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simmerskan
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27 Jun 2009, 12:50 pm

2leftfeet wrote:
It took me many years to realize what a social disability this can be. I think the issue was first broached by my psychological counselors who seemed truly puzzled. I recall one particular counselor pressing the issue by asking what I thought would happen if I looked him in the eye. I honestly did not know. But the sensation was discomforting. This was years ago when AS was hardly known and never diagnosed.

I try to practice holding peoples' gazes for short intervals during conversation. But sometimes I am just not up to this. Or alternatively, if my gaze becomes locked with someone else for very long, a kind of "brain freeze" sets in and I have to get away and reboot. Does anyone else experience this?

I think I have gotten better at eye contact over the years, although I can't be sure. I have reached the age where strangers and casual acquaintances take me less seriously, which is both good and bad.


I don´t think it´s discomforting, and now days social interaction goes on routine. I ´don´t think about so much. But I have friends with Asperger who thinks it´s umcomforting with eye-contact; the say that it´s easier to listen and focus on listening to someone if they don´t have eye-contact with the person they talk to. Is it the same for you?



TiredGeek
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27 Jun 2009, 2:10 pm

simmerskan wrote:
TiredGeek wrote:
I remember hearing from just about every adult, in early childhood, "look me in the eye!! !". Being punished harshly for not doing so, made me get over it pretty quickly, so I can barely remember the time when it bothered me. I still do not do it correctly though, I stare too much, or look away wrongly, etc. At this point though, I don't care, I can fake it for short amounts of time and that is enough for my needs.


I think it´s wrong to force someone to have eye-contact. I don´t remember this, but my mother has told me that I didn´t seek eye-contact as a child. She let it be, and only forced me to eye-contact when we had an argue. And, what I mean with this is that the less coercive and more explanation is the key.


I agree, but I can't help the way I was raised. No one knew about AS then. I think explanations of why I should/shouldn't do things would have been much better, but back then kids were simply punished for aspie things. No one cared why a kid said something rude, or didn't make eye contact. Hopefully young Aspies today will be better off.



simmerskan
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27 Jun 2009, 3:30 pm

TiredGeek wrote:
I agree, but I can't help the way I was raised. No one knew about AS then. I think explanations of why I should/shouldn't do things would have been much better, but back then kids were simply punished for aspie things. No one cared why a kid said something rude, or didn't make eye contact. Hopefully young Aspies today will be better off.


No, no one can help the way they are raised. But I can feel a bit angry over that people, whatever time it may be, just see "bad behaviour" or "beeing rude". Even if people when you grow up didn´t know anything about asperger, I think that some one should have turn perspective and think what could be behind a certain behaviour. Just my thoughts.

Yes, I think it´s in many ways much easier today for people with Asperger, especially they who got their diagnosis in an early age. Than it is much easier to understand and to get good support from the society. And for those who don´t know a thing about Asperger or autism there are so much information you can get from internet or books. These times have open up for understanding.

And it may sound a bitt silly, but I think it´s important to listen to you and about the difficulties older people with Asperger, who grown up in a less understanding time.



Acacia
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27 Jun 2009, 3:39 pm

As I child, I was frequently scolded by my mother for not looking others in the eye. She just thought I was being shy, and then scolded me for that. I can remember the feeling; I just COULD NOT BEAR to look someone in the eye. It felt like looking into an abyss. Frightening, and hugely imposing.

As an adult, I have learned tricks and coping mechanisms that allow me to look others in the eye if I must. However, I always find the experience unsettling, awkward and uncomfortable. I still instinctively avoid the gaze of others, lest I accidentally meet it, and be drawn into a conversation which I am unprepared for. I know that the eye contact I do give is perceived as strange, shifty or dishonest. This has been a real problem when it comes to interpersonal relationships and job interviews.

When in public, one of my best defenses against social obstacles is a big pair of dark sunglasses. 8)


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simmerskan
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27 Jun 2009, 3:54 pm

Acacia wrote:
As I child, I was frequently scolded by my mother for not looking others in the eye. She just thought I was being shy, and then scolded me for that. I can remember the feeling; I just COULD NOT BEAR to look someone in the eye. It felt like looking into an abyss. Frightening, and hugely imposing.

As an adult, I have learned tricks and coping mechanisms that allow me to look others in the eye if I must. However, I always find the experience unsettling, awkward and uncomfortable. I still instinctively avoid the gaze of others, lest I accidentally meet it, and be drawn into a conversation which I am unprepared for. I know that the eye contact I do give is perceived as strange, shifty or dishonest. This has been a real problem when it comes to interpersonal relationships and job interviews.

When in public, one of my best defenses against social obstacles is a big pair of dark sunglasses. 8)


It sounds like the feeling you have led under your childhood was a feeling of an endles chain of missunderstandings. Am I right? And if you are 27, you´re not so much older than me. And still, we have so different experience...



2leftfeet
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28 Jun 2009, 12:24 am

simmerskan wrote:
2leftfeet wrote:
say that it´s easier to listen and focus on listening to someone if they don´t have eye-contact with the person they talk to. Is it the same for you?


Yes, much easier. But I think that once lack of eye contact becomes an issue to the person I'm talking to, it is perceived as abnormal. I then get the impression, rightly or wrongly, that I am taken much less seriously.

My wife tells me that part of my problem is that I "over analyze" my interactions with others. I think she is correct. But it's sometimes hard not to.



simmerskan
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28 Jun 2009, 4:31 pm

2leftfeet wrote:
Yes, much easier. But I think that once lack of eye contact becomes an issue to the person I'm talking to, it is perceived as abnormal. I then get the impression, rightly or wrongly, that I am taken much less seriously.

My wife tells me that part of my problem is that I "over analyze" my interactions with others. I think she is correct. But it's sometimes hard not to.


Yes, I know what you mean, my friends explained it in the same way, actually.

I´ve also been told that I over analyze some social situations. I really don´t know why, I´m quite good at social interaction. But maybe it´s the thing that I don´t want to be missunderstood or totally screw up...Just a qualified guess.


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Thorny_Rose
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02 Jul 2009, 8:03 pm

When I was young, I didn't look anyone in the eye. It's not that it hurts, but it's an intimacy for me, a way of connecting that's too personal to be shared casually, and too intimate to be given to every person I meet. It took years to understand that it's a part of communication, and that many find the lack of eye contact indicative of shiftiness, dishonesty or shyness

As I got older, I forced myself to do it. I'd focus on spot right above the middle juncture of the eyebrow, or a spot a bit near a person's ear...And I cannot say how many times I looked for a handy zit at which to stare! :lol:

My hubby says I occasionally freak NT's out by being too intense in my gaze. Because of my job, that being a cyanid taxonomist/biologist who occasionally has to venture into politics, I'm often described as "assertive", "confident" or "intense".

Horsefeathers. I'm staring at people's receding hairlines or monster pimple.



2leftfeet
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03 Jul 2009, 4:41 am

Thorny_Rose wrote:

Horsefeathers. I'm staring at people's receding hairlines or monster pimple.


Hey, I resemble that remark! :wink:



auntyjack
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22 Jul 2009, 7:46 am

general_piffle wrote:
I'm wondering if making eye-contact and holding it get easier as you get older.


I don't know if it gets easier. I am nearly 60 and I don't intend to put myself through the discomfort of forced eye contact. I am an education consultant and part of a school management team, so it doesn't seem to be a huge disadvantage not to make eye contact. I look at mouths.



NOBS
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02 Aug 2009, 3:52 pm

For me eye contact has the same emotional feel as being raped.



hypernoodle
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03 Aug 2009, 2:02 am

As a few others have said, eye contact is an "intimate" thing.

When speaking to the average person, I've found an interesting alternative that's worked wonders the past couple of years...

I analyze the eyes. What color are they... Are they blue with brown in the middle... are they wearing eye makeup... Are they the same color... Do they sparkle... Are the lines around the eyes indicative of years of smiling or squinting...

that sorta stuff.


When I'm looking at the eyes, it's purely analytical. No "reading" going on, but it more than satisfies their need for eye contact.



azulene
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04 Aug 2009, 7:12 am

I have found it a lot easier recently to look people in the eye when they are talking to me. It's a bit harder for me to concentrate when I'm talking though, so eye contact is not so good then.


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polymathpoolplayer
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23 Aug 2009, 10:57 pm

It has gotten easier for me over time.

When I was a sensitive adolescent I could not look girls in the eye mainly for reasons of fear the girl would not like me back (I being shy and needing the positive reinforcement of her approval, having had a gf who moved away and I always thought I was being rejected but found out later it was not the case).

Also, my Aspie lack of eye contact made my father think I must be responsible for little pranks done at home, when in actuality I was the model citizen who never lied and never cut class. In one such instance he actually "framed" me by doing the prank himself, then blaming it on me me for looking guilty. He was such a bastard...

I now teach music and it has gotten easier because of the teacher-student dynamic I am allowed to be aggressive (more staring is ok), but actually they sit sideways to me in lessons for the most part so there is not a huge lot of eye contact going on, plus half of them are children and I have never had a problem making eye contact with young people (I hear this is an aspie/autie trait).

I also don't usually look very beautiful women in the eye a lot, not for fear of rejection (I have a fine-looking girlfriend and have gotten over my shyness) it's because if I mis-time or hold it too long I am DEAD SURE she can read my gaze as mentally having sex with her (or wanting to)! !! In fact I am convinced that beautiful women instinctively can tell if we look too long into their eyes that we want them that way.



Zincubus
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07 Oct 2009, 3:26 pm

Depends on the distanec betwwen us .

I am ok with eye contact if they are about 4 foot away !



dusanyu
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08 Oct 2009, 2:37 pm

I do make the protracted effort to make eye contact I am so focused on holding that state that I loose track of the conversation. fortunately most people who know me understand that I pay attention better if my eyes are elsewhere than there face.