How can I help my AS husband to understand me & act on i

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My husband usually stays in a constant state of neutrality and movement out of that zone is usually only toward the frustration or anger end and not toward the happy and pleased end. He doesn't get angry very often, but he does stay in a slightly-below-neutrality state for long periods of time when something isn't sitting well with him. It colors everything, he becomes much more introverted and individualistic, his words become even more minimal and negative, he's far less likely to go along with something and more likely to be stern or to complain, but it is all just right under the surface and not usually passive-aggressive, just crabby. But he says he doesn't see it and doesn't have a clue why he'd be grumpy and thinks all is fine most of the time when I bring it up. From what he's said to me, it isn't that he's unable to communicate his feelings to me but that he really is unable to be introspective, to be able to identify and label feelings or thoughts, much less their root causes.

It is therefore extremely difficult for me to understand what's going on or what I can do in the circumstances. And with every circumstance being completely new and him not seeing a pattern of similarities, trying to figure it out on my own is nearly futile. I've tried explaining that I am unhappy, feeling discouraged, and not knowing what to do when he gets this way, but when my husband doesn't see the problem, he doesn't see my problem with the problem, either.

I accept that my husband, like any other person, thinks and feels differently than me, has different interests and frustrations, and receives love in a different way. This was a premise I had of marriage before Asperger's was ever in our vocabulary. So if it is important to my husband that I not go get a store clerk while we're out together and he's too stretched already to handle the stress of the encounter, even though I totally don't get what or why he feels this way, I respect that he does and I don't do it. Instead, I might wait patiently for him, return to the store on my own, go home and look it up online, or any other number of things.

I really don't understand why my husband can't simply accept when I say something about how I experience the world (needing praise in order to feel appreciated and acknowledged and respected and therefore to have feelings of love, for example) and even though he doesn't get why I feel this way, that he doesn't accept that I do and try to show me love in a way I understand. He says he gets it, promises to do it, assures me that he's more than capable of doing what I am asking, then we're right back where we were as if our conversations never happened. I am fine with being blunt and explicit, but it still never materializes. It is so frustrating and I get to feeling hopeless.

So many people say their spouses with Asperger's are blunt and honest, saying what comes to their minds. I wish I had that because then I'd know what is going on and would understand him. My husband does not spontaneously offer any info about himself or his thoughts and when asked about nearly anything but something on the topic of his latest passion, he says he has no opinion. "How's this dress look on me?" isn't likely to get a statement of it not flattering me or how great I look, it will get a slight head wiggle indicating he has no opinion. I have to pull the slightest bit of info out of him, no matter how mundane. I feel like there's no one there!

I've been reading some threads here in which individual posts said things that made me wonder if they might be involved. Someone said he doesn't really store emotional memories, only sensory ones, so most of his memories of homelife are negative since he's in sensory overload. The sensory overload isn't a problem for my husband as I'd say if anything that he notices sensory input less than average, but which memories are stored and accessible was an interesting idea to me. Someone else said he couldn't act on what he doesn't understand and doesn't understand what he hasn't experienced for himself. I accept this, but I don't understand it. My husband has experienced someone giving him love in a way unimportant to him and in a way he can appreciate, so how come he can't get what I'm saying?

I'm hoping to understand first but really only as a means to finding some ideas to try on how to improve this situation. I can't control him or what he does and I accept that. If you have ideas for him, I'll share them. I'm hoping there are some ideas for me, too. How do I break through to him and have him want to understand? Even if he doesn't have the skills now, what made you actually care and begin to learn or try to meet your partner's needs that were different from your own? Any ideas on how to help bring us together or constructive ideas on what might be going on are welcome.

Eliza

I do this with people who have shown me a pattern of hostility and abuse in the face of the honesty I have given them in the past. Some people say they want the truth but become hateful and confrontational when they get it, if it isn't what they wanted to hear. With those individuals, I do shut down and say only what absolutely has to be said. It's like living in a mine field - the safest movement to make is no movement at all.

I do this with people who are judgmental and unkind toward anything that doesn't fit their perfect-world model. There's no pleasing them, short of pasting on a fake smile and constantly ACTING, which I'm not capable of doing. So I internalize everything and keep it to myself. It's not safe sharing personal thoughts, feelings, or other information with someone who will use it as a weapon to verbally abuse you with the next time you displease them by not living up to their demands and expectations.

Hope that gives you some insight.

This is a symptom of alexithymia. Many with AS also have this issue though I don't personally have it. Maybe it would be easier just to ask him what would make him feel better rather than trying to pry into the issue, making him uncomfortable and/or irritated.



Giving praise isn't something that comes natural to people on the spectrum. It isn't always something that's easy to "do" at will as it involves using an appropriate tone of voice and body language. For me this kind of thing has to spring spontaneously from the heart. It's hard to force it without feeling disingenuous.

There's also the executive function issue. If you make very general open-ended requests he's going to have trouble following through on them. Being more specific on the things he could do to make you feel appreciated might help him.

I also think he might be afraid to admit how difficult it is for him if he's worried about your disapproval.



Maybe he actually doesn't have an opinion. Again, if you're forcing him to come up with an opinion on the spot you're forcing him to be disingenuous. How the dress looks on you just isn't important to him. That doesn't mean you're not important to him.



I’m pretty sure it isn't a matter of understanding. He understands. He just doesn't know how to give you what you want. He resists because it makes him uncomfortable.


I can't answer this because I've never been married. Hopefully someone else has some additional insight for you.

That sounded a bit harsh. I get what you're saying though.

Having to act for acquantences at work or for interviews is at least tolerable. Acting in a personal relationship isn't something I'm capable of doing. It feels wrong. No amount of guilt-tripping can make me change who I am and pretending to be something I'm not isn't a viable solution either.

FiveEggsIn, what was the rest of the subject heading supposed to be?

Willard, Thank you for sharing your experience! I don't know if that might be how my husband is feeling. I'll have to see. Considering that he is more forthright with me than with any other, I don't think it is a primary issue going on. The little that I do get is from pulling it out of him, which no one else tries to do, so there might be some resentment. I don't think that he feels like he needs to pretend to be someone he's not as I have never had expectations anywhere close to Casanova and our therapist, skilled in working with those with AS, said my expectations were not unreasonable or unable to be done. My biggest frustration has been that this has become worse over time. The initial phase of him being passionate about me hasn't accounted for all of that. Feeling frustration or stressed for long periods, even though he didn't identify those feelings, could have led to where we are. I will keep your experiences in mind. Thank you!

Marshall, The word alexithymia is new to me and I'm very happy you shared it. It kind of legitimizes my experiences to see that I'm not making it up and it really helps me to understand what's going on. On one side, I feel better because I've been saying that I want to know him, who he is, where he stands, what he thinks, what makes him tick. It isn't only that he isn't letting me in. It is, as I suspected, that he doesn't have anything there to share. It's a new thought to me that I'm already "in" that spot in the center of who he is and that I haven't recognized it because it didn't have any of the identifying signs I expected.

The "story" of his being, of who he is, requires more than he currently has. I think I'd be very sorrowful on the other hand if I didn't concentrate right now on the fact that it can be improved upon through therapy and that those who receive therapy for alexithymia tend to have much better quality of life, less somatic illnesses, and to retain the benefits of the therapy for the long-term. I brought this up with my husband last night and he was in agreement that it described his experiences and was open to therapy. It now makes sense why he doesn't have opinions on so many things and how he could say that everything is fine when I clearly see that it isn't. Thank you!

I don't think my requests are vague, but my questions often are open-ended because I want to know where he stands and not for him to mirror my own feelings back to me. I'll keep in mind how difficult that is for him.

Mysty, it let me enter that amount of letters and no more, so I thought the whole title would appear. I see that a few characters were cut off the end. It originally said "How can I help my AS husband to understand me & act on it?"

It probably becomes worse over time because you have rejected him more and more---even the idea of making him go to therapy (by definition most therapists are the opposite of people with AS) is the ultimate rejection--you are tell him that he is so defective the he needs someone to fix him--all he probably want is to be accepted for who he is, the more you reject him, the more he pulls away. I would 100% leave my spouse if he made me go to therapy--I struggle hard enough to be valid--I don't need two people ganging up on me. Also my NT husband would just look at me with a blank face too if I asked "how does this dress look on me?" (I ask often because I have poor fashion sense)-it is stupid to expect an answer to that question from any man--are you asking is it in style?, Does it make you look fat? Is it appropriate for the event? Can you see too much of my boobs? Is it a good color? If you really want an answer than ask the right question. Also are you sure he has AS--I know three men with AS (for two of these men their wives love them so much that the wives don't know/mind/notice the AS), but I also see a lot of my girlfriends suggesting that their husbands have AS (I guess this have now permeated pop culture) when they are mad at them for acting like men. Just because you are sooo, soooo good at expressing your pain and frustration does not mean that it is greater than his (or that he is the one to blame). How do you think he feels!

I will back at you (and NT partners) with question you asked--- Even if she doesn't have the skills now, what made you actually care and begin to learn or try to meet your partner's needs that were different from your own?

I treat all verbalisations as questions, I have learned that everything a person says is not always a question , but it does not stop me from interpreting it as such..When confronted with a statement of fact 'I am unhappy', 'I wish you could understand that I am having trouble dealing with your way of looking at life' etc etc , my mind immediately looks for a solution, invariably as these were never questions in the first place, no answer can be found, the result of this is a mind stuck for a short duration, I become crabby, grumpy etc, I never knew why in the past, when my wife would press I would look at her blankly, she could clearly see there was something wrong, but she had no way of reaching me. The statements that are interpreted as questions never really get resolved they just get forgotten about, stored up in the mind as an 'X-file'. When these 'x-files' are then brought up in a conversation at a later date I wil be none the clearer thus giving the impression that I don't care, as I never thought about it enough when it was first brought up..



I live in the present moment all the time, it is frustrating for my wife, as I to have made promises to be 'better' more considerate, more affectionate wether the affection evolves into sex or not etc etc...Only to have no memory of the the previous conversation and continue with the behaviours that forced her to bring up the issue in the first place..This continues to this day...As most communications from my wife originate from an emotional place I never remember them, so now I never say I am going to be this or that, or try to be a better this or that, my wife has excepted that I will never change by will alone..However I do keep a diary which I write in every day, this assists greatly as I can see what behaviours cause what reaction, no man likes his wife going on and on, and my diary informs me that on such and such a day I said this, wife reacted like this which pissed me off greatly..I can also see when my wife is being unreasonable, as it all written down , totted etc..I am forever amazed at how emotion warps the perception of things...

Whoah, physicsgirl! You seem to have a lot of projection going on there. I haven't made him go to therapy. It was his idea and I've supported it. It is a medium he feels comfortable with and so it is the framework I work within, at his request. I've never considered the therapy to be for him but for us to learn about each other and how to work together in our marriage, just like any other couple. It was only last night when I read about alexithymia that I even considered that individual therapy might have some benefits for him if he was interested in it. You seem to think that being unable to understand his own emotions or the forces at work within him, being unable to express his desires effectively in our relationship, and being unable to identify when he's feeling happy or sad is who he is and that changing it would somehow be expecting him to be someone he's not or to be less of a man.

If that's what you believe, I wholeheartedly disagree.

My husband has emotions and those emotions affect him and through him, affect me and our family. I can't understand them and neither can he. Learning to identify his emotions would not be changing who he is, but understanding it. He would then be empowered with knowledge to make fully informed decisions in all aspects of his life, including our marriage. From what I've read, which is little so far, the medical literature says that he would likely report a greater happiness in life, better quality of life, improved relationships, and less illness if he learned these skills. Why would I not want that for my husband? Why wouldn't I give him this information to make an informed decision? You seem to think that if I really loved him, I wouldn't notice this or wouldn't care and that I would be happy with him being unempowered within our marriage and his life. I don't understand that reasoning.

If that is your understanding of love, again I wholeheartedly disagree. My husband and I made a marriage contract before God and both of us agreed to do some very explicit things. The definition and purpose of marriage, the responsibility to love or to desire holiness and God's will for each other, and the ultimate obligation to help each other and our children get to heaven through this vocation we both freely and willingly chose is an equal responsibility for both of us. If you aren't familiar with the Catholic understanding of these words or obligations and want to compare them to fundamentalist Protestant, Jewish, secular, etc understandings then I would be happy to provide you with links. Your understanding or opinion of it notwithstanding, my husband understands them, accepts them, and agrees with them. It is through our marriage that he has chosen to work out his salvation and to become the man God desires him to be and to help me to become the woman God wants me to be through our shared yoke. The same is equally true for me. Asperger's does not invalidate that contract or make him unable to fulfill it, but it can make it harder at times. Such is life. We all have our crosses to bear. This happens to be one of ours. I bring my own weaknesses and shortcomings to the table, like my propensity to despair, which I seek support for elsewhere. All of this is to be able to understand each other, have peace in our home, and to raise our children to be the people God intends them to be.

To answer your first question, yes, I am sure my husband has Asperger's. He was definitively diagnosed by a qualified clinician who specializes in the field. There are no qualifiers of him having Asperger's-like traits, him being high-functioning or borderline, or of my suspecting it because I'm mad. He has Asperger's and he was the one who first identified it, not me.

My husband isn't Asperger's anymore than I am mechanically-inept. My husband is a husband and father. That is his identity. He is witty and careful and adventurous. That is his personality. He has hobbies and interests that are his avocations. Addressing his alexithymia isn't changing him. It is giving him the story of who he is and the control to shape it.

To answer your second question, what made me desire to learn the skills needed to meet my husband's needs was the realization that what I was doing wasn't working, that I'd done everything I knew how to do, and that if I was going to be able to meet those needs that I would need to learn a new skill set from someone or somewhere else. It really was as simple as that. I have a lot to learn and don't claim to be any kind of model wife. I am trying though and hope and even expect to be the wife I am called to being some day by living through and learning through these situations we call life. I appreciate you sharing your inner world with me and the opportunity to ask my husband if he identifies with any of your experiences.

I need to go for now so I'll have to express my appreciation to themainmeal later today.

Eliza

FiveeEggsIn, Good Lord it seems that you and your husbands approach to marriage is almost identical to ours, I thought that we were completely alone ...I cannot tell you how much it means to me to know that someone else is trying there hardest even though the autism is such a major mountain to climb ...More power to you...I am originally a catholic but I no longer practice...but the values instilled in me hold true...Sorry I have run out of words..you have blown me away somewhat..

Wow, I guess now I know what I was projecting----I watched my Catholic mother abuse and bully my AS father for years---sorry but many of your word and view on marriage are the same as hers!! You should be with someone because you want to not because you feel that God obligates you to---My father deserved much better.

Actually I just realized why I posted to you to begin with. You first post really upset me because it was the most hurtful thing I have seen on WP--although i since saw the posts about this so called Cassanda syndrome and I am very disturbed-----Don't you see that you just bullied me! I am new to AS, but I would say me number one issue is that I have spent a lifetime being put down and invalidated (particulry by women in a manor similar to the way you just did).---read your response back--do you see how you invalidated me (started with Whoooa), then made personal accustaions against me (you are projecting), then you called me ingnorant and refered me to info about churches (I am confirmed so I know all about cathololisim). Do you see that this is the exact type of rejection and invalidation I was talking about. Im sorry that I lack all the pretty words (and spelling!!) to try to have a disscussion with you about the feelings of people with AS, but you used all your pretty words to make me feel very bad. I am sorry that my response was prickky--I guess it was my best attempt to imitate your behavior. I (like you husband??) llack the words to win or even get a foot in edgewise against some one who nose how to tell how to feel (or that my feelings are invalid!!). This discourse with you makes me want to shut down, so maybe you should again think about my question "Even if she doesn't have the skills now, what made you actually care and begin to learn or try to meet your partner's needs that were different from your own?" I think I am trying to show you these skills here--mavbe read posts on empathy is a two way street (i wrote one about my dad)--you need to learn these things esp if any of your children have AS or are male (they will project your feelings about your spouses worth upon themselves, just as I did).

Physicsgirl,

I am very sorry that your mother abused and bullied your father. I am also very sorry that she did it while espousing a Catholic faith, which is incompatible with abuse. I understand how the frustration and despair that I expressed in my first post here was too much for you considering your own history. I was so emotional at the time that I couldn't even handle reading other people's threads at all, so you're doing better than me.

I do not judge you based on your spelling, grammar, or word choice and hadn't even noticed it. I assume that others have for you to believe that I would, and for that I also am very sorry. I understand why you are unable to post with me (re: "This discourse with you makes me want to shut down") with it bringing up so much hurt and pain for you. I am just some person on the internet, trying to find some help and support so she can grow in her marriage so please do not take my frustration and despair into your own life, but take from these forums only what is positive and beneficial to your life and ignore the rest, even if it means needing to pass over my posts in the future. I am happy to have your input, but it would grieve me to know that it came at the cost of your physical or emotional health.

Take care of yourself,
Eliza

Themainmeal, You and your wife definitely aren't alone. Most of our friends share the same beliefs on marriage, but we only know one such couple who are vocal about the husband's AS diagnosis, which came after the autism diagnosis of a child. The mother is currently diagnosing every person on both sides of their family tree as having autism to some degree and basically hasn't coped well with it at all. Even if we were going to talk to people about it, it wouldn't be them. Who knows how many couples we know who might have an undisclosed diagnosis (like us) or who are ignorant of its presence in their family. It is good to know we aren't alone.

There are plenty of things we face that come up in marriages where AS isn't an issue, so I try to learn from everyone. I can use any help I can get in being a better wife! Some of these things are not even in the realm of typical experiences so I am very grateful for people like you who can relate and share what's worked and what hasn't.

It is really interesting to me how you describe turning everything into a question. I frequently tell my husband that I'm wanting a discussion, not a solution. It doesn't make any sense to him. I would need to confirm it with him but suspect that he would say he thinks the same way you do. Likewise the cycle of genuinely promising to do something, but then starting back at Square 1 afterwards as if the conversation never happened. Your idea of a diary is interesting. It would be my fear that it would only be consulted to dissect words or meaning or intentions and not to keep us both accountable. That's just me being all testy because of my own past. The idea that your writing it isn't emotional and is better stored and retrieved is interesting. Maybe my husband would appreciate the idea. I'll pass it on. Thanks!

Eliza

FiveEggsIn , my Mother was a staunch Irish Catholic and my Father had no religious bias..Their marriage broke up when I was 4, I know now that it was my Father AS that made marriage unbearable for him, i have been through the exact same trials he went through, but his lack of personal faith and my Mothers unbending view of life and marriage and how it should be simply didn't work ( back then my Mother was not introspective ). This marred my view of Catholicism, as from what I saw my Mother 'Bullied' my Father , I understand physicsgirl point of view, but I do not think you are doing the same thing to your husband..

Are you both ( you and your husband) of the same train of thought regarding marriage?, It appears that you are prepared to do, introspect, read etc etc whatever it takes to make it work...Does he feel the same way, is he prepared to do whatever he can do to make it work? ..

Themainmeal, I appreciate you and physicsgirl sharing how your parents not sharing the same views on marriage and at least in your case your father's AS being part of the complication led to the breakdown of their marriages following your mothers becoming stressed enough to bully and even become abusive to your fathers, and how it has hurt you to this day. I do not think myself immune from this and will take efforts to guard against it.

My husband is quite clear to me and to others that he does have the same view of marriage and that he's prepared to do what it takes to make it last. That's been hard for me to reconcile with his actions when he doesn't do what it takes, but continues assuring me that he wants to and is doing what he can. If I say, "OK, then all I need right now is for you to please help me by doing a load of dishes and wiping all the kitchen counters clean and I'll feel much better about what we have to get done and more comfortable with your support." and he says that he can do that no problem, but then he doesn't do it, but still he doesn't know why he didn't do it and has every intention of doing what it takes, I start to wonder what it means to him. I haven't had a chance to discuss what you said about trying to fix everything and of not storing emotional memories yet, but something along those lines would make a little more sense in reconciling his words with his actions.

Since discussing alexithymia, he's been trying to make an effort to identify when he's feeling nervous, excited, happy, frustrated, etc instead of just OK. It isn't easy for him at all, but today alone I noticed that he felt more comfortable with showing joy. I was really amazed. I'm getting a little teary-eyed. Other women "feel" in love when their husbands bring cards or candies, but I do when my husband smiles big at me with his eyes twinkling and says, "I'm excited!" Wow. That tiny little thing and it is because of this thread. I'm very grateful for all of you looking past my own hurts and trying to help us.