Is Aspergers the 'anti-charisma' disorder?

Post Reply New Topic

IMO "reasonable accommodations" in this case would be: administration recognizes that they are mistaking your AS for lack of enthusiasm.

I can't believe this .. there is no legal protection for people being fired for having AS???

anyone else know if this is really true??

that's terrible .. i hope you figure something out. have you asked a lawyer?

Charisma . . . there's a word with a funny history.

Does AS make it impossible for you to found a cult? Yeah. It takes a lot of empathy to fake your way into a horde of teenage virgin brides. Or living deep in rural Utah. That's what charismatics do, right?

Charisma is for douchebags. AS is for raw awesomeness. Charisma is for the coyote with a rocket strapped to his back. AS is for the analyst who identified the emerging market in selling out-dated military munitions to coyotes.

In conclusion: Other people pay attention when I speak and that's pretty awesome. The fact that I do it without hollering, hitting on chicks, pretending to be James Bond or claiming I can talk to God is doubleplus awesome.

this is my favorite post today.

I concur

^ That says it all right there.

Heh. Great post MrEGuy. (I still wouldn't mind a virgin cult)

Well, thanks to diagnosis, time spent here, sessions with a specialist and Tony Attwood's book I have become more at peace with being an aspie. I have come to a few realisations as a result.

As you can tell by my starting this thread the objection that NT's seem to take towards many aspies has been problematic for me, undermining my self esteem and creating anxiety, physical fear and depression. However I somehow feel that I am now beyond that. MrEGuy hit the nails squarely on the head and I will only slightly elaborate.

Charisma is often the veneer of fake insincere manipulative people, it is the blandness of the dull and attractive, it is the force of the manipulative and it is the cause of so much unhappiness.
Being someone who lacks it, many would put these conclusions down to sour grapes, so be it, there must after all be some element of this in my feelings. However I feel that the freedom I now feel from some need to please, to over compensate for being quirky, pedantic, for 'knowing too much', for remaining aloof of petty bigotries, for being honest and hardworking, etc... makes me happier!
Now I know why I am different I no longer feel confined by NT norms and expectations, it is OK for me to be different, it is in fact possibly a strength in this modern crowded world. I am not so needy that everyone has to conform to my expectations or ideas, as long as some basic social graces are heeded by all I just don't care - no victim no crime.

Thanks to all who have helped by contributing to the various threads that have helped me, and kia kaha to all on their journey.

peace j

Both Red and MrEguy have valid observations. I've read too many self-descriptions here that focus on feelings of being 'stuck on the outside and looking in', to discount the aspie condition as just our imagination. I have a way of sinking to the bottom of a given social pecking order by a process I see happening but don't understand.

On the other hand--Is there a big Phony-Factor in the way "normal" people climb the social ladder? You bethcha! MrEguy--I'm with you on the stinking messes made by so called "charismatics". Somewhere between the charismatic sociopath and honest social skills is where I would like to be.

i mostly agree. the majority of people, who like to be like others & to have others be like them, are often repelled; a lesser proportion, that likes to be different & appreciates difference in others, will sometimes welcome me as another misfit. but i really don't fit in with them either.

it's useful to be reminded, however, by stepping outside the outsiders' ghetto, just how easy it is to become hated.

m.

It's different between online and real life, online I'm the life of the party. I'm told I'm quite friendly, helpful and have a certain quirky charisma in the games I play and on voice chat. I'm the person who tries to make you feel welcome if you're the new guy in the group, the one who tries to laugh off an epically failed strategy with a joke or a quip. At least this is what it seems to be, it's entirely possible that people are saying other things behind my back without me ever finding out, I won't discount that possibility. But amazingly people from games seem to remember me very well and always greet me with a lot of enthusiasm if we haven't played together for a while. Which for me was so weird when it first started happening, the idea that someone A. remembered me in the first place and B. was happy to see me again without it being a setup for some humiliation.

In RL, it takes me a very long time to get to know someone as I'm fully aware and cognizant of the fact that I have severe trust issues - they've just served me so well in avoiding intentional humiliation and/or violence that I find those issues to be more of a common sense safety precaution now rather than actual issues. And I know people who have come to know me seem to be surprised at what I'm really like as opposed to how I appear to be at first. By now people expect the Spanish Inquisition, but humor from someone with Autism they never see coming. Because I can fake it at least initially people mostly aren't sure what to make of me, if they know about the condition they tend to have a more negative initial impression though as they try to fit this overlay of Stereotypical_Autistic_Person over me. If they don't know, they just assume I'm a colossal geek and either file me in the 'not cool enough' category and move on or assume I can can probably fix their computer for free and just go with the flow.

I think we might not be traditionally charismatic, but we're probably more fascinating in the long run. Many politicians are very charismatic, but it's like a glamour, the spell eventually wears off and you see the snake oil salesman underneath. Of the other people with Asperger's I've met they feel more like an iceberg, maybe it seems like there's just a boyish fascination with lighthouses on top, but there's almost always something more below the surface.

On the whole, and from my own personal experience, I would say yes it is anti-charisma. I am a little paranoid about
some things because I for me it is standard that most people won't like me. This is hard for others to understand because
they have not experienced it. I am everyone's second choice, at best, and I am well aware of it.

However, I have more than one aspie child and the more disabled of them I used to find extremely charming when young. So unaffected, open and trusting. I don't think I was the only one who saw it either.

this is very true and puts you off trying again and trying to make friends.
true friends understand you no matter what you are and should help ASPIES continue the conversation by encouraging with complimenting your sentence. but this never happens

I am an aspie and I still find unusual prosody in others an obstacle, but I have found something that really helps me.
I convert what the person is saying, into text in my head, and read it back to myself. Then I respond to the actual words,
because if they had typed those words they usually make *perfect sense.* If I met that person on a forum, I wouldn't
hesitate to talk to them.

I think when I was very young I would have found the odd prosody scary, then later irritating, and now it's just a bit distracting
at first. I must be growing up

I can't apologise to the people I have shied away from in the past, as I never got to know them - all I can do is change my ways now, and believe me, I am motivated, because those people are more likely to accept me in return.

Yeah those sort of paranoid, self esteem deficit people that have regressive tendencies speaking of goals/aspirations they have no objectivity and over generalize a lot. NT's form what is known as a group think and those specifically are called mind guards they patrol and weed out dissent. You see you got to use some stealth with them by speaking very formal and stare at them making stupid faces when ever possible and make hand gestures or gang signs. They are extremely afraid of mimes. Whatever you do never eat with them or lower your guard it is disgusting how apathetic they can be. They crave leadership so jamming such can go a long way spoof who is in charge elect your own officials and skew the statistics and methods much as possible. It makes them go crazy sort of like ants with the scent trails all lost can't function at all. "I am sorry sir I thought mr. good ol' joe blow was in charge he's a regular Einstein that fellow look at him big top dog and all... that's it follow him down the rabbit trail and gtfo my way!"

I don't necessarily approve of censorship but obfuscating things and creating privacy is an entirely different social matter for such jerks that tend to embrace such willful ignorance and confirmation bias. And when they accuse you of being WRONG just say "Darn right I am! I am proud to be an <insert group here>" in particular a very large group they belong to. Embrace a mindset of sadomasochism to keep them redirected.

You see Aspies in such a social dynamic take the place of "devil's advocate" or the "scapegoat" as it is sometimes called but the wonderful thing is you get to pick any role you like and narrate the thing! If you have the senses use them to create psychological suggestions through such narration. "And so after finishing my coffee she stared angrily at me it was a brisk mid morning of April my socks still felt damp from the morning shower and there was a slight smell of cinnamon in the air. She is still staring at me with those green eyes a tall robust woman of maybe 5'8..." You do not have to be a writer at all just point out every sensation your body feels, environmental details, preceding events and possible things that will happen later on the agenda. They respond to speech in a competitive manner so the more you chirp about the better and they perceive this with great superstition. It takes some time to get the hang of doing it right.

I agree with you. It's all about charisma. I've got a cousin of exactly my age, who is lazy, sloppy, rude, ignorant, and has bad intentions (can't hold down a job for more than 5 months, doesn't want to be mature and responsible, doesn't even know how to handle money, all of that sort of thing), but she still has more friends than me and even all my cousins would rather spend time with her at week-ends than with me, and she gets all the boys after her and gets called ''stunning'' and ''beautiful'' - and, despite the fact that she is awkward, lazy, irresponsible and undisciplined, she still has that social knack and charisma, so they still flock round her and think she's the greatest person in the world.

Me, however, I can be much more mature and responsible, willing to cope with adult life, wanting to work and earn my own money, and I am not a lazy or sloppy or rude or ignorant person, and I have good intentions, but my cousins still avoid me because I lack charisma and that I'm ''boring''.

My other cousin has been brainwashed by a control-freak weirdo, and we haven't seen her for years, and she's been so rotton to all of her cousins and is old enough to know that if she went to the police that they would arrest him and she'd be united back with her family with him out of the way, but I know that all of my cousins would still go running upto her if this did happen. If that was me who would rather be with a control-freak sicko than my own loving family, I bet my cousins would wash their hands off me even if I did come back. That's because I was a whiny child growing up, while the cousin who is stuck with the control-freak probably had charisma as a child and so they would rather have her in their company than me.

So hurtful, really.

NT: "What is your plan, then?"
Me: "I really don't have one."
NT: "Oh, well I thought you would be ( doing x,y,z), since that is how I would."
Me: "Our minds work in very different ways."
NT: "Sure, that's great, so, what is your plan?"
Me: "I really don't have one."
NT: "........oh."
----------