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aspie48
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13 Jul 2012, 10:47 am

this is probably what i will be in 10 years. i see this rings true with a lot of people. its the sad reality. once you have achieved perfection in the social world this is what you get.



noname_ever
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14 Jul 2012, 1:10 am

League_Girl wrote:
http://www.aspiestrategy.com/2012/05/hidden-autistics-aspergers-in-adults.html


In fact, "Joe", as we'll call him, socialized quite well. He seemed quietly confident and wry, intelligent and perceptive. People responded well to him, really liked him, though probably none of them would describe him as a close friend. No one realized - in fact he often went without realizing - that his baseline anxiety approached panic on a regular basis. As soon as he was out of bed, existential angst was his constant companion. His difficulty managing his thoughts made rudimentary conversations minefields to be navigated. And navigate he did, dodging social errors with the same fright and determination one might actually dodge mines. After even minor social interactions he routinely found himself exhausted, and would retreat to soothing, isolated activity: sculpture, writing, woodworking. Not conversation with his wife.

Diagnosing this man was problematic. He truly did not fit the criteria for Asperger Syndrome. In fact, the only person to suspect he was on the spectrum was his wife, who puzzled endlessly about this curious man. He seems so sensitive and kind, she would say. Yet he ignores my birthday and hangs up before saying goodbye. He's so charming with others, yet so silent at home. He never misses a deadline at work, yet cannot remember to give our dog his heart medication.


If he was single, no one would have noticed that he may have AS?



League_Girl
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14 Jul 2012, 2:10 pm

noname_ever wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
http://www.aspiestrategy.com/2012/05/hidden-autistics-aspergers-in-adults.html


In fact, "Joe", as we'll call him, socialized quite well. He seemed quietly confident and wry, intelligent and perceptive. People responded well to him, really liked him, though probably none of them would describe him as a close friend. No one realized - in fact he often went without realizing - that his baseline anxiety approached panic on a regular basis. As soon as he was out of bed, existential angst was his constant companion. His difficulty managing his thoughts made rudimentary conversations minefields to be navigated. And navigate he did, dodging social errors with the same fright and determination one might actually dodge mines. After even minor social interactions he routinely found himself exhausted, and would retreat to soothing, isolated activity: sculpture, writing, woodworking. Not conversation with his wife.

Diagnosing this man was problematic. He truly did not fit the criteria for Asperger Syndrome. In fact, the only person to suspect he was on the spectrum was his wife, who puzzled endlessly about this curious man. He seems so sensitive and kind, she would say. Yet he ignores my birthday and hangs up before saying goodbye. He's so charming with others, yet so silent at home. He never misses a deadline at work, yet cannot remember to give our dog his heart medication.


If he was single, no one would have noticed that he may have AS?



Perhaps. I guess that is what it means that it comes and goes and would he even meet the new ASD criteria? Does it count as being limited and impaired everyday if he can't do it in marriage because he had to do it at work and around other people? Does it count as support if he needs her to be understanding of his needs?


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deltafunction
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14 Jul 2012, 2:53 pm

shrox wrote:
I didn't realize some of the things I do might be "stimming" until a few months ago.


Oh man, me too. I thought that everybody kept their hands occupied when they were nervous, or bit their lip, or things like that.

Does the premise of this article apply to women also?



HappyApples
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14 Jul 2012, 4:14 pm

Genesis wrote:
Sometimes I have a "NT Cover-up" which makes me pass for normal for about 4 maybe 12 hours.... Then again.... its exhausting when I get home after having that cover-up affect my behavior all day.


I know ALL about how this feels.

It's not like I'm being someone different, it's more like I'm trying on autopilot so I can cope in society.



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14 Jul 2012, 6:44 pm

I stopped playing NT. I started getting bullied even more when I did, but I find it a lot easier to do. How bad is that? Blending in is harder than being called 'ret*d' by every pack of classmates - some of which I don't even know - I pass by. I don't even think it's worth it any more to act normal. These kids are just monsters. Why does anyone want to be a part of that?

And I doubt that they grow out of it. My grandfather opened his own law firm just to avoid office politics [and refused to rent out the extra room in case it happened anyways].

It doesn't surprise me that people like 'Joe' would have trouble coping with a constant facade like that.



LennytheWicked
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14 Jul 2012, 6:45 pm

deltafunction wrote:
Does the premise of this article apply to women also?


As a female, yes.



Weirto
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15 Jul 2012, 12:50 am

Now this is something that I can really relate to. I fake being friendly and social all day, then when I get home I completely crash and get depressed.



fubar
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15 Jul 2012, 2:00 am

I try to be friendly, but people tell me I come off as an ashole. I've learned to mimic others, and I am pretty good at it I think. Still, miscommunications at work and with family have driven me to failure at home and in the workplace time and time again. I think that Joe and I are a lot allike, except he somehow gets people to like him. I try to fiegn interest in american idol, or whatever trivial crap normal people generaly talk about, but that doesn't seem to get people interested in being friends with me. Maybe I have a lot more to learn. Unfortunately, I haven't found anyone to work with me who can help me get better at this stuff. As much as I pride myself at being an autodidactic pollymath, this is a topic that doesn't seem to be one of those things that I can teach myself. If I could, I probably would have known what reading people meant: before being diagnosed 2 years ago. Early intervention would have been nice, even late intervention, but instead I'm stuck in a loop of trying to comprehend something my mind wasn't meant to understand. So, I'm an as*hole? Sorry everyone, I only ever wanted to be liked. I never wanted to be someone who makes others feel bad, but I don't see what I'm doing wrong for that to happen. This is confusing, estoy confundito! Esta lluvia mierda, and there's no shelter anywhere.


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fubar
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15 Jul 2012, 2:07 am

LennytheWicked wrote:
I stopped playing NT. I started getting bullied even more when I did, but I find it a lot easier to do. How bad is that? Blending in is harder than being called 'ret*d' by every pack of classmates - some of which I don't even know - I pass by. I don't even think it's worth it any more to act normal. These kids are just monsters. Why does anyone want to be a part of that?

And I doubt that they grow out of it. My grandfather opened his own law firm just to avoid office politics [and refused to rent out the extra room in case it happened anyways].

It doesn't surprise me that people like 'Joe' would have trouble coping with a constant facade like that.


Yeah, kids can be horrible, and adults aren't much better. Assumptive-ignorant and sometimes wanton creatures that they are.


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NTAndrew
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16 Jul 2012, 4:12 pm

League_Girl wrote:
http://www.aspiestrategy.com/2012/05/hidden-autistics-aspergers-in-adults.html


Recently I encountered a problem while collaborating with a group therapist with whom I share a patient. My patient has progressed quickly in therapy, as do many adults on the spectrum. However he did not start off as stereotypically autistic. In fact, initially he presented as many of my patients do: shy, articulate, witty. Good eye contact. Appropriate affect. Typical posture, gait and gesturing.

It took a few sessions to realize this fine gentleman suffered mightly with the symtoms of Asperger Syndrome, which he kept well managed and thoroughly hidden. Contrary to the stereotyoes of adults on the spectrum, my patient displayed no "meltdown" behavior, was keenly (TOO keenly) aware of people's reactions to him and exhibited no bizarre special interests or encyclopedic knowledge of vaccuum models.

In fact, "Joe", as we'll call him, socialized quite well. He seemed quietly confident and wry, intelligent and perceptive. People responded well to him, really liked him, though probably none of them would describe him as a close friend. No one realized - in fact he often went without realizing - that his baseline anxiety approached panic on a regular basis. As soon as he was out of bed, existential angst was his constant companion. His difficulty managing his thoughts made rudimentary conversations minefields to be navigated. And navigate he did, dodging social errors with the same fright and determination one might actually dodge mines. After even minor social interactions he routinely found himself exhausted, and would retreat to soothing, isolated activity: sculpture, writing, woodworking. Not conversation with his wife.

Diagnosing this man was problematic. He truly did not fit the criteria for Asperger Syndrome. In fact, the only person to suspect he was on the spectrum was his wife, who puzzled endlessly about this curious man. He seems so sensitive and kind, she would say. Yet he ignores my birthday and hangs up before saying goodbye. He's so charming with others, yet so silent at home. He never misses a deadline at work, yet cannot remember to give our dog his heart medication.

Partners of people on the spectrum are drawn to what they can sense is inside their partner. Yet they feel shut out, left pining for connection with this special person who remains unreachable. It can be a confusing relationship, and one that can easily lead to resentment.

So what was the problem I ran into with the collaborating therapist? She found it hilarious - outrageous! - that Joe had been diagnosed with Asperger's. When Joe would make an insightful comment during group session, this group therapist and members would share a hearty laugh, rolling their eyes that this sensitive man had been diagnosed as autistic. When Joe would tear up recounting his wife's rage and disappointment, he'd hear "So Mr. Autistic is shaking because his wife got angry! Ha ha! Shouldn't you be indifferent and focusing on dinosaurs?" (I'm sorry to say this is a direct quote.) The general public, even many clinicians, cannot believe someone like Joe can be autistic. His social deficits are so well hidden that he has convinced the world his autism does not exist. And he has perhaps convinced himself.

One person remains unconvinced. His wife. After a long day of running what he terms his "social program", feigning natural banter and hiding anxiety, he is exhausted. His wife comes home to a man who has retreated to isolation as a desperate attempt to find peace and rest.

I'd like to write more about this "hidden autistic" phenomena. Someone must. Adults on the spectrum are often too good at convincing others they are fine, have no emotions, are robotic. This is never the case, and the illusion can be dangerous to long-term mental health for autistics and their partners alike.


This is f*cking spooky. Except for being married (I'm not), this describes me very well. When I have brought up the possibility that I might have an ASD, I get laughed at by my friends and my therapist, who just says I have Social Anxiety Disorder and Depression.



FishStickNick
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16 Jul 2012, 6:44 pm

I can definitely relate to Joe in that blog post. Nobody is ever going to mistake me as being a social genius, but I find I have to force myself to participate in social pleasantries at work. At home, on the other hand, I might not even acknowledge your existence.

The comments to that post are interesting, too.



TheSunAlsoRises
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16 Jul 2012, 7:43 pm

Interesting.


TheSunAlsoRises



ShamelessGit
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17 Jul 2012, 3:00 pm

I find it is much easier to get through life if you ignore people's expectations and let them know that you're choosing to do so. They stay out of your way and it is much less stressful.



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18 Jul 2012, 3:29 am

This is an interesting post, thank you.



nonneurotypical
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18 Jul 2012, 10:22 am

If something other than AS doesn't describe "Joe" then I wonder if maybe his intense interests could simply be less apparent because they happen to be his profession and therefore less remarkable and less obvious. If he is an engineer or computer programmer for example, his intense interests just might be disguised as his job.

I'd be interested in knowing if Joe's IQ is in the range that might afford him a bit more horse power to cope better than most with AS. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I have a problem with the whole concept of a diagnosis being hinged upon clinically significant impairment of normal function and how that might be measured.

I knew a man who lost a foot in an auto accident. I had no idea he was missing a foot and that he used a prosthetic one until the day he told me the story of how he lost the foot. Was he effectively cured of missing a foot because he was so well adapted to using that prosthesis that missing a foot did not impair this activities to any significant degree?


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