Board index › General Discussion › Autism Politics, Activism, and Media Representation

The Autistic Genocide Clock. This is sickening people.

Page 4 of 10 [ 156 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 ... 10  Next

Previous topic | Next topic

Poke
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 May 2009
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 605

10 Aug 2009, 12:28 pm

CockneyRebel wrote:
Those people think that people with disabilities suffer. The only thing that we, and others with disabilities suffer from, are the attitudes the people who develope such genetic tests.


Uh... Speak for yourself.



makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

10 Aug 2009, 12:55 pm

Alraune144 wrote:
CockneyRebel wrote:
I'm against prenatal testing of any kind, and I hope that it all comes to an end. I feel that it should be illegal. I hope that this particular test never comes into existence. I'd never want to hear of spoilt rich mothers, or any mothers in that matter, aborting their unborn children, no matter what disabilities they have. Most parents have children for status, and that makes me sick. Of course, adults like that only want perfect children, who will succeed at everything that they enroll them in. The thing that makes me even more sick, is that most parents would want to abort a disabled baby, because they're still the bullies that they were in school. If they hated their special needs peers in high school, they wouldn't want to raise a special needs child. Those people think that people with disabilities suffer. The only thing that we, and others with disabilities suffer from, are the attitudes the people who develope such genetic tests. I also believe that life begins at conception. I am not sick, and I do not need to be cured. I'm also glad that such a test didn't exist when my mum was pregnant with me. People with disabilities are not sick, and we do not need to be cured, or aborted. Those scientists are a bunch of bullies, and they do not respect life.



Bullies, give me a break, bringing any down syndrome or autistic child into this world knowingly is just cruel, let them have peace beofre they have to suffer.


I take exception to that, Alarune; I would not want the 'peace' you offer being chosen for me instead of living. Yes, it is hard; yes, I have been miserable at times. But I am here, and I persevere... and there is no cruelty to it. Man is cruel; nature simply is. 'T' is a man with DS, now in his thirties, who I grew up around and is one of the kindest people I've ever known. Regardless of your opinions, it isn't for you to decide what constitutes quality of life.


M.


_________________
My thanks to all the wonderful members here; I will miss the opportunity to continue to learn and work with you.

For those who seek an alternative, it is coming.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!


Alraune144
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 23 Jul 2009
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 65

10 Aug 2009, 1:14 pm

makuranososhi wrote:
Alraune144 wrote:
CockneyRebel wrote:
I'm against prenatal testing of any kind, and I hope that it all comes to an end. I feel that it should be illegal. I hope that this particular test never comes into existence. I'd never want to hear of spoilt rich mothers, or any mothers in that matter, aborting their unborn children, no matter what disabilities they have. Most parents have children for status, and that makes me sick. Of course, adults like that only want perfect children, who will succeed at everything that they enroll them in. The thing that makes me even more sick, is that most parents would want to abort a disabled baby, because they're still the bullies that they were in school. If they hated their special needs peers in high school, they wouldn't want to raise a special needs child. Those people think that people with disabilities suffer. The only thing that we, and others with disabilities suffer from, are the attitudes the people who develope such genetic tests. I also believe that life begins at conception. I am not sick, and I do not need to be cured. I'm also glad that such a test didn't exist when my mum was pregnant with me. People with disabilities are not sick, and we do not need to be cured, or aborted. Those scientists are a bunch of bullies, and they do not respect life.



Bullies, give me a break, bringing any down syndrome or autistic child into this world knowingly is just cruel, let them have peace beofre they have to suffer.


I take exception to that, Alarune; I would not want the 'peace' you offer being chosen for me instead of living. Yes, it is hard; yes, I have been miserable at times. But I am here, and I persevere... and there is no cruelty to it. Man is cruel; nature simply is. 'T' is a man with DS, now in his thirties, who I grew up around and is one of the kindest people I've ever known. Regardless of your opinions, it isn't for you to decide what constitutes quality of life.


M.



When I see DS people, I try to see them as people but their behaivor is, I can't put it in words I just think no matter how nice that person is, they have to want more and know they can't have it, thats hell...their incomplete, just like severely autistic people...what can they hope to accomplish besides being giant babies forever, I can't even see that as life, its to stunted to be real.


_________________
Verichten Von Grutton...

I've been exiled, persecuted, left alone with no defense...


makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

10 Aug 2009, 1:20 pm

*shakes head* 'T' has a moderately severe expression of DS; that has not prevented him from finding work, from living alone with some support, from having some 'social dates', from being one hell of a bowler and weightlifter, just to list a few things about him... he is different, and I'm sure there are frustrations - but that applies to everyone, regardless of condition or status. He is a fighter, and he is someone I admire deeply.


M.


_________________
My thanks to all the wonderful members here; I will miss the opportunity to continue to learn and work with you.

For those who seek an alternative, it is coming.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!


DaWalker
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Jul 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,837

10 Aug 2009, 1:28 pm

Alraune144 wrote:
When I see DS people, I try to see them as people but their behaivor is, I can't put it in words I just think no matter how nice that person is, they have to want more and know they can't have it, thats hell...their incomplete, just like severely autistic people...what can they hope to accomplish besides being giant babies forever, I can't even see that as life, its to stunted to be real.


Alrighty then, "Giant Baby", just what percentage of autism should be allowed?

Given the fact that you apparently judge everyone as a group, and execute them as well,

then it's an all or nothing across the board oven party.

That being said, why don't you show us where the line is, you go first, and we will follow.

Problem solved. :twisted:



Alraune144
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 23 Jul 2009
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 65

10 Aug 2009, 2:07 pm

DaWalker wrote:
Alraune144 wrote:
When I see DS people, I try to see them as people but their behaivor is, I can't put it in words I just think no matter how nice that person is, they have to want more and know they can't have it, thats hell...their incomplete, just like severely autistic people...what can they hope to accomplish besides being giant babies forever, I can't even see that as life, its to stunted to be real.


Alrighty then, "Giant Baby", just what percentage of autism should be allowed?

Given the fact that you apparently judge everyone as a group, and execute them as well,

then it's an all or nothing across the board oven party.

That being said, why don't you show us where the line is, you go first, and we will follow.

Problem solved. :twisted:


Sheesh all i'm saying is, when the science is there stop DS, Autistic and other children from being born, it should be used, why bring people into the world to suffer, i'm not saying anything like the final solution, i'm not saying round up and shoot them all, IN THE FUTURE when they can detect the anomalies, abort them and one day humanity won't have to worry about the risk of disabled children, the world will be better over all, i'mnot NT, I am AS, I have the right to say that.


_________________
Verichten Von Grutton...

I've been exiled, persecuted, left alone with no defense...


DaWalker
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Jul 2009
Gender: Male
Posts: 10,837

10 Aug 2009, 2:30 pm

All I am saying is that such extreme opinions breed extreme sentiment, in the natural order of things.

Once the perfect clone has been formed, it can be replicated over and over, for the good of mankind.

This just does not seem like a good thought, origins of which are extremely questionable.

Quote:
the world will be better over all
"Better" than what?

I'm not NT, I am AS, I have the right to ask that.



makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

10 Aug 2009, 2:56 pm

Explain why you think the world would be better off without the spectrum.


M.


_________________
My thanks to all the wonderful members here; I will miss the opportunity to continue to learn and work with you.

For those who seek an alternative, it is coming.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!


CockneyRebel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Age: 50
Gender: Male
Posts: 116,973
Location: In my little Olympic World of peace and love

10 Aug 2009, 3:07 pm

makuranososhi wrote:
Explain why you think the world would be better off without the spectrum.


M.


Yes. Go on and explain. Does Autism Speaks speak for you?


_________________
The Family Enigma


CockneyRebel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Age: 50
Gender: Male
Posts: 116,973
Location: In my little Olympic World of peace and love

10 Aug 2009, 3:19 pm

makuranososhi wrote:
Alraune144 wrote:
CockneyRebel wrote:
I'm against prenatal testing of any kind, and I hope that it all comes to an end. I feel that it should be illegal. I hope that this particular test never comes into existence. I'd never want to hear of spoilt rich mothers, or any mothers in that matter, aborting their unborn children, no matter what disabilities they have. Most parents have children for status, and that makes me sick. Of course, adults like that only want perfect children, who will succeed at everything that they enroll them in. The thing that makes me even more sick, is that most parents would want to abort a disabled baby, because they're still the bullies that they were in school. If they hated their special needs peers in high school, they wouldn't want to raise a special needs child. Those people think that people with disabilities suffer. The only thing that we, and others with disabilities suffer from, are the attitudes the people who develope such genetic tests. I also believe that life begins at conception. I am not sick, and I do not need to be cured. I'm also glad that such a test didn't exist when my mum was pregnant with me. People with disabilities are not sick, and we do not need to be cured, or aborted. Those scientists are a bunch of bullies, and they do not respect life.



Bullies, give me a break, bringing any down syndrome or autistic child into this world knowingly is just cruel, let them have peace beofre they have to suffer.


I take exception to that, Alarune; I would not want the 'peace' you offer being chosen for me instead of living. Yes, it is hard; yes, I have been miserable at times. But I am here, and I persevere... and there is no cruelty to it. Man is cruel; nature simply is. 'T' is a man with DS, now in his thirties, who I grew up around and is one of the kindest people I've ever known. Regardless of your opinions, it isn't for you to decide what constitutes quality of life.


M.


I think that you're right on the money, here. I feel that every child is a blessing from God. Some people here might disagree. I feel that all people have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. I also do not come to Wrongplanet to get attacked. I can tell that some people who pose as autistic on this site, don't even have autism. I feel that it's up to each individual to decide what their own quality of life is, and that it's not up to society, or the doctors. Now that I've calmed down, I'd also like to add that attacking a Punker is no different from attacking a gentle hippie, when one is posting on an autism support site, because we all carry the same type of emotional baggage that's thrust upon us, offline.


_________________
The Family Enigma


Last edited by CockneyRebel on 10 Aug 2009, 4:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sora
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Sep 2006
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,906
Location: Europe

10 Aug 2009, 3:23 pm

What I find to be disgusting about the situations that involve and follow prenatal testing, but not the prenatal testing itself is how people react.

In 2009, there are still professionals and laypeople insulting parents for having born a child with, say, Down's Syndrome after they had prenatal testing and decided to have the child.

I think that is shocking. 'you should have aborted this child' is nothing a mother and father who decided on having this very child want to hear. It's nothing any parent want to hear and it's certainly nothing that should be said about a baby.

It is a disgusting attitude to resent a life on basis of a disability.


_________________
Autism + ADHD
______
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. Terry Pratchett


Alraune144
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 23 Jul 2009
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 65

10 Aug 2009, 4:35 pm

DaWalker wrote:
All I am saying is that such extreme opinions breed extreme sentiment, in the natural order of things.

Once the perfect clone has been formed, it can be replicated over and over, for the good of mankind.

This just does not seem like a good thought, origins of which are extremely questionable.

Quote:
the world will be better over all
"Better" than what?

I'm not NT, I am AS, I have the right to ask that.




Not better as a better world, better as everyone alive would be in fair compatition of each other, nobody would have to feel like they can't do something, bc nobody would be deficient, why do you want people who can't keep up with the rest, as of right now its fine, we don't really have an option down the road, lets let everyone have an equal chance to flourish, not lag behind.


_________________
Verichten Von Grutton...

I've been exiled, persecuted, left alone with no defense...


exhausted
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Jun 2009
Gender: Female
Posts: 667

10 Aug 2009, 4:39 pm

DaWalker wrote:
Alraune144 wrote:
When I see DS people, I try to see them as people but their behaivor is, I can't put it in words I just think no matter how nice that person is, they have to want more and know they can't have it, thats hell...their incomplete, just like severely autistic people...what can they hope to accomplish besides being giant babies forever, I can't even see that as life, its to stunted to be real.


Alrighty then, "Giant Baby", just what percentage of autism should be allowed?

Given the fact that you apparently judge everyone as a group, and execute them as well,

then it's an all or nothing across the board oven party.

That being said, why don't you show us where the line is, you go first, and we will follow.

Problem solved. :twisted:



Alraune--you can't possibly know what's in anyone's mind. i do know what's in mine (at times, anyway.) i wouldn't trade my more autistic qualities for the world. despite the anxiety and social awkwardness, this is who i am. i have more joy out of the simplest things than you could ever know. a simple visual cue can keep me entranced (maybe what some called meditation) for hours. patterns and lights and sensations---they're richer to me than i can express in words. the thought of working a puzzle can literally keep me alive.

you don't know what "gifts" of someone who can't speak--they can't tell you. but chances are high, they exist.

you can't make choices for us.



Alraune144
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 23 Jul 2009
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 65

10 Aug 2009, 4:44 pm

exhausted wrote:
DaWalker wrote:
Alraune144 wrote:
When I see DS people, I try to see them as people but their behaivor is, I can't put it in words I just think no matter how nice that person is, they have to want more and know they can't have it, thats hell...their incomplete, just like severely autistic people...what can they hope to accomplish besides being giant babies forever, I can't even see that as life, its to stunted to be real.


Alrighty then, "Giant Baby", just what percentage of autism should be allowed?

Given the fact that you apparently judge everyone as a group, and execute them as well,

then it's an all or nothing across the board oven party.

That being said, why don't you show us where the line is, you go first, and we will follow.

Problem solved. :twisted:





Alraune--you can't possibly know what's in anyone's mind. i do know what's in mine (at times, anyway.) i wouldn't trade my more autistic qualities for the world. despite the anxiety and social awkwardness, this is who i am. i have more joy out of the simplest things than you could ever know. a simple visual cue can keep me entranced (maybe what some called meditation) for hours. patterns and lights and sensations---they're richer to me than i can express in words. the thought of working a puzzle can literally keep me alive.

you don't know what "gifts" of someone who can't speak--they can't tell you. but chances are high, they exist.

you can't make choices for us.


I don't want to make any decision beyond leaving the option open for parents to make their own decisions. I don't support forced abortions, just an option to have one.


_________________
Verichten Von Grutton...

I've been exiled, persecuted, left alone with no defense...


exhausted
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 22 Jun 2009
Gender: Female
Posts: 667

10 Aug 2009, 5:21 pm

Alraune144 wrote:
exhausted wrote:
DaWalker wrote:
Alraune144 wrote:
When I see DS people, I try to see them as people but their behaivor is, I can't put it in words I just think no matter how nice that person is, they have to want more and know they can't have it, thats hell...their incomplete, just like severely autistic people...what can they hope to accomplish besides being giant babies forever, I can't even see that as life, its to stunted to be real.


Alrighty then, "Giant Baby", just what percentage of autism should be allowed?

Given the fact that you apparently judge everyone as a group, and execute them as well,

then it's an all or nothing across the board oven party.

That being said, why don't you show us where the line is, you go first, and we will follow.

Problem solved. :twisted:





Alraune--you can't possibly know what's in anyone's mind. i do know what's in mine (at times, anyway.) i wouldn't trade my more autistic qualities for the world. despite the anxiety and social awkwardness, this is who i am. i have more joy out of the simplest things than you could ever know. a simple visual cue can keep me entranced (maybe what some called meditation) for hours. patterns and lights and sensations---they're richer to me than i can express in words. the thought of working a puzzle can literally keep me alive.

you don't know what "gifts" of someone who can't speak--they can't tell you. but chances are high, they exist.

you can't make choices for us.


I don't want to make any decision beyond leaving the option open for parents to make their own decisions. I don't support forced abortions, just an option to have one.



i really don't wish to get into a discussion about abortion. i'm incredibly conflicted. on the one hand, i do believe in choice. some people simply aren't equipped to care for children, and have the wisdom to recognize this. (that's my two cents; it's strictly a personal opinion.)

on the other hand: to abort someone who you may possibly be able to care for simply because you have pre-conceived notions about his/her "quality of life?" i find it infuriating.

it's just another aspect of that pattern i see so often (and not a pleasant visual one.): it has to do with this assumption that we are A) forever suffering, B) are disabled and/or have little to contribute and that C) it's fine to treat us as a pathology and rob us of our own choices on the basis of that.

i don't entirely trust the arguments of someone who would refer to someone as a "giant baby" simply because they're non-verbal. again: you can't know what gifts that person possesses or what his/her experiences of life may be. are you upset simply because those (assumed) gifts aren't "profitable?"



CockneyRebel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Age: 50
Gender: Male
Posts: 116,973
Location: In my little Olympic World of peace and love

10 Aug 2009, 6:12 pm

Take Sue Ruben for example. She's almost non-verbal, but she went on to take regular classes in junior college and regular college. She also tested 134 on a regular IQ test, after she received her facilitated communication device. She's probably in university, today taking regular classes.


_________________
The Family Enigma