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pandorazmtbox
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26 Jul 2010, 1:14 pm

Writing has been my focus for a long time. I've even gotten my courage up to start shopping some stories around. When I first did that, the editors would curtly turn my work down. After ten years of hard work (and in this crown I think you know I mean something of an obsession), I feel I've gotten a lot better. The rejection letters have a different tone, and usually include a solicitation for more stories. However, the comment I keep hearing now is that the stories are somehow falling flat...that we would have accepted this but...and the reason given is that the narrators or main characters come off as cold or distant, or that I'm somehow not making them "likable" enough (the world view of an aspie does tend to have a dark and darker side, right?).

With work, I've managed to cognitively write good dialogue, and body language--the way I have to analyze these things in real life simply made that a no brainer. But I can't figure out how to make my characters more "human" more emotional or more...positive about the world around them. I also can't figure out how to make my stories more fun. They tend to be very cerebral and unmarketable, though interesting and dense. I think it's more than neuro-typicals can handle. I've been trying to work that out, but now as I can't fix it...I find my love of writing sort of...withering. I miss it, but it feels so futile when I try I just can't force myself to do it anymore.

I don't mean to be a downer...just hope someone here might have a solution or share something similar.


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DemonAbyss10
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26 Jul 2010, 1:57 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
Writing has been my focus for a long time. I've even gotten my courage up to start shopping some stories around. When I first did that, the editors would curtly turn my work down. After ten years of hard work (and in this crown I think you know I mean something of an obsession), I feel I've gotten a lot better. The rejection letters have a different tone, and usually include a solicitation for more stories. However, the comment I keep hearing now is that the stories are somehow falling flat...that we would have accepted this but...and the reason given is that the narrators or main characters come off as cold or distant, or that I'm somehow not making them "likable" enough (the world view of an aspie does tend to have a dark and darker side, right?).

With work, I've managed to cognitively write good dialogue, and body language--the way I have to analyze these things in real life simply made that a no brainer. But I can't figure out how to make my characters more "human" more emotional or more...positive about the world around them. I also can't figure out how to make my stories more fun. They tend to be very cerebral and unmarketable, though interesting and dense. I think it's more than neuro-typicals can handle. I've been trying to work that out, but now as I can't fix it...I find my love of writing sort of...withering. I miss it, but it feels so futile when I try I just can't force myself to do it anymore.

I don't mean to be a downer...just hope someone here might have a solution or share something similar.


It kind of depends on genre to be honest. Ive seen more of the darker and edgier characters work in Sci-fi and horror. For fantasy it is very much hit and miss.


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pandorazmtbox
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26 Jul 2010, 2:01 pm

@DemonAbyss10: I write dark fantasy, so I don't think it's a genre thing. So far, the editors find it a miss. But...thanks. ;)


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DemonAbyss10
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26 Jul 2010, 3:02 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
@DemonAbyss10: I write dark fantasy, so I don't think it's a genre thing. So far, the editors find it a miss. But...thanks. ;)


This is when you should just stand up and become your own publisher. Yeah, you will hardly earn anything for it, but if your of the sort like me who just wants to get other people to read their work, then it could be an option for ya.

As for dealing with the editors, they generally focus on stuff that sells out to a mass audience. Also individual editors/publishers have their own preferences for what they are looking for, you just got to shop around a bit so to speak.It could be your characters, all of them ONLY view the negative with can overal depress and perhaps alienate your target audience. As for dark fantasy I feel the best example would be George R. R. Martin's "A song of Ice and Fire" series. Maybe you can use his stuff as an influence of sorts.

But yeah, most publishers/editors nowadays look for bestsellers because they are also hurting from the economy.


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DemonAbyss10
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26 Jul 2010, 3:14 pm

yeah, scuse the double post, but was reading into your post a bit more. Seems the problem isn't the fact that it dark and edgy. Its the fact the characters may feel a bit one-sided. Answer the following about the characters and just think things over. These especially apply towards your main protagonist. Also in recent years the dark fantasy genre ha become more of an overdone cliche to some individuals. At least it sounds like the editors are at least liking some things about your work, else they wouldn't be asking for more stuff from you.

What are his/her motives/goals? It is usually a good idea to try to get this question squared away as soon as possible, usually withing the first chapter or two. It doesn't have to be obvious though.

Where does the character stand and draw the line? Make the character have beliefs of some sort with reasons behind them. they don't always have to be explained right away either, although the readers should know where they stand morally fairly early on after their introduction.

Can you make your target audience empathize with the characters? The readers (especially editors and such) need to be able to relate to your characters. Without getting emtionally involved in the story, most people would end up putting the book down and moving onto something else.


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pandorazmtbox
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26 Jul 2010, 4:51 pm

@DemonAbyss10: I'm really studied and good with character development. How to make my target audience empathize with them? That completely loses me...as in, this is the what I'm hearing from my critiques and from editors and if i knew how to fix it I would. My critiques generally admit that they as readers are relating to the character, and that they like them and that they can empathize for them...but that something somewhere simply falls 'flat'. Some have expressed that it feels like I'm not "letting them in" to the emotional bits, if that makes sense. I am not able to crack that nut...because I hear what they are saying and it makes sense, but in my head I've given them everything there is. I'm starting to understand that it's my Aspie way of experiencing the world that may have me a bit handicapped here. It's frustrating.


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BrandonSP
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19 Aug 2010, 8:45 am

I'm writing a fantasy story with dinosaurs in it, but since the world's culture is Iron Age rather than modern, I'm conflicted with regards to whether I should use the familiar Latin names for my dinosaurs or make up my own names for them. Some people argue that the latter would fit the fantasy theme better, but I'm worried that people won't envision my dinosaurs correctly if I use made-up names instead of Latin ones.


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19 Aug 2010, 9:21 am

To be honest, I've been told that my dialogue and character interactions are the most honest parts of my stories. I just need to work on my description, which is getting better. My professors rave about my work and have loads of confidence in my ability to find work in the field. :)



Brianm
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01 Sep 2010, 3:57 pm

I don't my stories are very good, but others do. I don't know what to think.



BroncosRtheBest
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06 Sep 2010, 9:18 pm

What I write: screenplays (two finished, and I think another two at least currently working on) and I'm also working on a novel.

The screenplays:
Insert Title Here (that's because I'm horrible at titles) FINISHED: Robotic teacher tries to kill children, but fails epically. There's a worse villain in the end, though...
Sunlight FINISHED: A Twilight parody involving zombies. Make of that what you will.
My Life is a Soap Opera: I haven't worked on this one in a long time; I need to re-tool it pretty badly. About an Aspie who gets thrown headfirst into the drama of his high school.
Insert Title Here II: Hero from first movie becomes MMA fighter, villain from first movie kidnaps hero's best friend's ex-girlfriend who he still has feelings for. Complicated enough?
SWAT Kats: Based slightly on the show of the same name, this film recounts the origin of the SWAT Kats and their great showdown with Dr. Viper.

The novel:
Sixteen Takedowns: Kid who needs money joins professional wrestling league, but ends up gaining love, rivalries, and a whole lot of other stuff he didn't bargain for.

If you guys have any other ideas, feel free to tell me. I need to work on those a lot more; it's a lot of fun. If you would like to see the finished ones, Insert Title Here is on a few websites but Sunlight is secret.



FrodoLlama
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27 Sep 2010, 7:11 pm

What I Write:
Novellas
-Prison Break (I've never seen the show), the unfinished trilogy of 5 sets of brothers who all struggle to survive and find each other in a postapocalyptic, robot run wasteland. After they find each other, time travel enters the picture.

-Real Life Heroes (a sequel is sort of being worked on) The tale of a superpowered female and her plunge ino a ragtag team of superheroes. The sequel works a bit more actively on trying to destroy all of time and space about six seperate ways.

Short Stories
A Cobra A Day- What's toxic to an alien?

The Infinite Man- What strange fate might befall the man who learns to control all spacetime?

The Death and Life of 14RR-E -The tale of an artificial afterlife and the dark things that may inhabit it. Also, it's an allegory on the human condition, or whatever the fancy term is for complacent laziness.

The Library Saga- Basically, a miniseries of short stories. Starts off as the tale of the Temporal Literature Agency, a crazy time-traveling organization that wants to collect all the booklsin the world, and who make their home in a rather Lovecraftian Library. Ends with the whole thing getting blasted apart as a means to prevent Lovecraftian Horrors from seeping into reality.

The Library Saga 2- The name i'm giving to the next miniseries, which basically reveals that the Lovecraftian Horror the Library destroyed in order to stop all of reality from shattering like glass is a bit too strong. Never fear, though, because it's ccurrently stuck underneath of it! Now, there's just the matter of all of the protagonists running around alternate realities, trying either to release or kill it...

Radio Plays
The Haunted House- I don't even know. It's about... A Cold War Era AI in a guy's basement. Written really fast.

Fame and Pie- WELCOME TO THE WORLD'S FIRST AND LAST POSTAPOCALYPTIC SITCOM!

What I'm working on- Love, Crafts, Ian-
A Terry Pratchett take on H.P. Lovecraft.
or, in less Namey words-
A humorous take on Cosmic Horror.


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lionesss
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01 Nov 2010, 12:45 am

I am a new author and have published one book. I am working on another and have been lucky to have been working with a publicist and publisher for my second book. It's a huge undertaking but well worth it. My information is in my own site if you would like to check it out. http://www.miriamslozberg.com.

Mir



SanctimoRae
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20 Nov 2010, 6:04 pm

a ruler taught naught,
discredit this account
of words cheaply bought
of peripheral clout

like child, freshly born'd
having yet breathed
or a seamstress unadorned
without actors scened

there's nothing but might
a maybe, perhaps
whether mind can sight
the meaningful straps

binded while still leaning;
propping themselves up
forever just a seeming
outside mind's cup

having been given word
what's not regifted?
my hand's touch blurred
with context shifted

basket filled with apple
apples trees within
dullness likes to baffle
sharpness begets again

with well placed windows
catching thoughtful scene
gentling the wind's blows
sharpening minds keen

care for whiskey'd coffee?
maybe breakfast tea?
or something more haughty...
tripping shaman's pee?

eek and or egad
whatya thinking now?
culture shocks you bad?
everywhere gets plow?

nature tossed 'em 'bout
creature calls phonic
sustenance is the route
blood vein tonic

collecting bridges from behind
tossing them affront
who's got wasted time
well fed runt?

or death by food
tasty pretty poison
hand's antidote: brood
action before reason?

let it never be
authors of health
diseased novels, see
mined minds wealth



ShenLong
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15 Jan 2011, 4:33 pm

What I write

Dual Purpose-The year is 2051. William Mercer is a 28 year old AI/robotics programmer and engineer with financial troubles. The US being at war, corporations responsible for constructing robots are now focused on producing war drones, leaving programmers of experimental AI without a steady income. William has a pregnant wife, and is worried about what will happen when the baby is born(his wife will have to quit her job), so when an old college professor extends a request for William to take part in a project led by Nasa to begin preliminary testing for the first Inter-System space craft, a ship that travels with its crew in stasis that would be fast enough to reach Alpha-Centauri within 40 years, he doesn't hesitate. His job is to raise Simon, a prototypical sentient artificial intelligence designed for on the fly decision making and to take care of the 20 volunteers kept in stasis, the first of it's kind. What's so unique about Simon is that he grows in emotion and understanding like a human child. Will is sent to the ecodome meant to simulate the ship's environment, where he must remain for three months as part of the experiment. Simon, initially childlike and oblivious to a great many things is raised like a son by Will.

However, Will finds out the hard way that the ecodome is not what it seems, that it serves two purposes, it's stated purpose, and it's secondary purpose that becomes apparent once the war ends with a nuclear holocaust. Suddenly, Will is plunged into a nightmare as everyone he's ever cared for is killed by the bombs and the subsequent nuclear winter, all accept for Simon.
This book is greatly inspired by movies rather than books. Moon, Silent Running, AI, 2001, The Fountain, When The Wind Blows, and Sunshine to name a few. Also, some books helped: Temeraire, To Kill A Mockingbird, 1984, Metro 2033, Alas, Babylon, EPICAC, the 2001 books, etc.

The Architect Saga-This was my first project and what got me into writing. It is a future history dealing with the Architects, pre-universal caretakers that can influence life and evolution, who exist to keep the peace and balance within the universe. Their motives revolve around producing beings that can serve the same purpose as caretakers of other universes. The architects are only going to exist long enough to set the few species they choose for this task on their way, and then they will self-terminate to prevent unraveling the universe too much(they ocassionally can travel back and forth in time to plan the evolution of sentient species).

The first book deals with the changes Earth faces after an asteroid related crisis. The asteroid(which is really an instrument crafted by the architects to impede the growth of the Human race) emits an invisible material that spurs evolutionary growth ten-fold. Over the course of 1,000 years, a great chunk of all organisms in existence evolve on a planned path as if 5 million years were to pass. Others terminate naturally, simulating natural evolution. Suddenly, two new sentient species evolve: the Ferron(sapient canids) and the Karram(distant relatives of the monitor lizard). The whole purpose of the experiment is to get Humans and the other two species to make peace, testing if they are ready to enter the interstellar age in which they will no doubtedly meet others. I've been working on it for three years now.

The second book deals with the state of all three Earthborn species as they settle into Galactic society. The main character is a Human xenoarchaeologist named Daren who has dreams of the past prophetic visions of the future and beyond. It's told through the course of years, depicting society and major events across the course of 60 years. I've been working on this alongside the first book.

The third book deals with the first travels to Andromeda from the point of view of a far-less advanced native species and post-beings. I'm still working out the details. It might just be a short story or novella. I hope to tell more stories, but I haven't concieved them yet.

Spider's Web- This book deals with superluminal communication between Human's and a somewhat avian alien species living in the Tau Ceti system. The book deals with the entropy of common sense and society as an imminent catastrophe throws the alien civilization into chaos and Earth, incapable of superluminal travel as of yet, cannot do anything.

Untitled Novella- I've been writing this for 2 months. It is a fantasy novella about the slavery of Humans by Dragons. It's told from the point of view of an obediant servant named Meera who serves as an aide to a prominent but benevolent Draconic politician. When a Dragon activist pushes for abolition, she begins to question her servitude. Majorly influenced by Cry The Beloved Country and Shakespeare's Caesar.

Organicide- This novella has been giving me major writers' block for some time. It is an allegorical sci-fi that deals with the systematic genocide of Organic Humans by Post-Humans. It is the only one of my projects written in the first person.



BrandonSP
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15 Jan 2011, 5:32 pm

I have two writing projects in progress right now, both of them fantasy. The first one is a short story and the second is a novel.

The Short Story: Desert barbarians attack an Egyptian-style kingdom, but since most of the kingdom's army is away at another war, the Pharaoh summons an army from a Spartan-style city-state to fight for him. Both sides have at their disposal very powerful sorcerors.

The Novel: I haven't figured out the plot 100% yet, but it's set in a land based on West Africa, but with dinosaurs and other prehistoric reptiles instead of modern African wildlife. The heroine is the princess of a Yoruba-style kingdom who must become a warrior. I know she will fight some dinosaurs, but I haven't decided on what her main antagonist will be.


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ShenLong
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17 Jan 2011, 3:06 pm

FrodoLlama wrote:
What I Write:
Novellas
-Prison Break (I've never seen the show), the unfinished trilogy of 5 sets of brothers who all struggle to survive and find each other in a postapocalyptic, robot run wasteland. After they find each other, time travel enters the picture.

-Real Life Heroes (a sequel is sort of being worked on) The tale of a superpowered female and her plunge ino a ragtag team of superheroes. The sequel works a bit more actively on trying to destroy all of time and space about six seperate ways.

Short Stories
A Cobra A Day- What's toxic to an alien?

The Infinite Man- What strange fate might befall the man who learns to control all spacetime?

The Death and Life of 14RR-E -The tale of an artificial afterlife and the dark things that may inhabit it. Also, it's an allegory on the human condition, or whatever the fancy term is for complacent laziness.

The Library Saga- Basically, a miniseries of short stories. Starts off as the tale of the Temporal Literature Agency, a crazy time-traveling organization that wants to collect all the booklsin the world, and who make their home in a rather Lovecraftian Library. Ends with the whole thing getting blasted apart as a means to prevent Lovecraftian Horrors from seeping into reality.

The Library Saga 2- The name i'm giving to the next miniseries, which basically reveals that the Lovecraftian Horror the Library destroyed in order to stop all of reality from shattering like glass is a bit too strong. Never fear, though, because it's ccurrently stuck underneath of it! Now, there's just the matter of all of the protagonists running around alternate realities, trying either to release or kill it...

Radio Plays
The Haunted House- I don't even know. It's about... A Cold War Era AI in a guy's basement. Written really fast.

Fame and Pie- WELCOME TO THE WORLD'S FIRST AND LAST POSTAPOCALYPTIC SITCOM!

What I'm working on- Love, Crafts, Ian-
A Terry Pratchett take on H.P. Lovecraft.
or, in less Namey words-
A humorous take on Cosmic Horror.


All very interesting. :)