Homosexual animals

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If its really true that animals can be homosexual and its alright with God. Then why is it not alright with God for humans to be homosexuals? I mean it is true that animals can be homosexual right? Then maybe it is really alright with God if humans are homosexual then. Of course I mean if animals are allowed then why shouldn't we be allowed? After all it is true that we are really born that way right? Because they talk about how its even passed through family genes and things like that.

Here's an article about some very famous gay penguins who were in the news a fair bit at the end of 2011:

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2011/12 ... adies.html


This is now believed to be the cause of homosexuality: (hormone levels present in the womb during fetal development)
http://www2.canada.com/topics/news/feat ... id=4987565

The only people who argue that it isn't acceptable to God are hateful bigots who twist the teachings of religion to justify their own nastiness to others. God wouldn't approve of such un-Christian behaviour of anyone mistreating others like that.

Animals have mortal souls and will not be held accountable for their deeds, so they do not make a good comparison. Fixation on homosexuality is foreign to my thinking, but it is definitely probable that an inclination to sin could run in the blood. You have families who are more likely to be addicted to alcohol and families with frantic sexual relationships. I would say homosexuality is a challenge God poses before people, and not the most complicated one if you think about it.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIcrCZQkSlg[/youtube]

I don't agree that an inclination towards homosexuality is an inclination towards sin. If God has arranged things in such a way that so many people are naturally homosexuality, then it's his will, surely. Gay people usually feel a natural desire to love a person in what, for them, is an ordinary loving way. You can't compare it with alcoholism, which is a tendency to overindulge in something that damages your body and brain. And family and friends. Whereas so long as people have family and friends that aren't bothered by gayness, what harm does it do?

This vs. TheValk's post, hands down.

However, I'd just like to add that while having family and friends that aren't bothered by gayness is a bonus, it's not a requirement & being gay would still not do an individual any harm if they're self accepting/loving/appreciating & they are not co-dependant on the acceptance or approval of others in order to be happy. In other words, even if my family were as*holes about it I'd still be just as much of a homo as I am & I'd just learn to live a good and content life without their negativity in it whatsoever. Fortunately I don't have to deal with or practice that, because my family and friends are sane vs. being hateful bigots hiding behind twisted words of religion as an excuse to sin against others by hating them for their differences.

Indeed, let's thank the Lord that we're not like those Pharisees.

My theory is that all the deities were made up by people, for varying reasons, and I don't stress about what rules were made up in the name of fictional characters.

So I guess it doesn't matter to me why there are gays or if anyone thinks it's OK, and all of the documentation of homosexual behavior in other animals only supports what I accept as truth, which is that is a perfectly natural inclination.

It doesn't bother me if other people think I'm going to hell for being gay, or for anything else, except for the myriad laws that impose those morals on myself and other members of the queer community.

It really puzzles me why some people think religion/god etc has anything to do with homosexuality. To me it sounds just irrational.

That kind of thinking reminds me of those people centuries ago who tried to deny the fact that Earth is orbiting the sun for non-scientific reasons, and of those people in the present day who claim that there cannot be life anywhere else in the universe "because we are the only chosen ones" or something. Such reasoning is irrational.

Yes, but that's where ShyChristianGirl is coming from, and the kindest and most helpful thing to do is to address her worries on the subject. If she can be reassured by the facts that it's not in any way sensible to think a loving God could possibly have a problem with gays, then surely that's a good thing. Plenty of very religious people have no problem with people being gay - I know quite a few, including one of our local Anglican (Episcopalian) rectors. So she needs to know this, that you don't have to be anti-gay to be religious.
I know it's a fictional show, but perhaps it might be useful for ShyChristianGirl to look at this youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHN2yO3QeXU which quotes all the other ridiculous bits of the Old Testament that have been rightly forgotten and left in the past. It brings them together rather nicely, and since I'm not exactly a Bible scholar, I couldn't really list them myself! That's the bit that really annoys me, actually. That people will quote the Bible to prove why gays are evil, and then ignore all the bits of the Old Testament that don't suit them!

Last edited by goldfish21 on 09 Apr 2013, 3:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

Just a friendly reminder: don't be too upset when others (those 'hateful bigots' you mention) decide it's a good idea to tell you who you should sleep with when you keep telling them what to think and how to practice their religion. It's indeed correct that aggression is very rarely a satellite to a profound spirituality though, and that most 'offenders' casually and as if instinctively cling to the idea to testify their belonging to the group (aight I was in church on Sunday and I insist that those homos don't marry so we're cool right).

Such discussions make me wonder how the early Christians 'coped' with Romans and their habit of same-sex relationships/mentoring. Don't think I've ever found anything to read about that, though the sole mention of 'early Christianity' immediately attracts such ludicrous rumours, especially on the internet, that it may be a good thing that I haven't found anything.

at me telling them what to think and how to practice their religion. I'm merely telling everyone the same thing: "Don't be an as*hole." Which is a fairly concise wrap up of Jesus' teachings. I'm not telling them who they should sleep with, what gives anyone else the right to tell me or others who we should or shouldn't sleep with?

Christians may have taken on an anti-gay stance back then just to differentiate themselves from those Romans & solidify their acceptance among their followers, who knows?

Myself, I'm a baptized Roman Catholic - but not very religious, especially since organized religion has become so perverted from it's original intent that it's merely a shell of spiritual faith enveloping big bu$ine$$ intentions to satisfy the Greed of a few much like any modern corporation. I'm also God father to three different kids of two different Christian faiths, yet organized religion & the Roman Catholic church can suck my gay dick when it comes to their Greed or bigoted preaching. No, I wouldn't make that formal offer in real life... because I'm not into old guys & chances are pretty good there'd be someone in the church looking to take me up on that offer.

I don't put any credence in religion.

But we shouldn't get our moral values from animals, obviously. Our closest relatives, chimps, will go into another group's territory and slaughter as many enemy chimps as possible.

That said I don't buy the natural law argument against homosexuality, which basically says that homosexuality is wrong because they can't procreate and the purpose of sex is reproduction.

Based on that argument using contraceptives is wrong. It is also wrong in one of the couples is infertile. If one comes to the conclusion that ALL of these are wrong, then one is logical. If not, one is illogical.

I went to a Jesuit university and studied much Christian history and theology. "Original" Christianity, that of Jesus' time, did not have any dogma. There was no church and people met in each other's houses to discuss the nature of the soul and give thanks over a meal. This is when they actually "broke bread" together. It was only when the last of the prophets died that a scramble for power control took place and an official organization started taking shape. You can thank Emperor Constantine for being the largest catalyst in taking the spirituality of the Christians and turning it into a RELIGION, complete with churches and dogma, all designed to control the masses.

Christianity of today has almost nothing in common with what "original" Christianity.

Wait, did we get that idea from the chimps or does that also come naturally to humans?