Autism Politics - Free For All

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I've heard of a politician state once that autism is just a gift or along those lines while not supporting funding. Was it the Sharon Angle? With regards to bullying pride advocates have a trend of doing so. Like calling things pity.

I think you are sincere about your concern. Funding is an issue in many programs for people that need assistance; but from a political perspective, the big wheels still support assistance for Autism, and it is not likely constituent demand for these politicians to address the issue of Autism will decrease.

I don't like to see anyone bullied, Nathan, and have taken action at times when I see it happening to people here.

There are many people here that take the time to lend an objective ear to the issues that those not content with their condition present. Glider18 is one of those people, and he is deserving of respect. Not all people that are content with their condition are bullies to those that aren't; most offer support in generous quantities. The Haven is a good example.

If you will, keep these people in mind when you think of those that seem to have an agenda other than your own. I think the good outweighs any perceived bad; this may also be the case among many other organizations composed of Autistic people.

This is a very harsh world. Someones simple pride notions can be used by another person for the wrong pursuits, be wrongly perceived by the public or be a ideological front that encompasses factions of ill intents. When it comes to safety, quality of life and so on over the ease to assume calling autism the gift or something similar common sense comes into play. The autism is a disease/disorder notions interpreted by an ideology as hate so let's agree to subside pride or something like that and some of the other odd ball items I will catch on to as time goes on as potentials. Things myself and others got to wonder why to protect themselves and others. When it comes to the potential of homelessness over the ego of the rich engineers and well off college students, the potential of years of isolation again, loss of hope and so on for the sake of said self-esteem which overextends itself in the public arena to play it's game called pride to make compassion into pity.. When the bullies remove the expressions of harship for there self-image and call it pity they are knocking on the PR door of social war (great disagreement) and judgement which tends to react harshly to protect.

I am simply warning. Others should respect this and take the matter of autism more seriously. It's not a play thing of a matter to imagine into to lesson what it is. I think I've made myself clear here.

I understand you see this as a larger problem than I do, perhaps because of your life experiences. No one controls our opinions and we control no one elses opinions. We can offer suggestions to others and only hope that the things we say may make a difference.

I think most everyone takes the condition of Autism seriously on this website; accepting the issues concerned with Autism is as important to some as finding answers to problems associated with Autism are for others.

The only people on this website that have any real authority are the moderators, with support of that authority from the owner; warnings are of no consequence on an internet site like this, unless they come from those in authority.

We are here as guests to express opinions and discuss issues of concern. None of us are required to agree with another persons opinion; we are just required to abide by the rules established by the owner, or face the real consequence of no longer being a guest.

There is no consequence to anyone here if they don't agree with someone's opinion; so warning someone to agree with the way a person views a topic of discussion, means absolutely nothing.

If you were to start your own website you would have the authority to warn people to abide by the rules you establish. Have you ever considered doing that?

I'm not talking about a silly websites. I'm talking about the real world media and confronting political organizations like pride when they confront compassionate people like myself and others. It has taken some time but I believe I have gotten through to some folks. With the current tactics of pride they wouldn't last to long in real world politics where they don't control the settings and force views. The major problems are not on this site and this is a site that allows for the diversity. That is why my marketing dollars will go in part to it for a project pride attacked. I don't respect pride controlled sites. This is not really a true pride forum.

Pride has it's web of lies and it's thick fog of propaganda. I didn't ask for no problems but some came to me so I'm much obliged to open a can or two of political whoop-butt to make them know they can't push folks around. I don't mind helping in the cause of cutting through the bull.

Let's see if them folks come at me again and the political consequences that will result when I really get the Pr butt kicking into gear.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRXNNqNfQBs[/youtube]

I'm glad to hear that you understand that these pride folks aren't a threat in the real political world. And I do remember you talking about a group of advocates accusing you of things you said you didn't do, when you attempted to interact with that group.

I'm also glad you understand this site accepts diversity; I think that means you don't expect people to agree with you. I'm not sure though, that when you talk about these things, that people fully understand who you are directing your concern to. Is it just ASAN and the group that accused you of things you said you didn't do. Is there anyone else you have a problem with? I don't recollect you specifying any other groups.

It might help others understand your views better if they understand exactly who these pride folks are that pose what you consider as a real threat to the security of lower functioning Autistic people.

When I read your posts I interpret them as directed toward everyone that is content with their condition and voices the opinion that they don't view autism as a disorder, disease or disability and are supportive of the ideology of neurodiversity; Maybe I have been interpreting your posts wrong.

This does seem like the position you took with Glider18, though. He is a valued member of this site and his personal views pose absolutely no threat to Autistic people. Am I misunderstanding this?

It is also evident that the owner of the website is of the opinion that Autism is not a disease. It is listed on the bottom of the web page. While he doesn't require people to agree with that opinion, he does support it. However, there is no indication he would ever do anything that would harm autistic people, either; just like Glider18.

I have explained multiple times what I'm doing. I am using the extremes views to find a middle ground. I don't think it's as bad as you think. Some folks that are member of that group that also claimed membership to ASAN are members on this site. I don't name them directly, Glider is not one of them and I do not dislike Glider but I guess he is the new scout. I think I've explained the self-centered remark fairly clearly. People are prone to at times be way to sensitive. I think it serves as a just cause to say one of their "own" will make a stand in face of the peer pressure for rational dispute. If autism is the identity you want then all of it's social complexity will have to come with it.

It seems that unless your part of certain groups, ways of thinking and so on some folks will attack other organizations not part of the "gang". My organization because of the treatment will never be member of ASAN, pride groups and so on. I see through it and I'm not to be expected to chant about how I am not a puzzle as if saying autism is a puzzle was that insulting in the first place. I think what we have here is small groups that are very loud being entirely unappreciative of the sacrifices others have made to help them and others while attempting to understand autism. If they want to make mountains out of mole hills, invent into people and good causes and be bitter butts I'll be the one and so will others thanking others for caring in the first place.

Senseless anger is mockery toward compassionate purposes and is a risk toward real progress. Hate and it's anger cannot bring hope and will only bring despondency fueled by it's senseless agenda. If anyone has studied the sociology behind this nonsense they will see not many people believe in it. I want to stand up against it and hell I think it's the right thing to do.

Nathan Young

Other than the folks that you mentioned that personally attacked you, what are examples of the senseless hatred and anger you are you speaking of?

And what do you mean by you guess Glider is the new scout. Scout for who and what? What does that mean? And who is one of their own? And finally, who are they?

I think you are saying you guess Glider is the new scout for ASAN or the group that attacked you and he is interacting with you as a scout for ASAN or that group. I also think you are saying Glider is the one that is one of their own and they are either the group that attacked you or ASAN. But at first you said that Glider was not a member of those groups, so I am not sure I am interpreting your statement correctly. Are you implying this, but just don't want to directly say it?

No some folks on this website tried to pick at me for helping a girl scout understand the adversity she may face to win an award. Seems as if folks can bend and twist what I say and nearly emotionaly explode blood vessles but no one gets bent out of shape should compassions dignity get trashed.

Take a look at this protest by ASAN. They are hailed as hero's in some circles when they deface peoples good intentions and call it pity. ASAN won't let anyone else in their organization with autism that thinks differently yet calls me a disorder label, thinks I should have pride in the disorder and wants to represent me and others on the national level in advocacy. I say I will happily do interviews with media to tell the public the truth about the pride propaganda. They invent into other causes and I am embarrassed by them and their dictatorship.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7Lwtbu9KZc[/youtube]

I don't agree with the protest; I think Autism Speaks has done many more positive things for Autistic people than negative things. But people do have a legal right to express different opinions by protesting. It is not evidence of hatred or anger; just differences of opinion.

ASAN represents a different view than you have; as you mentioned some on this website are members of ASAN and agree with their views. You have the right to protest their views with your opposing views in a media source.

I don't consider that evidence of hatred and anger on your part any more than I consider it hatred and anger on ASAN's part to protest the views of Autism Speaks. It is the American way to protest views you don't agree with. It is part of our Democracy. Is there any real evidence of hatred and anger you can point to other than protests against opposing views and the attacks you felt were unwarranted against you? Opposing views aren't hatred and anger unless they are expressed in that manner. Passion over something a person believes in does not necessarily dictate hatred and anger.

I don't agree with the protest; I think Autism Speaks has done many more positive things for Autistic people than negative things. But people do have a legal right to express different opinions by protesting. It is not evidence of hatred or anger; just differences of opinion.

They are extremes inciting anger and are essentially making fun of other peoples hardships. They are social bullies making compassion into bigotry and different ways of thinking then their own as intolerance.

ASAN represents a different view than you have; as you mentioned some on this website are members of ASAN and agree with their views. You have the right to protest their views with your opposing views in a media source.

Good because if it gets any worse and embarrassing I'll do a national press release to help a few others with autism that think like me get some media exposure on the issue. I just do analysis and don't want radicals like this representing the autism that I have or anyone else that has not chosen. The only reason I have not done so thus far is because candle sales are already to high.

I don't consider that evidence of hatred and anger on your part any more than I consider it hatred and anger on ASAN's part to protest the views of Autism Speaks. It is the American way to protest views you don't agree with. It is part of our Democracy. Is there any real evidence of hatred and anger you can point to other than protests against opposing views and the attacks you felt were unwarranted against you? Opposing views aren't hatred and anger unless they are expressed in that manner. Passion over something a person believes in does not necessarily dictate hatred and anger.

They obviously sound angry. Autism Speaks aside they attempt to dictate certain views are bigotry. Pride has a knack for pushing away self-advocacy views that are not within its spectrum of rigidness anyways. It's not peoples fault folks were born with a disability but when they try to help and they a talked to like how ASAN talks to them I think they are horrible as it could effect even me should the public be pressured into ASAN's view of autism. There needs to be a middle point. I do not entrust ASAN with advocacy concerning autism just themselves as they make their own choices.

Again I don't agree with the protest against Autism Speaks, and in my opinion you seem every bit as passionate about your views as they do theirs. I guess you might have to ask each person if they were expressing anger, hatred, or passion; all three can be expressed with yelling across the street in a protest. Maybe they experienced a little of each, but we would have to ask them to be sure.

ASAN is a tiny, tiny organization of little significance to Autism Speaks; the public has already made their mind up that Autism is a disability that needs research for a cure. There is absolutely no chance ASAN is going to erase that from Public Opinion. What did the protest consist of. 9 or 10 people?

Even the Tea Party across the United States hasn't made a real impact on anything significant that effects the public; and they have been around now for years, consisting of thousands of people that have over 20 percent support among the public.

ASAN has a few people with no measurable support from the public. The general public is not even aware they exist. No one even knows, who Ari Neuman is, in the general public. The general public supports Autism Speaks; that is the huge organization they are familiar with that people donate money to that funds research for a Cure, treatments, and support for Autism. That is what the majority of the general public wants.

In the big picture ASAN is only significant to those people that it assists as an organization, and apparently you and some people on this site, most of whom support them, some who receive advocacy from them.

If somehow you get on the national media to protest them, that is likely the first time they will have publicity on a national level and probably the last time anyone in the general public will hear about them. Ignore them and no one is likely to ever know they exist except those directly impacted by Autism.

Why is this the case, because they are representing, for the most part people that want to see neurodiversity; those that have the desire and ability to function in the mainstream world.

The issue the general public sees are people with Autism that do not have the functionality to live independently. The general public learns about higher functioning Autistic people and folks with Aspergers through movies and books; not ASAN.

I've tried to present perspective here on the significance of ASAN and the general public. I respect your opinion if you see a significant relationship and cause for concern. But, in my opinion there is absolutely no realistic concern that ASAN or similiar groups will ever influence the public in changing their perception on Autism in Lower functioning individuals.

For the most part we are talking about prospective parents, existing parents, families, and friends that are connected in someway to the disability of Autism when functionality is severely impacted. No one is going to talk a significant number of those people into withholding funding for research on Autism.

Good. But you likely may agree that ASAN's approaches could be better? Even if I did agree with some of it I feel now to get far far away from it. Neurodiversity is alienated as a concept because of very bad public relations. In order for people to agree to something like neurodiversity you really need to embrace compassion in leadership and be realistic in representations. I could introduce and make popular the concept where I live as part of an encompassing inclusion awareness campaign year around. But I am as equally threatened by some of the views related to it just as I am sensibly comfortable with the concept.

Leadership needs confidence, strength and good approaches. For neurodiversity I think I could do very good for it. Yet I am unsettled because of the likes of the video. Neurodiversity has nothing to do with abortion, anti-cure and so on. It is simply embracing what is to improve acceptance regardless of an individuals choices and perspective to modify by means of scientific advancement. Yet the phrase is plagued with ideological agenda's.

Neurodiversity innately has nothing to do with a womens right to know whats happening in her body, right to abortion and has nothing to do with anti-cure of adverse symptoms one chooses to improve.

I like the support that ASAN gives to those that want to be accepted in the mainstream world.
And as you express neurodiversity in itself is a good concept.

On the other hand I see the functionality issues with lower functioning autism as severe disabilities, not just differences that people should be expected to live with if science can come up with answers to improve their functionality.

Autistic people that accept their condition should have a choice of living life as they are, but autistic people that would like treatments to help their condition deserve the cure research that might lead to such treatments.

So essentially, you and I agree on the pros and cons of ASAN. I like for people to have as many choices as possible in life to have the best life possible. In my opinion it would be good if ASAN would support Neurodiversity and support research for a cure as a reasonable goal to establish better treatments for those that are severely limited by Autism. I think you and I agree on this also.

Regardless of their ideology though, I see no significant threat posed by the organization to impact Autism Research. We may still disagree on this point, but if so, I agree to disagree.

i dont get this post.i hear a lot of talk about pride and pity and compassion.these are subjective terms.i hear no factual talk about what is the factual point of this post.describing things with words like pride,pity,compasion these are asumtions of view points.its like with a mathmatical problem where no matter how flawless the math if asumtions are wrong the problem cant be solved.i see no factual content in this post.i we take away the assumtion about this or that persons view point represents pride,pity or compassion than this debate has solved nothing.where the facts where's the substance.where's the beef

The Beef.

Welcome to the realm of human emotion and politics. The worst kinds of haters I'd expect to be the true hate against autism I hear from pride advocates. It's what's twisted up. When folk cannot accept people care and hate upon that with such vigor. ASAN's approach is the worst kind of approach. Better approaches don't lead with intent to harm feelings but that to bridge for understanding. That is why it is embarrassing to me. It is shocking to me the dire anger when other approaches could have been very successful. It's almost as if ASAN is a mock organization setting up it's relevant point of view to fail as a political strategy.

Anger is popular. Such as the hate against N.T's. It is popular to mock and socially belittle the N.T concept. This is not the kind of leadership I entrust.

Nathan Young