Bullying Problem

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I find it hard to admit to myself that this is what is happening to me right now when I am an adult, but all signs point to yes and I am completely lost trying to understand why.

Anytime I make friends with someone they just end up taking advantage - using my house as a place to party/crash/stay or borrowing money that they make no attempt to return. I used to let people get away with this a lot until I got a rude suprise with what a guy I thought I knew well enough told me he really thought of me. Since then I have not wanted to be bothered with any one and I am always trying to guess what it is that someone actually wants. In some ways I still miss him, but I am not prepared to apologise to him when I don't believe that I did anything wrong.

What I am really having trouble with at the moment is I have a really close friend (maybe he could be described as more than a friend, we live together, sleep together, get on really well and he totally supports me with my aspergers) who I would be totally lost without. Before we knew each other we used to have mutual friends. Now all these people, including his brother, not only hate me but have gone out of their way to harrass me and make trouble for me. I have been told that noone can believe that he would have anything to do with me and basically had to watch as they try to convince him about this. He gets along well with everyone and has known most of these people since he was a kid. Rather than tell me that he is going to see certain people he will lie to me because he doesn't want me to get upset and think that he agrees with them. He tells me that he doesn't make his decisions based on what other people think and that it makes no difference to him. I do believe him. I just wish that I could understand and make some genuine friends.

I forgot to mention that after his brother made it clear that he disliked me and would involve other people in disliking me (by getting a friend of his to contact my friend and tell him I am this and that - very mature for mid and late 20s guys huh?) he has stopped going out with them and hasn't been out at all for over a month. As much as I love to spend every minute with him I know that he is a sociable guy and that he wants to do all that stuff that guys like to do together. I feel like other people are making a problem in our relationship because if he isn't happy here he is going to find a reason to go.

I find it troublesome that he thinks he needs to lie to you about who he's visiting. I think
your people picker is simply broken. I ran into a lot of that kind of thing in my early 20's
but since about 25 I've had a pretty good sense of who to pass by and who to try to keep.

Taking what you're saying at face value here, they sound like turds of excuses for people.
The best I can offer you is to ask yourself what traits a friend would have, watch the people
you meet carefully as you get to know them and cut the ones that pull any crap like what
you're describing loose. I've found it works for me to give it a long time before deciding
what i think of people.

It's hard for me to really offer you much because I don't have a sense of you. What is it
they don't like and or have told you they really think of you ?

It actually took me till about my mid 30s! But, bit by by, I'm adding to my social skills and am in fact getting pretty good at it.

He is trying but he's trying in a passive way. And you're right, it's not a stable situation.

Okay, so one thing, you two could get and together try and meet a new group.

local arts groups

coffee shop with open mike and stuff

political groups. I have been known to attend both democratic and republican (I say, "I'm really more of an independent and a moderate")

free bar poker (for points, not money), probably somewhere in your area

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And maybe a heart to heart with him, yes, it does bother you when they say this stuff, maybe if they just didn't say it in front of him.

The most frustrating thing to me is that there doesn't seem to be anything, I have even tried asking outright and not getting any reason. The guy that I mentioned was staying at my house and before that I had been staying with him. So we had spent a lot of time together and for both of us it was a time when a lot of stuff was going on in our lives so I thought all things considered that we were pretty close. The problem was that he was always borrowing money and whatever else off me and other people. He didn't do anything much around the house, didn't care about basic responsibilities or bills. I had asked him to give me a little bit of money mostly to be able to afford food, $50 a fortnight and he said he would but just didn't bother. I ended up just having enough when he went on holiday and told him that I didn't want him to come back. His immediate response was to bombard my facebook with messages telling me to get f**ked etc. that he didn't want to have anything to do with me, just along the lines of me being completely unreasonable and him being none too happy about it. It was so suprising because he didn't even attempt to ask me why or talk about it but just went into abuse mode as if he had seen it coming. I know that he has had similar fallings out with other people and is pretty much a bum.

The only specific thing that has ever been pointed out to me is that I 'act weird' I can only attribute this to aspergers, I don't relate the way that other people do, don't have appropriate responses etc. and I try really hard to fit in. Where I have gone wrong is that I have always felt that I have to deserve to be around other people so I have been overly generous with 'helping' other people and overly forgiving in situations that were not good from the start but I didn't walk away as soon as I should have. It is only since I had a nervous breakdown last year that I can put this sort of thing in perspective and I am 31 now. I know that there has been a lot of judgement about what happened and how I acted around that time and a lot of speculation about what reasons there were for it.

I also found it troubling that my friend was lying to me about who he was visiting and we talked about it. I yelled a bit. He said that he wanted to avoid an argument but I pointed out to him that I didn't have a problem with him associating with his friends, despite what some of them have done to me, and we had talked about that before and it is the way that I have always felt. In short that I found the lies pointless but they still upset me because I felt like I was being played. I fully expected the conflict with his brother would come between us, especially as his mates are also involved, but we have only become closer since then.

I agree that he is trying in a passive way. He is a very passive person who doesn't get involved in a lot of the bs that goes on. I think this is part of what makes up so close since I have so much trouble relating to people. My behaviour has been very unbalanced at times and I feel that he is more protective than anything else.

Well, the guy you spoke of in the first part of that is simply an oppurtunistic douche bag. He probably uses everyone
he possibly can like that. That one has nothing to do with you other than your picker being off.

I still don't understand your friends behavior as far as lying. That makes no sense to me but you seem to have addressed
it I think ? He sounds decent enough. I do wonder why he's latched onto you so tightly though. It sounds like he's a
"caretaker" which is not really bad but that can get destructive if it goes awry. That's a general observation on my
part and doesn't necessarily apply to you, just a thought that I had while reading.

Your wording and spelling tell me you are from the UK ? I know the culture is very different there as far as stigmatizing
mental illness, autism disorders etc. I haven't experienced that part, but I can relate to a lot of your post. Of course you
act weird. Your brain doesn't have the non verbal communication parts wired like most people. I definitely confound some
of my friends who can't understand my brain doesn't work like theirs. Lost some by posting or saying the wrong thing
over the years as well. I don't like it, but it seems to come with the territory.

You sound genuinely decent and definitley deserve to be around people. I don't know if this will make sense, but you might
be trying too hard. Being there when someone needs you is good, but I am dead certain there are people who will
like you weirdness and all and won't want much from you other than participating. I just don't know where you'd find them.
I've found some, so I know they exist. My strategy is to observe people for quite some time, which works out since it
takes people some time to figure out I'm just socially off, not an actual threat or anything. I watch how they treat the
people around them and the ones that treat their friends like gold that come my way I then offer help (moving, car
fixing, whatever I can do) and see if we end up as friends. When it works it's brought me some amazing people. That's
here in Seattle though so may not be of much help and requires some sort of social group as a starting point.

At any rate 1 is more than 0, so you have that going for you, and you seem to be in the right place on WP. I hope things
get better for you and the people who don't like you for being odd are simply idiots Best I can offer, hope something
in it is of some help to you. Stay well and peas Ood.

I think you have yourself wrapped up with an untrustworthy group. I understand because it is hard to find a safe circle. I have a safe circle around me now that know I would do just about whatever they asked so they protect me. It is always dangerous for me to wander outside the circle because usually I get in some kind of confusion. I do think people are operating at the same frequency as I am and I can't even imagine tricking someone in something or just using them for whatever I want. It isn't in my dna. I can't even believe it when someone does something nice for me, overwhelmed and overjoyed they thought of me. I have learned to have a face to the world so I am not rejected but it doesn't take days and days to learn I'm vulnerable. I've learned how to keep my distance, perhaps too well, and be careful when I am outside the circle. It is sad and lonely sometimes but at least I am not trying to figure out a bunch of behavior that definitely raises MANY red flags. I would try to get yourself to a place where you don't have to rely on one person or find someone that is trustworthy.

Good idea! I had to laugh at you attending both Republican and Democrat, sounds like something that I would do myself I have been giving it some thought about what would be good for us.

It is a close guess Rabchild that I am from the UK, I am actually from Australia. I haven't experienced other countries, but I know that here there is not much care or respect for people labelled as mentally ill. There is very little useful help and awareness. I was put into counselling and behavioural counselling at high school but the emphasis was on trying to make me 'fit in' act like everyone else and punishing me when I couldn't.

Alone, when I read your posts I feel that I completely understand and have been exactly there myself. I have been so grateful for the tiniest things that I just started crying thinking about it. These people scare me so much because the way they act makes no sense at all to me.

Lots to think about....

Ok, sort of right then I've noticed that many of the posters here are from either Australia or the UK which makes
sense if the culture is what you're describing. I think most everyone here has been there at some point, and thanks
for reading my posts.

I went through something like what your friend is in that I was seeing a woman who alienated many people I know
but it was simply becasue she didn't understand the rules. I told them to stop being petty and that whatever dislike
they had was their problem. Some backed off, some backed away. Ridiculous on their parts. Good for him for
standing his ground.

I don't know if it helps, but the groups I've found the best acceptance in have been the Rocky Horror crowd, the
hacker/gothic/industrial scene (though I have never dressed the part one time and that's really turned into an
institution), the LGBT community (people with the common experience of being marginalized ?), the Burner crowd
(Burning Man, I have no idea if there's something like that where you are), and for some reason the belly dance
/cabaret scene where I am. In all cases people who don't really play by the mainstram rules and in all cases by
simply throwing down my time and energy with what I could contribute and seeing what came of it.

At any rate, your situation resonates for me and feel welcom to keep me updated on how things go for you guys.

Stay well.

I do that, too. I rather get into the mode of 'auditioning' for friendship. Instead of just being there and maybe the other person is in a place in their life where they can be a friend and maybe they're not.

And I have also not walked away from bad situations as soon as in retrospect I really should have. In fact, one thing I have learned playing poker is that good players both fold a lot of hands and raise a lot of hands. That is, they play a more textured game. And I have developed my theory of medium step, see how it goes, another medium step, etc. Which is new to me, maybe to other people comes easily and naturally. I have also learned to turn down my internal censor to the default mode that it is probably okay to go ahead and say something, this with friends and becoming friends (playing poker has helped me with my social skills and I recommend it for that purpose. I very much 'unrecommend' poker as an attempt to try and make money)

Again, it really wasn't till my mid and late 30s (!) that I began learning a lot of this stuff!

Maybe just if he realizes he doesn't need to lie to be protective?

And it's okay to be passive. I call this being low-key. In fact, there's a whole theory of business and political leadership called 'the good-enough leader,' which I kind of like.

Thanks, I will do

All of the suggestions for socialising I think are good ones, my friend is actually the one who taught me to play poker. I used to live in Sydney which maybe you have heard of - big city - but now I live in a smaller 'city' which to me is really more deserving of being called a town. It is pretty conservative here too, lots of fringe churches, homophobia and racial issues. I can definitely agree from my own experience that the GLBT community is generally very accepting, my guess is because of the marginalisation that the community faces also. We don't have Burning Man over here, although I have seen it on TV and in movies. I guess the closest thing would be the indie arts/hippie subculture that does exist in various ways. Before my breakdown I was more involved in the community and used to have more friends, or aquaintances at least. Then I was involved in community activism and church. I will definitely never go back to religion though. We both like travelling and camping and animals and non-mainstream politics so I am sure there are plenty of options, even here.

The most hurtful thing about this to me is from the start my current friends best mate was in love with me. So he told me. We were friends and nothing ever happened. He claims to have aspergers but I have since been told that was a lie and a lot of stuff went on behind my back. I have a brother a year younger than me who is a violent criminal and is in jail now for killing a man about a month ago. When I was living at my mother's I was in terrible health, so depressed I could hardly get out of bed, and my ex-friend meant everything to me, we would spend almost 24-7 together and even slept in the same bed. Last year my brother was due to get out of jail and my mother has always and will always back him up. It didn't matter to her that she was paid to be my carer or that I wasn't coping and that we had talked for months about not forcing me to have to live with him, when my brother came up for parole I was expected to just accept it. My brother's on/off girlfriend and my younger brother to get the heat off themselves (my other brother being a lunatic who invents reasons to be angry with people) started telling him while he was in jail that I was going out with this guy who he doesn't like and he started making threats about what he was going to do when he got out. So my friend had to go. As far as I know we were both upset about it. He stayed with me pretty much until the last possible minute the day before my brother was released and then had to go. My mother started yelling at me as he was going and I lost my mind. I just had a complete meltdown and started breaking things and then fled. I had nowhere to go which was the reason I hadn't left before. My younger brother ran out after me so I had to take care of him. I just went from place to place, finding out what friends I didn't have, until I ended up in Melbourne. My ex-friend stood by me for the first week or two, the last time I saw him I had had a massive seizure and had just gotten out of the emergency room, I was in trouble and he hugged me, put me on a train and said he would see me soon. A few days later he told me over the phone I meant nothing to him. I called my friend now hysterical, got picked up by the cops in the street trying to slash my wrists with a piece of glass from a window I had just broken and then set my hoody on fire and got thrown in a mental hospital.

I actually think that he would be a really good politician.

I know that I pretty much just trailed off on the above post. I mentioned somewhere that I had had a breakdown and everyone had taken to judging me because of that and I think taking sides also eventhough I don't know why there was any reason for this. My former friend hurt me hugely and I still miss him, but we never had any fight or reason I know of why he ditched me like he did. It has taken me just over a year to get to the point of accepting that I will most likely never know why. I don't know if it is an aspie thing but I always want the reasons for everything