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Arrogance is not a need and other refuges in audacity

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Read first: How much do you agree?
Very Much 38%  38%  [ 5 ]
Quite Much 23%  23%  [ 3 ]
Half and Half 8%  8%  [ 1 ]
Somewhat 8%  8%  [ 1 ]
Not much at all 23%  23%  [ 3 ]
Total votes : 13

Gedrene
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18 Jul 2011, 1:38 pm

ci wrote:
There is no evidence that the poster knowingly supported an individual that happens to be a music artists in their philosophies.

I didn't say he supported. I said he had the same political motivations and tactics
ci wrote:
It can be commonly contributed that music fans will utilize phrases, names and symbols of their favorite music. So as long as that music is not obviously hatred or mentioning a term like Nazi as in to support it their seems to be no evidence that the individual other then liking the music is of the same philosophy of what the artists is purported as being outside of their music career.

Of course because I didn't say he was a disciple of this man, I said he used political tactics the same as used by the movement the lead singer is affiliated to.

ci wrote:
It is however obviously headache music. The person singing sounds like they are in the act of dieing from a horrible boredom. If not them then a cow has been hit by a simi-truck.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPJpfNE73fQ&feature=related[/youtube]


How does that have anything to do with this? I tried to avoid these value-based judgements because I didn't feel like hurting someone unnecessarily.



Gedrene
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18 Jul 2011, 1:41 pm

ci wrote:
More effect will be made to counter arguments by avoiding the overused "your a Nazi" accusations. I don't agree with the poster under that name. Yet still to overcome the arguments it just requires balanced reasoning and argument.


Aye, but the fact is that my application of the term is accurate to describe someone tarring a whole section of society under the same brush and advocating the existence of a non-existent chasm between us and others.



Gedrene
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18 Jul 2011, 1:42 pm

ci wrote:
I think you misunderstand. Let's stay on topic here instead. Right now we are talking about calling others Nazi's and how that social strategy has been overused and rendered uneffective even counter-productive to the benefit of those whom are called it and their philosophies.


I think that's a thought of a person who doesn't believe it can actually be applied effectively to someone.



ci
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18 Jul 2011, 1:51 pm

Suit yourself. Failed discourse of the past that I have studied is my basis. I study public relations.


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androbot2084
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18 Jul 2011, 2:16 pm

The problem is that labor unions won't represent autistic workers because companies won't hire union labor if autistic workers are dispatched to a job. Of course this discrimination is totally illegal so the unions decided to blackball drug addicts instead by requiring drug testing as a precondition to employment.



Gedrene
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18 Jul 2011, 2:38 pm

androbot2084 wrote:
The problem is that labor unions won't represent autistic workers because companies won't hire union labor if autistic workers are dispatched to a job. Of course this discrimination is totally illegal so the unions decided to blackball drug addicts instead by requiring drug testing as a precondition to employment.

Could you quit with the unproven conspiracy theories?



Sweetleaf
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18 Jul 2011, 2:47 pm

Gedrene wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Ok well I guess I would have to look into that, either way I do not dislike the music created by Burzum...its a little unfair to accuse someone of being a neo-nazi when they have not indicated they are one...and even so nothing I have read on the dude proves he is without a doubt what one would call a neo-nazi.......either way where did the poster Burzum indicated he was a neo-nazi......its just a heavy accusation that people should be careful with in my opinion.


It is a heavy accusation that has been applied to the right person. Scapegoating, scaremongering and typecasting. These are all things Burzum can be accused of. Just because they didn't say that they are something it doesn't mean that they are not. As for evidence, I think the point of neo-nazis is their use of tactics such as those described above rather than whether they support Hitler.


I mean when did the WP poster using Burzum in his profile name say anything that indicated he was a neo-nazi? listening to the band Burzum does not prove someone is a neo-nazi.



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18 Jul 2011, 4:02 pm

The problem with autistics is that they do not know how to follow the unwritten rules at work. The unwritten rule is that when you run out of work to do you dig a hole in the ground and then you fill the hole back up. But the autistic asks the boss for clarification which would get the boss in trouble if the owner of the company found out that he was paying for unprofitable busy work



Gedrene
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18 Jul 2011, 4:02 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
I mean when did the WP poster using Burzum in his profile name say anything that indicated he was a neo-nazi?

Did you read what I had posted before? You don't have to say you are something to prove you are something. Also I can you not see all of the comments he has written dismissing all mothers of 'autistics' as hating them? That is a classic example of using exaggeration and misinformation to support hysterical hate. Do I really need to give any more examples when you can see them for yourself?
Sweetleaf wrote:
listening to the band Burzum does not prove someone is a neo-nazi.

Well thankfully I didn't say that listening to Burzum was a reason. I said it didn't help his case. I already had a shedload of reasons before I said that.



Sweetleaf
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18 Jul 2011, 4:06 pm

Gedrene wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I mean when did the WP poster using Burzum in his profile name say anything that indicated he was a neo-nazi?

Did you read what I had posted before? You don't have to say you are something to prove you are something. Also I can you not see all of the comments he has written dismissing all mothers of 'autistics' as hating them? That is a classic example of using exaggeration and misinformation to support hysterical hate. Do I really need to give any more examples when you can see them for yourself?
Sweetleaf wrote:
listening to the band Burzum does not prove someone is a neo-nazi.

Well thankfully I didn't say that listening to Burzum was a reason. I said it didn't help his case. I already had a shedload of reasons before I said that.


Ok well no one else saw anything indicating that the poster is a neo-nazi.....chances are this poster has Autism or AS themself.



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18 Jul 2011, 4:15 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Ok well no one else saw anything indicating that the poster is a neo-nazi.....chances are this poster has Autism or AS themself.


Well no one else was having to argue with him all the time. All they did was pick up on when I said Neo-Nazi after I had tried to passionately defend innocent individuals from rampant anti-NT racism, scapegoating and self-indulgent views of superiority.
Neo-Nazism doesn't just mean saying Heil Hitler and hanging up flags of swastikas. It means either wanting to revive Nazi practices or a variation thereof and if anything he was advocating a Fascist outlook favouring the Autistic. I cannot believe I just said that but yes, that happened.



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18 Jul 2011, 4:24 pm

Gedrene wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Ok well no one else saw anything indicating that the poster is a neo-nazi.....chances are this poster has Autism or AS themself.


Well no one else was having to argue with him all the time. All they did was pick up on when I said Neo-Nazi after I had tried to passionately defend innocent individuals from rampant anti-NT racism, scapegoating and self-indulgent views of superiority.
Neo-Nazism doesn't just mean saying Heil Hitler and hanging up flags of swastikas. It means either wanting to revive Nazi practices or a variation thereof and if anything he was advocating a Fascist outlook favouring the Autistic. I cannot believe I just said that but yes, that happened.


I read and disagreed with his first post, but I saw nothing in that post that provides any evidence he is a neo-nazi. And NT is not a race. Also, Neo-Nazis do not just hate other races they also tend to hate people with mental disorders or any other 'inferior' groups.



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18 Jul 2011, 5:15 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
I read and disagreed with his first post, but I saw nothing in that post that provides any evidence he is a neo-nazi.

Really? Are you nuts? He was typecasting people!
Sweetleaf wrote:
And NT is not a race. Also, Neo-Nazis do not just hate other races they also tend to hate people with mental disorders or any other 'inferior' groups.

Well he obviously didn't think autistics were inferior, or did you not get that when he said it? Furthermore, does that prreclude him from taking a similar line even if it doesn't make sense? Also I don't have a damned mental disorder. He doesn't either.



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18 Jul 2011, 5:33 pm

Gedrene wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I read and disagreed with his first post, but I saw nothing in that post that provides any evidence he is a neo-nazi.

Really? Are you nuts? He was typecasting people!
Sweetleaf wrote:
And NT is not a race. Also, Neo-Nazis do not just hate other races they also tend to hate people with mental disorders or any other 'inferior' groups.

Well he obviously didn't think autistics were inferior, or did you not get that when he said it? Furthermore, does that prreclude him from taking a similar line even if it doesn't make sense? Also I don't have a damned mental disorder. He doesn't either.


What is type casting? and I could be nuts.

And AS is defined as a mental disorder in the DSM....but everyone is entitled to their personal opinion on that. Point is he did not say anything racist considering NT is not a race. for one and Neo-Nazi is not the correct term to describe anyone who has any extreme veiws. I thought his post was extreme which is why I argued against it but extreme does not always=nazi.



ci
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18 Jul 2011, 6:03 pm

Gedrene wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I read and disagreed with his first post, but I saw nothing in that post that provides any evidence he is a neo-nazi.

Really? Are you nuts? He was typecasting people!
Sweetleaf wrote:
And NT is not a race. Also, Neo-Nazis do not just hate other races they also tend to hate people with mental disorders or any other 'inferior' groups.

Well he obviously didn't think autistics were inferior, or did you not get that when he said it? Furthermore, does that prreclude him from taking a similar line even if it doesn't make sense? Also I don't have a damned mental disorder. He doesn't either.


As I said I am not defending the person opinions. I am arguing the old your a Nazi remarks dis-value arguments against other opinions. IT is often an exaggeration, supposition and does not often lead to productive debate.


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Gedrene
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19 Jul 2011, 11:25 am

ci wrote:
As I said I am not defending the person opinions. I am arguing the old your a Nazi remarks dis-value arguments against other opinions. IT is often an exaggeration, supposition and does not often lead to productive debate.


You have turned from criticizing me for using a cliche for using exaggeration. The word Neo-Nazi is used in order to account for ideologies and political tactics that resemble Nazism. Gross oversimplification in the service of hate, unproven scare stories an egotistical lack of perspective in the highlighting of differences have all been demonstrated here. There is no exaggeration because he did it. Furthermore I used no supposition because it is clear in previous arguments that I have shown he did it and as for productive debate I don't think anything he said was productive or was intended to be debated. All he did was have a fit, spewing lies of various shades in order to intimidate me: I offered him the minimum courtesy of responding to him, and took up the duty of challenging ignorant and dangerous attitudes.

All you had to show for it was some offhand comment that I had exaggerated when I said he was a Neo-Nazi because other people had with tiresome regularity used association with Nazism to lend strength to their argument when it clearly wasn't cogent. If I did invoke it correctly does that mean you can still use the argument? No.