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LillyDale
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18 May 2015, 5:08 pm

The hubby decided he wants to "retire" in about 8 years from his current job (govt) and go work private sector for a few years before he retires for good. This was already anxiety producing since money is something I worry about all the time. Now I am trying to figure out the arcane federal retirement system and figure out what we will have to live on over time.
The online materials are horrible. I tried to figure out their annuity calculations but they failed to mention if the formula gave you your lump sum or a monthly allotment or what. All of this is on me to figure out. The hubby flat refuses to deal with anything financial. He refuses to even deal with paying a utility bill. Since I am not the one working I don't have direct access to the normal things the employees have like benefits orientation etc. So this is probably going to take a lot of uphill battle to sort out.

Since I lost all of my retirement between job hopping (mostly dot.com mergers etc) and my last employer screwing me out of my 401k I am totally reliant on his retirement. I thought about trying to find a consultant to help but so much of the financial advice out there is about as quality as an HR Block tax person. :-) My dad was taken advantage of one when he got older. This guy convinced him to move all of his money that was in secure things into the stock market right before the market collapse and he lost almost everything. So I am guessing I have to figure this out on my own.

I keep having visions of being old, living in my car eating cat food. Anyone found any useful advice that isn't generated by the banks that just want to hold your investments?



BTDT
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23 May 2015, 7:57 pm

I just learned a lot about annuities in settling an estate.

Major decisions: choosing a lump sum or monthly payout. The monthly payout makes more sense for folks who haven't been investing all their life.

Do you need the same monthly payment if he dies? Or is 50% after 10 years acceptable? Basically the longer the annuity can go the less the monthly payout--but the options are structured to meet the needs of couples in retirement.

Useful idiom--pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered.
http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/i ... tered.html

Most of my investment money is now in broad based index funds. But even that may be too risky for your situation--hence the advantage of annuities. But, I've done really well so far in 30 years, which can't be said for a lot of investors. It helps that I do my own taxes, so I can take advantage of things like the Bush tax breaks--holding my breath that I didn't make too much money so I didn't slide into another tax bracket.

You really need to keep that money in tax sheltered investments--or you will really be screwed. I've carefully moved my money into tax sheltered accounts, or investing in things like municipal bonds that aren't taxed by the state or feds.



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23 May 2015, 8:52 pm

BTDT wrote:
...But even that may be too risky for your situation--hence the advantage of annuities...

Personally, I am leery of annuities. It is my understanding that the sales commissions are quite high. Which means they are not a good deal for the consumer.



BTDT
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23 May 2015, 9:13 pm

http://www.obliviousinvestor.com/single ... e-annuity/
I just talked about single premium intermediate annuities, which have the lowest commissions.

People make lots of money selling variable annuities.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/financialfi ... -a-ripoff/

But, she is talking about annuities doled out by the Federal Government, in which no commission is involved.

http://www.opm.gov/retirement-services/ ... -payments/
https://www.opm.gov/retirement-services ... survivors/

http://www.opm.gov/retirement-services/ ... index.html
This seems to be the page for figuring out what you get.



BTDT
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24 May 2015, 10:08 am

The federal government uses annuities to simplify things--you calculate what goes into your pot, then you decide how you want to take it out. As I mentioned earlier, you get more per month by reducing the payment period--waiting longer before you start taking money out.



BTDT
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24 May 2015, 12:48 pm

https://www.opm.gov/retirement-services ... mputation/
You may want to start here, if you haven't already found it.



Rocket123
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24 May 2015, 1:07 pm

BTDT wrote:
http://www.obliviousinvestor.com/single-premium-immediate-annuity/
I just talked about single premium intermediate annuities, which have the lowest commissions.

People make lots of money selling variable annuities.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/financialfi ... -a-ripoff/

But, she is talking about annuities doled out by the Federal Government, in which no commission is involved.

http://www.opm.gov/retirement-services/ ... -payments/
https://www.opm.gov/retirement-services ... survivors/

http://www.opm.gov/retirement-services/ ... index.html
This seems to be the page for figuring out what you get.

Thanks for posting these links. My comments were mostly directed towards variable annuities. The SPIA annuities look interesting. Personally, I am a bit wary about "betting" that a particular insurance company (who sold the SPIA) will be in business though my lifetime. Particularly after watching things implode during the past financial crisis. Probably, if I were to purchase an SPIA, I would think about doing so across multiple companies.



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24 May 2015, 3:04 pm

SPIAs are easily compared, hence competitive prices.

With variable annuities, only the rare expert knows what they are actually getting, so they can charge more and pocket a commission. And that expert won't buy them for himself.



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25 May 2015, 11:47 am

BTDT wrote:
The federal government uses annuities to simplify things--you calculate what goes into your pot, then you decide how you want to take it out. As I mentioned earlier, you get more per month by reducing the payment period--waiting longer before you start taking money out.

BTDT - Just curious, with a SPIA, how do you manage:
- Interest Rate Risk
- Inflation Risk

As I can imagine that both are set by the SPIA based upon prevailing conditions. What happens if Interest Rates and Inflation skyrocket (i.e. similar to the 1970s). Is there a strategy to address the possibility in that situation?

Thanks.



BTDT
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25 May 2015, 12:26 pm

IMHO, the best way to handle the interest rate risk is to save a lot of money, and learn to live well within your means. Ideally, you would have a portfolio of investments--the SPIA would pay for monthly needs, like groceries and running a household. You would have other investments, perhaps a bond index, if you are adverse to stocks, to handle the inflation rate risk. An SPIA would allow you to ride out market fluctuations, if you have a lot invested in stocks.

In the OP's case, it might be better to call it a federal pension, and hope that someone will pipe up about the exact terminology..

http://blogs.fedsmith.com/2014/10/22/1- ... employees/
She would get a cost of living allowance, just like those on SSDI or Social Security. There are inflation indexed versions of SPIAs.

Sad to say, but there are people who will intentionally confuse perfectly good retirement alternatives with shady ones in the hope of making a sale.



slave
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01 Jun 2015, 9:08 pm

LillyDale wrote:
The hubby decided he wants to "retire" in about 8 years from his current job (govt) and go work private sector for a few years before he retires for good. This was already anxiety producing since money is something I worry about all the time. Now I am trying to figure out the arcane federal retirement system and figure out what we will have to live on over time.
The online materials are horrible. I tried to figure out their annuity calculations but they failed to mention if the formula gave you your lump sum or a monthly allotment or what. All of this is on me to figure out. The hubby flat refuses to deal with anything financial. He refuses to even deal with paying a utility bill. Since I am not the one working I don't have direct access to the normal things the employees have like benefits orientation etc. So this is probably going to take a lot of uphill battle to sort out.

Since I lost all of my retirement between job hopping (mostly dot.com mergers etc) and my last employer screwing me out of my 401k I am totally reliant on his retirement. I thought about trying to find a consultant to help but so much of the financial advice out there is about as quality as an HR Block tax person. :-) My dad was taken advantage of one when he got older. This guy convinced him to move all of his money that was in secure things into the stock market right before the market collapse and he lost almost everything. So I am guessing I have to figure this out on my own.

I keep having visions of being old, living in my car eating cat food. Anyone found any useful advice that isn't generated by the banks that just want to hold your investments?


LillyDale,

I'm sry to hear of your financial losses and the stress you have experienced as a result.

You and your DH will be dependent on a FG pension exclusively and I'm afraid I have bad news for you both.

I do not know what level of understanding you both have of the current global financial situation and of the condition of America in particular.

America is over 18 trillion dollars in Federal Debt. Virtually all of the State and Municipal gov'ts in America are also in extreme debt. Just as Detroit went bankrupt so also will many many others jurisdictions go bankrupt.

Chicago is next.

America is bankrupt.

America cannot afford to pay your DH's pension and many Economist's would tell you that his pension will never be paid.

I know whereof I speak.

I know that this sounds so unbelievably negative....could it possibly be true?!?!?!?......IT IS.

The guys who peddles stocks, ETFs, mutual funds, etc... will never tell you this because they get paid in commissions and because they are in denial of what is happening.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" ~Upton Sinclair

I have nothing to gain or lose by telling you the truth.

The above is a Mathematical certainty.

If you desire further comment let me know.



slave
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01 Jun 2015, 9:11 pm

LillyDale wrote:
The hubby decided he wants to "retire" in about 8 years from his current job (govt) and go work private sector for a few years before he retires for good. This was already anxiety producing since money is something I worry about all the time. Now I am trying to figure out the arcane federal retirement system and figure out what we will have to live on over time.
The online materials are horrible. I tried to figure out their annuity calculations but they failed to mention if the formula gave you your lump sum or a monthly allotment or what. All of this is on me to figure out. The hubby flat refuses to deal with anything financial. He refuses to even deal with paying a utility bill. Since I am not the one working I don't have direct access to the normal things the employees have like benefits orientation etc. So this is probably going to take a lot of uphill battle to sort out.

Since I lost all of my retirement between job hopping (mostly dot.com mergers etc) and my last employer screwing me out of my 401k I am totally reliant on his retirement. I thought about trying to find a consultant to help but so much of the financial advice out there is about as quality as an HR Block tax person. :-) My dad was taken advantage of one when he got older. This guy convinced him to move all of his money that was in secure things into the stock market right before the market collapse and he lost almost everything. So I am guessing I have to figure this out on my own.

I keep having visions of being old, living in my car eating cat food. Anyone found any useful advice that isn't generated by the banks that just want to hold your investments?


LillyDale,

I'm sry to hear of your financial losses and the stress you have experienced as a result.

You and your DH will be dependent on a FG pension exclusively and I'm afraid I have bad news for you both.

I do not know what level of understanding you both have of the current global financial situation and of the condition of America in particular.

America is over 18 trillion dollars in Federal Debt. This does NOT include unfunded liabilities, which are at least another 60 trillion. Virtually all of the State and Municipal gov'ts in America are also in extreme debt. Just as Detroit went bankrupt so also will many many others jurisdictions go bankrupt.

Chicago is next.

America is bankrupt.

America cannot afford to pay your DH's pension and many Economist's would tell you that his pension will never be paid.

I know whereof I speak.

I know that this sounds so unbelievably negative....could it possibly be true?!?!?!?......IT IS.

The guys who peddles stocks, ETFs, mutual funds, etc... will never tell you this because they get paid in commissions and because they are in denial of what is happening.

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!" ~Upton Sinclair

I have nothing to gain or lose by telling you the truth.

The above is a Mathematical certainty.

If you desire further comment let me know.



LillyDale
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01 Jun 2015, 10:16 pm

Thanks for all the input.
The entire financial system is quite a mess so who really knows what will be in place in 20 years.



justkillingtime
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01 Jun 2015, 10:23 pm

The AARP.org site might be helpful.


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BTDT
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02 Jun 2015, 5:57 am

Whether America can pay his retirement is topic for another forum. Politics, Philosophy, and Religion, to be exact.

You should focus on the best option for your needs, and not worry about what is best for the country.
I would guess that with a Federal Pension, you are likely to do as well as any other choice, given the lack of prior experience with investments.

Sort of like taking money out of the bank and purchasing your own guns for protection--guns are even more valuable than money for many thieves because they can't get them legally.



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02 Jun 2015, 3:33 pm

BTDT wrote:
Whether America can pay his retirement is topic for another forum. Politics, Philosophy, and Religion, to be exact.


It is irresponsible for me to comment on her situation without delineating the context within which her DH's pension exists.

I did not attempt to shift the topic away from her concerns.

Her and her DH's financial future is wholly dependent on the ability of the Fed. gov't to pay him what they have promised.

The Fed. gov't mathematically can NOT pay him his pension.

If I was her, I would want to know this fact, so that I could try to figure out what the HELL I'm going to do for my future. I am, however, not her and she can obviously disregard my comments entirely.

The majority of people in the G20 do not realize the severity of the current state of the Global economy, because they are too busy and tired to learn about it.

The G20 nations have increased their collective gov't debt by ~ 200 trillion USD since the 2008 Global Economic Crisis.

They talk like they have been de-leveraging via austerity measures and the like...this is false.

Even Alan Greenspan admits that we are very close to another global crash which will be worse than 2008.

All the best. :)