a disturbing trend in this forum favoring autism speaks

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Tambourine-Man
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07 Nov 2011, 5:48 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man, the fact they can afford to do that shows they have far too much money, but, more importantly, all of it just PR to hide their real agenda.

Yes, it's nice to pay off a few guys here and there and give some autistic people a space on their pretty little blog, and it's a far better PR strategy than what they had in the past, but at the end of the day, it's just that: a PR strategy. Their actual agenda remains unchanged. They are still developing a prenatal test to get rid of autism and the end goal of their organisation is to eradicate autism entirely. It's as simple as that.

So, yes, they now have a nice mask on, and yes, they're now throwing money at a few of the right people, but that doesn't make them any better fundamentally.


True, at one point they explicitly stated that their goal was to eliminate autism. They have never said that they want to eliminate autistic people.

Back then, they thought of autism as a disease that brought nothing but suffering. Their research has provided evidence that this is not necessarily the case. They are realizing that autism is complex, diverse, and not always a curse.

So they are changing their strategy to assure that they have a future and try and make up for past mistakes. No secret there.

This is a pivotal time - the best possible time for us to get in on the ground floor and influence them. We can help guide them, or we can sit back and throw insults.


To eliminate autism, you must eliminate people with autism, surely? And while they obviously won't go out actually killing people, a prenatal test for autism will basically achieve the same result in future generations.

What they've done is pull the wool over peoples' eyes by deploying a clever PR strategy, because they realised that public opinion was not currently in their favour.

So, from what I can see, they're paying people off to speak nicely of them while still going about their old business in terms of their actual goal of, you know, wiping out autism. I've not seen any evidence to suggest that they're going to stop developing prenatal testing, for example.

The day Autism Speaks say that they will no longer research prenatal testing and will instead begin using their resources for good - helping autistic people and families who need support and so on - is the day I support them. And I actually will support them if they do this. I'll even donate some money to them if I can be sure it's now going to a good cause. But that's the day I'll do it, not the day they put out some nice PR about themselves.

Autism Speaks, I know you lot read these forums, so listen up, because I genuinely mean this. If what this dude says is correct, and you really changing your direction, change your goals as well as your PR, and you will gain a lot more support from everyone, me and a significant proportion of the autistic community included.


Once again, they wanted to eliminate autism when they thought it was a disease that was capable of being eliminated. They now know better.

They HAVE explicitly stated that they are not trying to find a prenatal test. They went on record in the interview that I conducted.

Go to their website and do a thorough investigation of their motives for genetic research. They have a science section. Look past all the easily misinterpreted PR and see what they are actually doing.


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merig
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07 Nov 2011, 5:49 pm

Tambourine-Man wrote:
merig wrote:
Some good and thought-provoking posts as usual, Inventor.
But for once I don't think you have gone far enough.

When I think of a cure for autism I am minded of the Stepford Wives.

Autism is simply a different way of thinking, its an enhancer.

It enhances abilities, it enhances sensitivities, it enhances disabilities.

When the neurotype that craves power over the population gains the ability to alter the way we think the pressure on parents to convert their tragic autistic child into a little angel will be enormous and irresitable to most.

(Even then the little angels/cured auties will still be bullied because they are different and don't have the usual NT failings.)

But it is the NT'S who should fear this cure and campaign against it.

The onslaught of propaganda that autism is an epidemic and a tragedy is used to justify using us as the lab rats.

The people in power will not stop with us. Control is the means to power and wealth.

Who would then argue against using this cure on the prison population and then who's next? Dissidents?
Gays? In fact why not put the equipment in the maternity units and do all of them, except their own children of course.

The cure for autism is just the first step towards an Orwellian dream.


It's an Orwellian pipe dream. It isn't going to happen. When there is any evidence that it will, I will be alarmed. At this point there is not.

Even Autism Speaks is changing the language to cures for co-morbid conditions. Why? Because their research has revealed the impossibility of a simple, universal cure.


Less than 100 years ago that screen your looking at would have been considered a pipe dream.

Are you really so selfish that you don't care because you won't be around to see it?



Tambourine-Man
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07 Nov 2011, 5:51 pm

aspie48 wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man, the fact they can afford to do that shows they have far too much money, but, more importantly, all of it just PR to hide their real agenda.

Yes, it's nice to pay off a few guys here and there and give some autistic people a space on their pretty little blog, and it's a far better PR strategy than what they had in the past, but at the end of the day, it's just that: a PR strategy. Their actual agenda remains unchanged. They are still developing a prenatal test to get rid of autism and the end goal of their organisation is to eradicate autism entirely. It's as simple as that.

So, yes, they now have a nice mask on, and yes, they're now throwing money at a few of the right people, but that doesn't make them any better fundamentally.


True, at one point they explicitly stated that their goal was to eliminate autism. They have never said that they want to eliminate autistic people.

Back then, they thought of autism as a disease that brought nothing but suffering. Their research has provided evidence that this is not necessarily the case. They are realizing that autism is complex, diverse, and not always a curse.

So they are changing their strategy to assure that they have a future and try and make up for past mistakes. No secret there.

This is a pivotal time - the best possible time for us to get in on the ground floor and influence them. We can help guide them, or we can sit back and throw insults.

now tambourine man i'm not unreasonable. i could work with you by pm on a set of questions and put them in this forum to have people make constructive criticism on. i'm suspicious of autism speaks but i can see just as much as anybody else they do have a tremendous capacity to raise funds. if these funds were going in the right direction it could be a very good organization indeed. it could solve most of the problems we have. i can see that. but it just makes things a thousand times worse to have a well greased propaganda and corruption machine working against us. so at any rate, pm me if you like the idea of doing another interview with more specific answers to big questions.


My past efforts have emphasized the need to keep things public.

Another interview for Wrong Planet would be very easy to organize. What would be asked? I wouldn't want to be redundant.

The last time I conducted an interview all hell broke loose, even though I collected the questions from people on the forum. I wouldn't want that to happen again.


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07 Nov 2011, 5:58 pm

True it was a fiasco for you. I could see that you would be reluctant. But you have the contacts in autism speaks and that's what matters. If you want to avoid a controversy say it was a community effort or even just use my name I don't really care who has to be stuck with potential blame as long as the questions are answered well. But at any rate just pm me to start the discussion on that because a debate here could get long and hijack the thread.



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07 Nov 2011, 6:02 pm

Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man, the fact they can afford to do that shows they have far too much money, but, more importantly, all of it just PR to hide their real agenda.

Yes, it's nice to pay off a few guys here and there and give some autistic people a space on their pretty little blog, and it's a far better PR strategy than what they had in the past, but at the end of the day, it's just that: a PR strategy. Their actual agenda remains unchanged. They are still developing a prenatal test to get rid of autism and the end goal of their organisation is to eradicate autism entirely. It's as simple as that.

So, yes, they now have a nice mask on, and yes, they're now throwing money at a few of the right people, but that doesn't make them any better fundamentally.


True, at one point they explicitly stated that their goal was to eliminate autism. They have never said that they want to eliminate autistic people.

Back then, they thought of autism as a disease that brought nothing but suffering. Their research has provided evidence that this is not necessarily the case. They are realizing that autism is complex, diverse, and not always a curse.

So they are changing their strategy to assure that they have a future and try and make up for past mistakes. No secret there.

This is a pivotal time - the best possible time for us to get in on the ground floor and influence them. We can help guide them, or we can sit back and throw insults.


To eliminate autism, you must eliminate people with autism, surely? And while they obviously won't go out actually killing people, a prenatal test for autism will basically achieve the same result in future generations.

What they've done is pull the wool over peoples' eyes by deploying a clever PR strategy, because they realised that public opinion was not currently in their favour.

So, from what I can see, they're paying people off to speak nicely of them while still going about their old business in terms of their actual goal of, you know, wiping out autism. I've not seen any evidence to suggest that they're going to stop developing prenatal testing, for example.

The day Autism Speaks say that they will no longer research prenatal testing and will instead begin using their resources for good - helping autistic people and families who need support and so on - is the day I support them. And I actually will support them if they do this. I'll even donate some money to them if I can be sure it's now going to a good cause. But that's the day I'll do it, not the day they put out some nice PR about themselves.

Autism Speaks, I know you lot read these forums, so listen up, because I genuinely mean this. If what this dude says is correct, and you really changing your direction, change your goals as well as your PR, and you will gain a lot more support from everyone, me and a significant proportion of the autistic community included.


Once again, they wanted to eliminate autism when they thought it was a disease that was capable of being eliminated. They now know better.

They HAVE explicitly stated that they are not trying to find a prenatal test. They went on record in the interview that I conducted.

Go to their website and do a thorough investigation of their motives for genetic research. They have a science section. Look past all the easily misinterpreted PR and see what they are actually doing.


Mind linking to a page where they make this specific statement?



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07 Nov 2011, 6:10 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man, the fact they can afford to do that shows they have far too much money, but, more importantly, all of it just PR to hide their real agenda.

Yes, it's nice to pay off a few guys here and there and give some autistic people a space on their pretty little blog, and it's a far better PR strategy than what they had in the past, but at the end of the day, it's just that: a PR strategy. Their actual agenda remains unchanged. They are still developing a prenatal test to get rid of autism and the end goal of their organisation is to eradicate autism entirely. It's as simple as that.

So, yes, they now have a nice mask on, and yes, they're now throwing money at a few of the right people, but that doesn't make them any better fundamentally.


True, at one point they explicitly stated that their goal was to eliminate autism. They have never said that they want to eliminate autistic people.

Back then, they thought of autism as a disease that brought nothing but suffering. Their research has provided evidence that this is not necessarily the case. They are realizing that autism is complex, diverse, and not always a curse.

So they are changing their strategy to assure that they have a future and try and make up for past mistakes. No secret there.

This is a pivotal time - the best possible time for us to get in on the ground floor and influence them. We can help guide them, or we can sit back and throw insults.


To eliminate autism, you must eliminate people with autism, surely? And while they obviously won't go out actually killing people, a prenatal test for autism will basically achieve the same result in future generations.

What they've done is pull the wool over peoples' eyes by deploying a clever PR strategy, because they realised that public opinion was not currently in their favour.

So, from what I can see, they're paying people off to speak nicely of them while still going about their old business in terms of their actual goal of, you know, wiping out autism. I've not seen any evidence to suggest that they're going to stop developing prenatal testing, for example.

The day Autism Speaks say that they will no longer research prenatal testing and will instead begin using their resources for good - helping autistic people and families who need support and so on - is the day I support them. And I actually will support them if they do this. I'll even donate some money to them if I can be sure it's now going to a good cause. But that's the day I'll do it, not the day they put out some nice PR about themselves.

Autism Speaks, I know you lot read these forums, so listen up, because I genuinely mean this. If what this dude says is correct, and you really changing your direction, change your goals as well as your PR, and you will gain a lot more support from everyone, me and a significant proportion of the autistic community included.


Once again, they wanted to eliminate autism when they thought it was a disease that was capable of being eliminated. They now know better.

They HAVE explicitly stated that they are not trying to find a prenatal test. They went on record in the interview that I conducted.

Go to their website and do a thorough investigation of their motives for genetic research. They have a science section. Look past all the easily misinterpreted PR and see what they are actually doing.


Mind linking to a page where they make this specific statement?


Not at all.

http://www.aspiesforfreedom.com/showthr ... ?tid=23241

And I will go ahead and copy the questions and answers regarding a cure and a prenatal test...

2. Autism Speaks funds the Autism Genome project, described, on autismspeaks.org, as, "the largest study ever conducted to find the genes associated with inherited risk for autism." What specific benefits might this research provide the autistic community? Why might so many autistics oppose such research?

A:  We are working hard to understand the biological basis of autism as this will help us target medical treatments to the individuals who need and want them. We now know that autism isn’t one condition, but rather many conditions with many different causes and biologies. Genes are one way of helping to categorize the different autisms so that treatments can be more effective. For example, some, but not all, people with ASD have sleep problems and, in some cases, it appears to be linked to a gene involved in melatonin production (melatonin regulates our sleep cycle). By identifying individuals with that genetic variation, we can hopefully identify those people who would be most likely to respond to melatonin supplementation. This is just one example, but there are many others like it. Genes are one of the best ways of subtyping and understanding the biology of autism so we can develop interventions that can help people with medical problems, such as sleep and GI problems, seizures, food allergies, and so on.

3. In 2007, Autism Speaks merged with Cure Autism Now. Does finding an autism cure continue to be one of your organizations primary objectives? Do you believe it is legitimately possible to "cure" autism, and if so, what exactly would such a cure entail? What characteristics would be removed from a cured individual and what characteristics would remain?

A: Our organization has four main objectives – to raise awareness of autism, fund research into the causes, better diagnosis and more effective treatments of autism, to advocate for families (for instance – insurance coverage for validated treatments) and to providing resources for families such as the transition toolkit for adolescents who are becoming adults, community grants to expand community services, create housing and much more, as well as information on where to get assistance around the country.

As our mission relates to “cure”, our goal is to reduce suffering associated with autism, in all its forms. Some would call that a cure. Others would call it remediation of disability. For others, it means acceptance and empowerment.

One of the things that is so challenging about autism is the fact that there’s so much variation in the way autism is expressed in people. Some individuals can have a productive and creative life, and they aren’t looking for a cure. They’re interested in being accepted and getting access to services to help them adapt to the world with their special skills. At the other end, there are individuals severely affected who have significant medical conditions, like GI distress and have never spoken. For those individuals, the prospect of a cure for autism is really important because to that person “cure” means being able to communicate and free of pain. That results in a lot of different perspectives of where our priorities should be.

4. A growing body of scientific research suggests that we are rapidly nearing the development of an amniocentesis test to detect autism, much like the procedure currently used to detect Down’s syndrome. Does funding provided by Autism Speaks in any way enable the development of such a test? If a prenatal test for autism was developed, does Autism Speaks believe that it should be made available to the public?

A: Autism Speaks is not funding any research to develop a prenatal test for autism. That is not our goal. The genetic research Autism Speaks has funded is aimed at finding biological causes, as described above.


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07 Nov 2011, 6:14 pm

Wow, that's changed my opinion of them completely. Can't honestly believe that's come out of Autism Speaks 8O



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07 Nov 2011, 6:25 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Wow, that's changed my opinion of them completely. Can't honestly believe that's come out of Autism Speaks 8O


Shocking, isn't it?

I think it is very important for people to read and reread this interview.

I also wrote an introduction called Speaking and Listening, which I have posted here.


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07 Nov 2011, 6:29 pm

Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Wow, that's changed my opinion of them completely. Can't honestly believe that's come out of Autism Speaks 8O


Shocking, isn't it?

I think it is very important for people to read and reread this interview.

I also wrote an introduction called Speaking and Listening, which I have posted here.


I've complained a lot about WP over the years, and I've had various arguments with moderators and even, at one point, Alex, but I'm still here. So I'm thankful that this is a relatively free forum.

I reckon Autism Speaks need to let me in on this whole thing, how do I get them to fly me out to write on their blogs and give presentations? ;)



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07 Nov 2011, 6:54 pm

Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Wow, that's changed my opinion of them completely. Can't honestly believe that's come out of Autism Speaks 8O


Shocking, isn't it?

I think it is very important for people to read and reread this interview.

I also wrote an introduction called Speaking and Listening, which I have posted here.

well what i found with that interview was that it just really raised more questions. he said that eradicating autism was never a goal of autism speaks. why did they used to say it was then? i would also suggest to autism speaks that they broadcast their apology on tv as a psa right now. because while they admitted a grudging apology to a small audience after a lot of push and shove they haven't intended that apology to reach a larger audience in the general public. the apology should be televised. along with ads to help hire autistic people.



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07 Nov 2011, 6:58 pm

aspie48 wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Wow, that's changed my opinion of them completely. Can't honestly believe that's come out of Autism Speaks 8O


Shocking, isn't it?

I think it is very important for people to read and reread this interview.

I also wrote an introduction called Speaking and Listening, which I have posted here.

well what i found with that interview was that it just really raised more questions. he said that eradicating autism was never a goal of autism speaks. why did they used to say it was then? i would also suggest to autism speaks that they broadcast their apology on tv as a psa right now. because while they admitted a grudging apology to a small audience after a lot of push and shove they haven't intended that apology to reach a larger audience in the general public. the apology should be televised. along with ads to help hire autistic people.


Pm me any questions that you are interested in having answered.

Also, over on the computers forum I have a post called "Where are all the Autistic Techies? Need Your Help" about getting involved with Hacking Autism.

Here is the link...

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt178929.html


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07 Nov 2011, 7:40 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
Asp-Z wrote:
Wow, that's changed my opinion of them completely. Can't honestly believe that's come out of Autism Speaks 8O


Shocking, isn't it?

I think it is very important for people to read and reread this interview.

I also wrote an introduction called Speaking and Listening, which I have posted here.


I've complained a lot about WP over the years, and I've had various arguments with moderators and even, at one point, Alex, but I'm still here. So I'm thankful that this is a relatively free forum.

I reckon Autism Speaks need to let me in on this whole thing, how do I get them to fly me out to write on their blogs and give presentations? ;)


Alex is my friend. He is a cool guy and I talk to him regularly. He was also unjustly crucified for attempting to work with Autism Speaks and have a positive influence.

I've been called a sociopath (Ooh, I HATE that word), a Nazi Sympathizer, an Uncle Tom, the autistic anti-Christ, a hack, a sell-out, an attention whore, a supporter of genocide, etc... My family and friends were stalked online. People spent HOURS attacking me. A rumor was spread by someone that I was on a lethal medication combo and I received pms from people scared for my life.

What did these people accomplish? They made Autism Speaks look really, really good. Congratulations to them!


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07 Nov 2011, 7:46 pm

Tambourine-Man wrote:
My family and friends were stalked online. People spent HOURS attacking me. A rumor was spread by someone that I was on a lethal medication combo and I received pms from people scared for my life.


They did that because you work at Autism Speaks? Was that members of this forum? 8O

Quote:
What did these people accomplish? They made Autism Speaks look really, really good. Congratulations to them!


Indeed, resorting to those tactics does nothing to help a cause at all.



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07 Nov 2011, 7:55 pm

Asp-Z wrote:
Tambourine-Man wrote:
My family and friends were stalked online. People spent HOURS attacking me. A rumor was spread by someone that I was on a lethal medication combo and I received pms from people scared for my life.


They did that because you work at Autism Speaks? Was that members of this forum? 8O

Quote:
What did these people accomplish? They made Autism Speaks look really, really good. Congratulations to them!


Indeed, resorting to those tactics does nothing to help a cause at all.


I don't work at Autism Speaks... not exactly. After the interview they hired me to do a bit of writing and I was happy to oblige. I was banned elsewhere for being an undercover employee of Autism Speaks all along, which is absurd! I live with my parents!

Some of these attacks occurred here, but many more occurred elsewhere. People over here were quickly reprimanded for their inappropriate attacks.


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07 Nov 2011, 8:08 pm

@tambourine-man that was unacceptable. i was not one of these people. i understand their fear. fear makes you a little crazy sometimes. but i think at heart most of them meant well but got out of control. i would forgive them. the thing is you are a little bit of a celebrity, whether you like it or not, and people care about you. i think it is ridiculous that someone stalked your family. their time would have been better spent stalking autism speaks.



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07 Nov 2011, 8:11 pm

aspie48 wrote:
@tambourine-man that was unacceptable. i was not one of these people. i understand their fear. fear makes you a little crazy sometimes. but i think at heart most of them meant well but got out of control. i would forgive them. the thing is you are a little bit of a celebrity, whether you like it or not, and people care about you. i think it is ridiculous that someone stalked your family. their time would have been better spent stalking autism speaks.


Oh trust me, I know you were not one of those people. I know who they were. I've forgiven them and moved on, which is why I'm not naming names.

I'm a celebrity? I don't know about all that, but thanks!


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