a catch phrase, so it isn't 'over-reacting', or 'not having a sense of humor'. But I certainly wouldn't have been clever enough to come up with that on the spot. Maybe 2 days later.

Regardless of the persons intent, that sort of language has to be corrected. I have friends (gay and straight) who use 'b***h' in phrases, mostly about other guys. It comes from hip-hop, but it's not acceptable. No matter what the person was thinking, saying it is sexist and dehumanising.

It's like using the N word, or telling me not to be such a fag.

Many many NT's are really nasty. They will say things with double meanings to put you down.

The proper response would be to punch them on the nose but then they would "win".

"Hey, I was only kidding. Can't you take a joke"?

That was totally inappropriate! A person would have to have known you for a hundred years to say that to you, say, at a ball game but never, ever in the workplace. How would that person feel if you had abruptly back-handed them across the teeth? There has to be a boundary of conduct. Words hurt just as much as a back-hand across the chops.

Hey Pandd, you're neat!

People almost never joke except with their closest friends.

Many really nasty people say really nasty and cutting things.
If you complain then they will say "Hey I was only joking". "Can't you take a joke?"

Well perhaps what you should do is break their nose with a right cross.

But that will make you look like the "bad guy" while they are the "innocent victim".

"Hey, I was only kidding"