Website against Asperger's Syndrome: HeartlessAspergers.com

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Exactly. As far as I am concerned, this is indeed a disability, but one that almost everyone overlooks and/or finds excuses for. If the silly people who are responsible for that website indulged in just a little critical thinking, they would at least begin to understand that they cannot expect the very same behaviours and treatment they would get from a "partner" who is neurotypical, and that our apparent "lack of empathy" is simply their inability to appreciate the fact that we empathise in a manner that is just different from the way that N.T.'s do it. Plus, we can't read minds. If you want something, if there is some need that is being unfulfilled, then YOU HAVE TO TELL US! It's that simple.

"People with Asperger’s syndrome do not possess “Theory of Mind” abilities, which means they aren’t able to recognize and understand the thoughts, beliefs, desires and intentions of other people in order to make sense of their behavior. The result is a person who is “mindblind,” which means blindness to another person’s needs, feelings and desires." - from the site

Very rarely have I ever come across someone so whiny and selfish. The 'Theory of Mind' nonsense spouted by that shameless self-promoter Baron-Cohen is just wrong.

Adelyn Birch = Katy Ford

probably....

amazon.co.uk "Broken: My relationship with an undiagnosed Asperger's partner "

I think this is a female who was burn't in her relationship with a male Aspie. She decided to start a online group to warn NTs to be careful before getting into a relationship with somebody diagnosed with ASD

I sometimes wonder how the psychiatric and psychologic community can even give all of you any legitimacy.
If a man proclaims "I am God" do you take his words seriously?
Why should they take your words, words from disabled people, that what you have is a gift and is not a disease seriously when they know better to not give it to other disorders?

That website keeps getting dragged up on here.

Last time the mega thread about it pretty much came to the conclusion that it was some silly butthurt woman who had a failed relationship with someone with aspergers and she made this entire site putting other people down when most aspies aren't even the same anyway.

Good question.
I think it is being deliberately obtuse to say that autistic people can meet the needs of NTs in relationships. The very nature of our disorder precludes this. NTs are under no obligation to work to understand us, why would they, what's in it for them?

I think it's at least equally obtuse to suggest that all NTs have the same needs, wants and priorities, and that no aspie could ever fulfill this singular constellation of desires. NTs are indeed under no such obligation, but I would hope that if someone found me interesting and desirable, that "obligation" would not be their driving force in trying to understand me better.

It would be, and I don't suggest that.


That's what everyone wants, I think.

I'm just saying that autism, being a disorder with symptoms of social difficulty, does not make a relationship any easier.

Well that's good, but writing

does seem to be talking about autistics as one homogenous block, and NTs as another homogenous block, and saying that



isn't merely suggesting it will be diffcult, it's saying it can't happen by definition.

That's right, but there are always exceptions to the rule. I really do think that autistic people need to consider that the social deficiencies of autism are a strain on a relationship.

I don't know if there's some language confusion going on here. You can't first suggest something can't happen by definition, and then say there are exceptions.

And eveyone has strengths and weaknesses, and being mindful of them is just part of being human. Granted, aspies are more likely to encounter a greater degree of difficulty in interpersonal relationships of any kind. In being aware of this fact, one can work on it. By working on it, one can improve it. Hence, both your assertion that aspies are precluded from being able to have a relationship ( some even with NTs), and this harpys claim that aspies are some form of pseudosociopathic narcissists, are both false.

You can never become not autistic. And fundamental to autism is social deficit. Theory of mind can't be learned.


Well, I can't speak for the harpy, but autism does put up extra challenges to the success of a relationship.

I hope that's clear enough.

^^ I agree with you. To this day it looks like there are people and websites that are confusing narcissistic traits with autistic traits. There is no mystery there. Autistic traits are what they are, they are not abusive traits. I remember over 10 years ago when they had not refined the list of traits very well and even psychological sites had confusing descriptions of autistic people having narcissistic traits. Many autistic people these days think 'lack of empathy' needs to be dropped as an autistic trait. I'm one of those people. I think the idea that we lack empathy is based on NT's misinterpreting our behavior. Does anyone ever ask us if we lack empathy? No, they base it on assumptions because we get overwhelmed in social situations. Chances are if I'm being quiet I am actually overwhelmed with emotion and sympathy. If my face is blank that means nothing. It means I'm thinking about something intensively, it doesn't mean I don't care. If I'm leaving people alone it's because I want to give them space because I need space, so I'm actually caring about them when I do that. In ways like this our traits get misinterpreted. Another problem area is that some people can have autism and narcissism, because it is always possible to have more than one condition. This adds to confusion. The answer is for people to really understand the traits well and I'd like to see 'lack of empathy' get removed from the list of traits of autistic people.

I read every word on the site a couple of months ago when I got diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome. 

I did this in order to expose myself to the best negative articles I could find on the web about the autism spectrum. I always intentionally expose myself to the best, most thoughtful, most self consistent critiques of any perspective I am considering adopting as my own, because life in the echo chamber isn't really living at all, in my opinion. If someone out there has a bit of truth I've overlooked, I need to examine it to feel like I'm living an honest life, even and especially if the messenger is personally repugnant. I recommend these procedures to everyone.

That said, my perspective on the heartless aspies site is that of a 54 year old male who has been married to the same woman for 28 years. And when I read the anecdotes, I cried. Indeed, it was the recognition of bits of myself here and other bits there in story after story that was the clincher as to my acceptance of my diagnosis.

I immediately sent a link to The Smart One (my spouse). I explained that this site isn't so much of a support group for lover's of autists, but more of a cautionary "just don't go there". I told her "Read this, weep and know YOU ARE NOT ALONE"

Dogmatic and constantly hyperbolic, the whole things reads a lot less propagandisticly if you take care to switch out her "all" for "some" and "never" for "seldom" and "always"...you get my drift.

The great thing at heartless aspies is those stories. What truth can we learn from these people's stories?

Whether you are a "curabee" who thinks autism is a bad disorder that impairs social communication or you are a "neurodiversity" movement supporter who thinks social communication difficulties are partially or totally caused by differences with the greater NT world there still is going to be social communication problems that will cause Autistics difficulties in relationships with NT's. Disability does not necessarily mean inability, disadvantage does not mean do not even try.

Websites like iheartless and Aspie supremacists screaming all NT's are dumb sheep are unneeded distractions.

Really! if that's true he? seems to use lots of 20 yr old female orientated web design on his? pages...obviously I shouldn't interpret a book by it's cover!


There is a saying that one must have the wisdom to change the things they can and accept that there are some things beyond their control. If he? has been married for 28 yrs then there are going to be some habits/traits that his Aspie wife has developed from childhood that are conditioned. When you get married you take an oath that you will love and cherish the person "for better or for worse"

The website is not for aspies, it's clearly written/aimed at NTs who are contemplating getting into an relationship with an aspie. It's purpose (from the author's perspective) is to educate the NT partner to be fully informed before getting into a long term relationship.