Aspergers and depression

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The sun is shining, it's warm and I didn't have go through too many negative experiences lately. My life is not that bad at the moment and I don't have much to complain about. So why is my mood getting darker by the day. Why does that happen to me time and time again for no apparant reason? I really dislike myself when I am like this again.

I wonder if there is some sort of physical connection between aspers and autism and I would also like to know what your experiences are.

There could be a connection. People with AS do have a high incidence of depression. I think it is important to remember that what is going on inside your head is probably chemical. You said it yourself, your life isn't that bad. I've had the same complaint. I have a job I like, a roof over my head, I have people who care about me. Why does life at times not seem worth living?

It helps me to remember that at times I am literally under the influence of chemistry in my brain that is not under my control. And if I'm under the influence, it is probably not a good time to make important decisions, like quitting my job or ending my life.

If you are in a position to, seek help from a mental health professional. That would be my advice.

Well, of course, it could be the absence of positives. And actually, depression is pretty common just for people in general. The statistical I've read is that approximately 25% of people will at some point in their life struggle with depression seriously enough that they could benefit from an antidepressant. Whether they get one or not is another matter.

So, it could be both the human situation and biochemical.

And on the biochem side, well, we quickly get to the point where something like zoloft may work really well for one person and not do a damn thing for another. That in a respectful sense, it is trial and error. And typically takes a month to tell.
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/aug/03 ... ug-choice3

I have struggled with times of depression. I have not yet taken antidepressants, but I view them as my ace in the hole. (I may have tried prozac at age 26 for OCD if the young psychiatrist I was seeing had not been so nasty and self-righteous about the whole thing.)

So, my personal plan is five months, five antidepressants, I even tell myself that's the Vegas over-under, although I think the actual odds of one of the first five working is somewhat better than fifty percent.

Just that biochem is complicated and tends to be a little different for each person. And it's not so important that the doctor be brilliant and a genius (in fact, that may get in the way) but rather that the doctor have, say, a zen light touch and be willing to try different things.

And sometimes it's also important to step down from the medication in phases even if it doesn't seem to be working.
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/aug/03 ... ing-drugs3

Or, a person can just as well see a 'regular' doctor like an internist or family practitioner and request an antidepressant. It is each person's choice.

I myself have not had the best luck with mental health professionals.

I'd say be kind of careful, because typically if an anti-depressant helps it wont do much good without at least a couple therapy sessions to help the person get back to their previous thinking patterns rather then falling deeper into the depression. Also it is important to keep an eye on what effects the anti-depressant is having such as if it helps, makes things worse, or helps but the side effects outweigh the help and discuss those things with the doctor as well as getting off of it if it doesn't work.

Just don't blindly take a medication, I did that with prozac thinking what the hell I'll give it a try, a doctor prescribed it to me so the worst it could do is not work or so I thought. Point is not everyone reacts well to every drug. Just something to keep in mind but some do find it beneficial to take anti-depressants and it can help some people.

Wait, are you saying you're going to try one anti-depressant a month? If so, I don't think that's enough time to find out what effect it has on your biology, ESPECIALLY if you are female and going through monthly hormonal cycles. Even if you're not, there are other factors that might only happen monthly or even less frequently that may influence your outlook, and your reaction to those things may change from month to month. For example, I might have no problem paying my bills this month but next month I might not make enough money, which might send me into a spiral of depression. If I was on 1 anti-depressant the first month and a different one the second month I might attribute my success in the first month to the first anti-depressant. I think the standard for a trial is 3 months (it was recommended by my Psychiatrist).

I have AS and have been depressed lately. I just came back from an appointment from a medical research clinic. They're currently doing clinical trials for people with bipolar disorder. I wasn't accepted to the trials because of my high blood pressure. What's interesting, though, is the psychiatrist also thinks I'm not bipolar so I still wouldn't qualify for the trials. She does acknowledge the depression and she is aware I have AS. I do have appointment to a medical clinic tomorrow regarding the high BP. At that time I'll see if they can also prescribe something for depression. I've heard some folks here on WP claim the psych meds didn't work or made their condition worse. I hope that doesn't happen with me.

I've come to a conclusion that I am highly susceptible to being depressed. I've tried several medications (fluoxetine (Prozac), citalopram (Celexa), bupropion HCL (Welbutrin)... The SSRIs did not help much, they only made things worse when I tried to taper them off to get off of them. Welbutrin is the one that worked for me. I tried to go off of it (without telling anyone) twice, and both times I've ended up unable to force myself off the bed, with my boyfriend at his wits end.

Welbutrin acts as a reuptake inhibitor on norepinephrine and dopamine (SSRIs like Prozac work on seretonin). I was told that it might make my anxiety worse (I've been diagnosed with an anxiety disorder) and it did for the first few days but I can't imagine that my anxieties would be any better without it in the long run. I actually have sexual desire sometimes now, too (never really had it before).

I've decided that potentially ruining or discontinuing my life is not worth trying to force myself through life without this drug, even though mentally it pains me greatly to have to rely on a drug. It just doesn't matter how much I try to think myself out of depression; when it comes, I feel it descending like a damp, dark, heavy cloak being thrown over my entire being, and I feel very much under the influence of my own biochemistry. Everything is terrible and pointless and bleak. I don't think any amount therapy or even something like winning the lottery could make me feel better when my biochemistry is f*****g with me.

Welbutrin acts as a reuptake inhibitor on norepinephrine and dopamine (SSRIs like Prozac work on seretonin). I was told that it might make my anxiety worse (I've been diagnosed with an anxiety disorder) and it did for the first few days but I can't imagine that my anxieties would be any better without it in the long run. I actually have sexual desire sometimes now, too (never really had it before).

Unlike Welbutrin, SSRIs can kill your sex drive. When I asked my doctor about this a couple of years back when I was on Prozac, he said "Good. That part of your body only gets you into trouble." He's probably right...

I tend to be a pretty serious person, and so when other people are doing fun and frolic and preparing for vacations and the like, I can end up feeling even more social disconnect. (I tend to like either pure serious or pure fun and frolic. 'Normal' people seem to like medium frolic, and for me, a little bit of that can go a long way.) Do you think something like this might be happening with you, too?

This is a very important point and I really encourage other people to jump in and engage. All I'm going to have is very partial answers.

And wow, offhand I'd say a massage therapist or zen teacher would have a better chance of helping a person remember previous positive thinking and maybe writing some of this down in journaling than would a so-called mental health professional (cough, cough).

There are good professionals out there. I will freely acknowledge that. And some people here at WP have had good experiences, and more power to them. But I just have not been one of them.

Someone who did help me was a speech therapist who would dialogue with me and lightly give me some social advice without over-investing and becoming all dogmatic about it. And when I'm journaling, the method of 0, 1, 2, or 3 sometimes works best of all. These are sentences or short paragraphs. A maximum of 3. And so, for me, this method of deliberatively underdoing, yeah, sometimes kind of works pretty well.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. And I have read several sources that one month is enough time to tell yeah or nay. And in honestly, sometimes the first thing I read is what sticks with me the most.

Now, other sources say a little different. For example, the above source:
" . . . STAR*D showed that it can take as long as eight weeks for a drug to begin working and up to 12 weeks to get the full effect. Doctors don't know why the drugs take so long to work; one theory is that the increase in neurotransmitters allows neurons to adapt, grow and establish new connections over time. . . "
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/aug/03 ... -choice3/2

And that is in line with what your psychiatrist has told you.

But then I ask, what is the limited resource we're trying to conserve? Is it the professional's time (in some cases, realistically yes) But ideally, it's weeks and perhaps months of my experience as a human being.

My plan is to cycle through them medium fast (at least start asking the doctor after one month, 'time to begin to start thinking about . . . ') And if my doctor is too much a stick in the mud, to start thinking about getting a new doctor, which I have every right as a human being to do. And if I miss a medication which might have worked, well, I'll cycle through them again if need be.

PS The only thing we maybe haven't mentioned yet is SNRIs like Cymbalta which are reuptake inhibitors for both serotonin and norepinephrine.

And again, sometimes important to gradually phase down from an antidepressant.

yeah though I have to say in my case I never really was enjoying life.....so there is no real going back to healthier more optimistic thinking patterns, except maybe I was a bit more hopeful when I was younger.

I just looked at it another way; I can see one/month making sense now, especially if you're in a very bad way mentally/emotionally and want to try the different possibilities and go through and if needed weed out the ones that have ill effects or don't seem to help until you find at least something to help get you back on track and out of the depression/anxiety/other ailment. Then if you feel things could still be better you can try something else but still have your standby.

And some times when I expect to connect with others, I don't. For example, my involvement with peace activism during the first Gulf War in 1990 and 91 was generally a big disappointment. That was a big one. And then with some jobs where I guess I naively expect people to care, and they don't really.

And maybe even a sub-par counselor is better than no counselor at all. I mean, to have some real live human being who is there willing to take some of the burden onto his or her shoulders.

Now, if it’s someone you’re not not sure is helpful or not, maybe it’s a question of transition and taking a pause. I think it’s okay to cancel an appointment a couple of days in advance. Some places have a policy of a shorter period of 24 hours. Other places, I certainly think a week is plenty of time.

And then, perhaps moving obliquely. Maybe, for example, making an appointment with an acupuncturist first and then canceling the next appointment with the nonhelpful therapist. This may not be such a bad transition at all. Yes, an acupuncturist, yes, it’s alternative medicine. There is an aspect of human touch which may be healing in and of itself. And then it’s kind of a question of how good at listening this person is, even though that’s seemingly only a minor aspect of the visit. For me, it would be a major aspect, perhaps the major aspect. Is the person able to listen to how bad things are without telling me I’m wrong in some way? If they’re not, oh well, move laterally and try someone else (in theory. In actuality, I usually take it hard and don’t see anyone else for a while). Just to be clear, I myself have not seen an acupuncturist. But it's this kind of back-up plan I like to think about. Acupuncture has several thousand years of observation data. It might work in part by releasing endorphins. If so, then like any other medicine, it would be at times important to phase down gradually.