Mafia and ASD

Post Reply New Topic

Much talking about how to integrate ASD people into social groups. Suppose an AS is born in a mafia dominated social group, in a macho culture, in a yuppie culture (do the yuppies still exist in these times?). This certainly happens, but there may be less extreme examples of dissonance between what the ASD people tend to be, through instinct and internal arrangements in their souls to survive in society. Should we in these cases proceed to force some sort of integration, at the expense of the ASD world? This might be another argument to defend diversity against integration. I don’t know how the various techniques (TEACCH etc, non to speak of that horrid institution in Illinois or somewhere else– it probably still exists – where electric shocks are administered to non conforming kids) really work, but it might be good to examine which are the values which are taught and if there is not something right in the world of the ASD people.

I heard Steve Buscimis character in sopranos might be aspie.

And martin scorcese was a shy nerd growing up among italian crime, he ended up making films about them.

paolo did you read the book or watch the film gomorrah? What did you think of it? It may be relivant to this discussion.

I have seen the movie and I liked it. Didn't read the book. Generally I am a little suspicious of these muckraking writers. I prefer people who think but stay quiet. For what I can understand the Camorra is much different from the Mafia and all the other illegal organizations (Triads, Yakuza etc.): they are all different and are the result of the constitutional inability of state legality to really control what happens in a society in terms of traffics, need for justice and understandable coercion. By understandable coercion I mean that violence against humans should be a desperate last resource. In modern societies this is quite impossible, so the mafias (as a general improper term) take over. The legal apparatus of punishment is ineffective, uneven and erratic.And what about organizations like Blackwater and the other similar private but "legal" organizations of violence (contractors)?

That would be horrible, to be an aspie kid growing up in the mafia. We have to be true to our own ethics, and if we couldn't do that, we could end up dead. I think an aspie in a mafia family would end up dead.

What I found interesting about it is how hopeless their lives were, and how little choice there is to avoid it. The boy changed side, but the sides where just splitters of the Camorra.

Also some clarification. The character 'Don Ciro' is 'Don' in that context more of a title like Mr? Because he didn't command much respect, he was mostly abused. One wonder if he wound up delivering pensions for the Camorra, almost by accident like he was just an accountant who got caught up in it by chance or unfortunate circumstances.

i recon to be an aspie in the Camorra could be like him. On the other hand some ASD people could do some criminal work very effectively. It depends.

When I use to watch the Sopranos (I love this show and miss it) I use to think about it. I would wonder how would a Aspie survive being involved in a Mafia family or even have close relatives part of the mafia. It makes one wonder. I use to even imagine myself being someone like Tony Soprano and running out of these things.

Seriously, I don't think I could ever be a part of the mafia especially being someone like Tony Soprano.

I believe that, because Mafia organisations are quite often family/clan based, that people who have ASD's that are born into them would more or less be given their niche in the organisation if that organisation benefits from their particular set of skills. If their skill sets did not benefit the organisation, or they were impaired by the ASD to the extent that they would serve no useful purpose to that organisation, they would still be members of the families involved, though not involved in the family business. -- This would would not, however exclude them from being exempted as punitive targets by members of competing families/organisations who are contesting territory, or are actively engaged in vendettas/ blood feuds with the family the ASD person is from.

I think that Fogman's analysis is very correct. So called (in sociological jargon) "deviant subcultures" thrive on family ties. So unfit persons are probably more protected that in acquisitive, meritocratic, abstract cultures.

They won't kill an aspie, they use him in a way that they could. He'll be set up to "eavesdrop".
The aspie will function as a look-out or spy. He'll NEVER be put into mainstream crime. The mafia doesn't mainstream. They'll watch to see what the aspie does well and they incorporate him into where he will do well for them. If the aspie doesn't cooperate, they'll slap him around a bit and then he most likely will cooperate. BUT the aspie will get killed "for sure" only if he goes to the feds or the cops.
The aspie will only be on the fringe "provided" he doesn't do what "they need" real well. The aspie may also get married off to some boffo's daughter who isn't very attractive but has lots of cash. Aspies are known for their loyalty. They do this just as the old English kings did...to solidify families, territories, etc... Best to learn a good trade, kiss everybody's ass, and when the time is right, run away! As long as the aspie doesn't rat, he'll live to a ripe old age...or just marry and stay loyal to some kingpin's daughter. You won't want for nothing but there will always be a time where you'll be asked for a favor and it might be against your morals. Best to learn a lesson from "Claudius" (Derek Jacoby). He knew his wife poisoned him but didn't care because it was his only way out. The mafia is fashioned after the Roman Empire. It's the Roman Empire all over again but it's all underground. It's much more far-reaching than "anyone" can imagine. They are involved in more "legal" things than in the past. They're VERY, VERY rich. But unfortunately, it got it's start with dirty money. That's what was rumored about the Kennedy's...something about "Bootleggin". A lot of people make lots of money fast but "illegally". They educate their kids with this money but the kids do well and don't have to do crime. They just keep moving up and up! See, one has to have a "start". One may get this "start" by dirty money. But this person may or may not have to give back. I don't know.
If you became a judge, you may be approached by a crime boss whether you're related to him or not. I honestly don't know what happens after that. One just might "have" to do what he asks at the risk of harm to his family or he may be given a bribe or a threat of exposure because he might have a secret....maybe the crime boss knows he frequents whore houses because that crime boss might actually be running the whore house. Understandeee? Nobody knows what life has in store for them. Organized crime is all about "MONEY". Mafia spelled backwards is "aifam". In Italian, "aifam" menas "hungry". The whole object is money and riches. Some of it's members are actually poor to certain people's standards but if they were on their own, they'd be far more poor because many are learning disabled. They'll have low-ranking jobs for the rest fo their lives. Some of them can't even read but they can steal. For them, it's survival. For the big guys, who do have a brain, it's BIG money. Everybody works for somebody else like in regular corporate society. It's a rung.

Yep, look at Tony's kid, AJ (or, for that matter, some of the other kids) He's not exactly thriving, but because of his father, he's not likely to get shot. But, really, I think we're taking for granted that there actually exists a type of person that does well in organized crime. I think we exaggerate the abilities of normal people. I mean, sure an NT might do well in the mafia, which means they make it to age 38 before they go to jail. The same goes for other organized crime cultures. My wife did a rotation working in the ER, and some of the wise veteran gang members were 35. By definition, life is short, hard, and violent. Not too many make it to old age.

One of the things that I've noticed is that mafia types tend to employ shills like street gangs to do their 'dirty work' like killing people, collecting extortion payments, dealing drugs etc, while they call the orders and collect the bulk of the cash.

Many of the actual mafia family members will live to a ripe old age permitting that there are no real power struggles with rival organisations, while people who operate as their foot soldiers, or associates are the ones who are more often than not the ones who die early due to the fact that they put themselves in harms way in the pursuit of making money for a person/ family that operates under the guise a benevolent neighborhood figure. This worked quite well for White Bulger, as well as Bumpy Johnson.

Even though he's a fugitive from justice, wh***y Bulger still apparently has the cash at his disposal from his organisation to remain a fugitive whilst many of the people that worked with him are either imprisoned for a long time, or dead at an early age due to their working association.

corporatocracy = mafia