Time to get real

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I'm simply speaking based on my experience and yet am picked out to be demeaned. You speak from your perspective yet value it so much it's how the world must be. The candles are part of my life experience The only good advise I've received from the likes of you is how hateful people can be which I never see and people are typically nice. No the world does not revolve around your proposed philosophy and I think you need to realize that and quite attempting to destroy my mental well being and positivism for doing what I believe is good in my life and others.

Totally true, and right now, the magic "open sesame" for government support is "cost cutting"...and it is SO easy to offer them so much...

Here in Ireland we have a curious combined voluntary and community sector that is responsible for most direct services provision and government funded at about 70 - 80%.

Look at even the most basic, publicly filed accounts from a material perspective and it becomes immediately apparent that there could easily be as much as 30% wastage (politest term I can think of) as against direct, or even VFM, driven service provision...that is even before you start any subjective evaluation of the services provided.

Now, this is only one small country, but we did not lick that idea off a stone of get handed exclusive rights to it by the holy mother for services rendered...

The UK charges (approximately) twice as much for residential care for adolescents and teens with Asperger Syndrome as Ireland (where prices are already inflated)...and yet pays less than half as much in welfare...

Whatever side of the house you stand on, with whatever viewpoint, both cannot possibly make financial sense. Yet, people are being left with a choice between maintaining a high level of dependency and seeking residential care or being left below subsistence with the added coming attraction of forced inappropriate, and often effectively impossible, labour as a condition of even that...

Yet...

Residential services cost at least ten times as much as welfare for a single person...

How is that working for anyone?

Funny, I was just wondering how to say pretty much the same thing myself, so I guess I will stick with a firm, but compassionate, "ditto".

The costs problems exist because government is to expensive when they provide them and profit minded businesses seek to profit from them. The real solution reside in money not existing. While that to simple of a solution all in all inclusion is the solution which would reduce dependency and create further self-reliance and independence. The approach ought to be creative and not headed by hearts of hatred such as yourself in my humble opinion.

Stop bringing up my name and not expecting me to defend myself then act as if it's not ok. If you want me to stop replying quite demeaning me. You two are just bullies that won't show their faces offline to attach your comments to. Yet seem to think it is unreasonable that I voice my opinion in the first place in context to how I experience life just because you perceive me inferior because I cost money. Personally you can mouth of all you want and act like you are a victim of me but it doesnt work in reality as reality is.

Presumably the bulk of the voluntary and Community Sector is run by the Church ( A throwback to De Val maybe? Its a shame that Mick did not duck!)

The liberals (Aussie version of the Tories) contracted a lot of social services out to charities here in Australia in the early 2000s with limited demonstrable benefits.

I agree there are some major economies that could be acheived if we could apply common sense to policy formulation and evaluation by keeping the "do gooders" and the political zealots out of the equation.

Last edited by WildColonialBoy on 24 Aug 2011, 6:21 am, edited 3 times in total.

In other-words the removal of compassion for the strict evolutionary mechanisms of the survival of the fittest best in your favor as otherwise not disabled individuals. I'm thinking now a devil does exist (humor) and modern day cave men do as well least in thought patters manifested here. Would never happen even if strict resource sharing instead of paper money. Human nature does not have it in them in the collective will. I think allot of people can be a part of things who are not already part of things to create productivity strictly for self-reliance. Such as for instance my suggestion to my congressman office in a few weeks during a meeting about hiring people on disability insurance to work for the same money they already receive but to serve the country in some way in these times.

Strangely, it is turning out that way...not on the surface...all the little (lucrative) cottage charities are as secular as all get out...but when you dig down to the big guns the religious are ALL OVER IT...often through interlocking shell companies.

To make it more interesting, it has been persuasively argued that the Irish Religious also laid the foundation of *BRITISH* social services in the late 19th, early 20th centuries.

Perhaps it is not coincidence that even secular British organisations are inching more towards a revival of the (highly profitable from both the Irish State AND the commercial clients) "Magdalen Laundry" model of residential service provision every day, whereby residents are also exploited at well below minimum wage for commercial profit, this is sometimes called "facillitated in supported employment", and if you spin it right the Government will pay you extra to do that (honest, there REALLY IS "one born every minute" ).



We have a similar, older system here that is regulated by the fact that this is such a small conutry (<that's a typo but it really *IS* too good to correct) that even when our politicians and our underclass are not actually related or intermarried they still have to drink in the same pubs at some point, which tends to put a wonderfully effective limiter on the "inner Thatcher".




At this point, certainly in Ireland, just doing that would probably be enough to stabilise the economy, at least for the next 12 months!

...and I am *NOT* kidding...

It makes me HOMICIDAL to see people using service provision as a licence to print money while, in real terms, literally *NOBODY'S* needs are being met.

So its back to Oliver Twist and the Workhouse model then?

The obvious question is what one can do about it either as a reaction to preserve one's own standard of living or to have a say in modifying flawed policies at a societal level.?

I think this forum cxan be ideal as we could bulid up a knowledge bank of various policies from all over the world, together with first hand appraisals of their efficacy (or otherwise).

There is nothing new under the sun and we would be armed with data when flawed policies are copied all over the world and may be able to profit from international experience and lessons learnt.

Maybe we need to approach site management and ask for an international policy evaluation and discussion section to be set up.

That could be fun

We do a lot here, and manage to exert a lot of influence, behind the scenes, one way or another, which is easy in a tiny country, but I would say the same rule applies at least to some extent, EVERYWHERE...

No matter how clever, corrupt, whatever, a politician is none of them can know EVERYTHING...so if you can tell them something useful to them that they did not know already they can usually be relied upon to run with it.

...and most of them haven't got a blue clue about the specifics of most of the abuse of funds that goes on.

There is no reason ON EARTH why they should have a clue about the more subjective issue of meeting people's needs, until someone tells them, all they have to go on are reports submitted and until someone submits a counter, those reports usually have a vested interest at stake.

Half the voluntary sector is getting away with murder simply because, however blatant it is, nobody wants to be the first to challenge them because they have been told they "do so much good work" when, in truth, they are usually doing slightly more than s*d all at best.

Probably need to give some thought on how best to implement it: but an international policy forum could be invaluable.

The best way to avoid any form of lumbering agency is to create an organic community, a group of like-minded people existing somewhere together. It's a nice core where people can grow stronger bonds with similars and is also a good way to build up a social network of our own kind without relying on the problems of internet or long-distance communication that crop up. That and I wouldn't mind living nearer people I know with greater fondness than many of my neighbours (who I consider neutral, just to cut off any attempt to call me hateful or something). At the core of all of this is the fact that we are already proving that we can be like-minded and have similar beliefs and interests, so creating a community is a natural way of sticking the proverbial middle-finger up at the man.

Facebook is the best place for that...

Most politicians have pages (it is getting to be a political essential these days...for as long as the fad lats) ...and you just keep adding them and treating them like people (they LIKE that)...the other great advantage being that each individual can block anyone who interferes with their personal serenity from reading, as well as posting, to them, keeps things useful and civilised.

The trick is to keep the administration impartial and neutral.

I'm not in favor of separating at all.

I pointed out that a one-dimensional spectrum is inadequate and suggested at least three dimensions to replace it. The purpose of this is to represent more accurately what the situation is.

I didn't buy into the OP.

I think improving our understanding of each others' traits - both talents and challenges - will make it easier to talk to each other and, perhaps, work together.

I agree that the original post was a bit provocative.

What do you think of the International Policy Discussion forum idea?