Why is it so wrong to like pop music?

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Laconvivencia
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03 Aug 2012, 4:54 am

There is absolutly no harm in liking Pop music. I would personally encourage it.



thewrll
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03 Aug 2012, 5:03 am

Again you should enjoy the kind of music you enjoy and not to pander to idiots in the inner circles.



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03 Aug 2012, 1:11 pm

Laconvivencia wrote:
There is absolutly no harm in liking Pop music. I would personally encourage it.


Thereis no virtue in listening to Pop, so why encourage it?

\m/


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Ascagne
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03 Aug 2012, 2:33 pm

You can like it. It's better maybe to know why and to understand the reason you like it, which is not always true talent, but (cultural-)industrial efficiency. Which is also true for many sorts of books, of movies, etc. There are of course many songs and albums that transcend that and that are art, of course.
The problem is when you listen only to it, or when you don't want to listen to art music, the classics, etc. It is not reversible : there is no problem in listening only to art music, or to works that have been recognized as good for some time, because they have as Ganondox would say "virtues" that are recognized (at least for the canon of works that are already a bit ancient at least). It brings much more things to you, usually.

The truth is that there already exist so many works of genius, whether it be in literature, in the arts, or in music, that in some way it can be seen as a pity that you would not profit of them as much as you could do
But, as Proust wrote, there are also some pleasures that you can only find in easy music, so...



Laconvivencia
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03 Aug 2012, 3:41 pm

Ganondox wrote:
Laconvivencia wrote:
There is absolutly no harm in liking Pop music. I would personally encourage it.


Thereis no virtue in listening to Pop, so why encourage it?

\m/


Because to integrate to the mainstream society. You can still like alternative music, but it is best to like mainstream music for social reasons.



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03 Aug 2012, 4:06 pm

Because people are snobs.


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SanityTheorist
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03 Aug 2012, 4:10 pm

I've noticed pop fans are ignorant and just like it to fit in. Hell, they recently had a study proving music is starting to all sound the same and is getting louder.


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MONKEY
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03 Aug 2012, 4:19 pm

SanityTheorist wrote:
I've noticed pop fans are ignorant and just like it to fit in. Hell, they recently had a study proving music is starting to all sound the same and is getting louder.


Popular music has always been the same, every decade or era has its signature sound. There's nothing new about that.
And what if you genuinely like music that happens to be popular? People can listen to what they want for whatever reason.

Music is meant to stimulate the senses, to entertain. People are entertained by different kinds of music, just because it's not some "deep", miserable, Johnny Cash-esque thing does not make it inferior.


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thewrll
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03 Aug 2012, 4:26 pm

A lot of people are saying it's ok to enjoy pop music. Just what is not right is to think that you have to listen to a genre and enjoy a genre to integrate into society.



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03 Aug 2012, 4:33 pm

thewrll wrote:
A lot of people are saying it's ok to enjoy pop music. Just what is not right is to think that you have to listen to a genre and enjoy a genre to integrate into society.


Indeed, I tried that with whole emo thing years back. I joined in mostly because I liked the clothes, but I listened to the music to try and get into the crowd, I wanted to broaden my social circle. Never worked of course, I could listen to all the emo bands I wanted but if I don't have a social butterfly personality it's pointless.
Though I did really like the clothes!


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03 Aug 2012, 4:46 pm

Laconvivencia wrote:

Because to integrate to the mainstream society. You can still like alternative music, but it is best to like mainstream music for social reasons.


How so? The very first post of this thread by MathGirl says that she finds it difficult to blend in with the crowd when it comes to musical tastes, because many people around her prefer to listen to more complex or alternative music.

That's also the irony of what this thread has become in the last 2-3 pages, as there seem to be two sides, one pro-Pop music which finds itself in the minority with Convivencia at its core, and the other rabidly anti-Pop, but both completely missing the point of MathGirl's original post.


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thewrll
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03 Aug 2012, 4:51 pm

The one thing that can be said about pop music is that it is the easiest to remix. I have never met a mainstream society where either hip-hop or pop are the main genres they enjoy, so I don't know what can be done.



AngelRho
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03 Aug 2012, 4:56 pm

SanityTheorist wrote:
I've noticed pop fans are ignorant and just like it to fit in. Hell, they recently had a study proving music is starting to all sound the same and is getting louder.

Louder music is more susceptible to analog compression and waveshaping. The result is a warmer sound quality that is more aesthetically appealing. Plug an electric guitar into a high-wattage amp, use the clean circuit, turn the gain to a moderately comfortable setting. You'll invariably get a thin, weak sound that isn't very musical. Turn up the gain and you'll get a sound that really fills up the room, and be sure to adjust the tone to get the right balance. Now switch to the drive circuit, really crank your gain and volume, play a few power chords, and it feels like the air really thickens up (in a good way). Dial your high EQ down a little bit to deemphasize the upper harmonics, and I'd put one of those bad boys up against an entire symphony orchestra any day.

Even better if you're using all-tube circuits for superior tone when the signal starts clipping.

Honestly, though, it's not so much that the music is really getting louder. There is an upper limit to how much signal a CD can convert before digital distortion occurs--and if you've ever heard digital distortion, you probably went temporarily deaf if you weren't writhing in pain. To accurately reproduce the intended recorded signal, you really do have to push your sound system, and the louder you push it, the better it sounds.

To be honest, though, the few times I hear pop music, I don't really get that impression. Most artists at some point have to become aware that this is going on and have to release some easy-listening kinds of stuff to cleans the aural palate. If you remember MTV Unplugged, there was a VAST difference in the aural perception of acoustic-driven music versus amplified sound. MTV Unplugged went a long way towards popularizing that sound, and before long alt-folk acoustic was all the rage. The music was still horrible--though I did like Sarah McLachlan and Sheryl Crow (and still do). But you had people like Jewel that really ruined it, and after that just a bunch of solo acts and bands that thought it was cool to make the least amount of sense as possible.

Thank goodness for the 2000s.

These days you have a more eclectic offering that more reflected the 80s. In my opinion, it really all kinda started getting back on track with Creed, and then you had singers like Amy Winehouse (RIP) and Adele more recently. And Natasha Bedingfield. I don't even mind Ke$ha. Or Orianthe. Or LMFAO.

But you do have people like Nikki Minaj who are just terrible. I gotta tell you, if you think pop/mainstream is awful NOW, you should have been a teenager when I was. It was the 7th level of Hell after 1989. Some of what you hear on mainstream pop top 40 radio NOW might actually be music. You couldn't really say that for a long time after Ace of Base.



Bun
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03 Aug 2012, 5:47 pm

Ascagne wrote:
You can like it. It's better maybe to know why and to understand the reason you like it, which is not always true talent, but (cultural-)industrial efficiency. Which is also true for many sorts of books, of movies, etc. There are of course many songs and albums that transcend that and that are art, of course.
The problem is when you listen only to it, or when you don't want to listen to art music, the classics, etc. It is not reversible : there is no problem in listening only to art music, or to works that have been recognized as good for some time, because they have as Ganondox would say "virtues" that are recognized (at least for the canon of works that are already a bit ancient at least). It brings much more things to you, usually.

The truth is that there already exist so many works of genius, whether it be in literature, in the arts, or in music, that in some way it can be seen as a pity that you would not profit of them as much as you could do
But, as Proust wrote, there are also some pleasures that you can only find in easy music, so...

One would need a clear definition of 'art music' or 'classics' to agree or disagree with your strong assertion.


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03 Aug 2012, 5:48 pm

CyclopsSummers wrote:
Laconvivencia wrote:

Because to integrate to the mainstream society. You can still like alternative music, but it is best to like mainstream music for social reasons.


How so? The very first post of this thread by MathGirl says that she finds it difficult to blend in with the crowd when it comes to musical tastes, because many people around her prefer to listen to more complex or alternative music.

That's also the irony of what this thread has become in the last 2-3 pages, as there seem to be two sides, one pro-Pop music which finds itself in the minority with Convivencia at its core, and the other rabidly anti-Pop, but both completely missing the point of MathGirl's original post.


I don't see the point in arguing over personal taste. I also don't equate "current top-40" and "pop". I consider "pop" to be a certain musical formula, involving a prevailing melody, steady cadence, and lots of repetition. These things are ubiquitous in modern music. A lot of bands that were/are considered complex or progressive (e.g. Pink Floyd, or Radiohead) still play music that is essentially pop at it's foundation. Therefore I'd consider it ridiculous to say you hate pop music unless the only thing you listen to is classical.



Ascagne
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03 Aug 2012, 6:23 pm

Quote:
One would need a clear definition of 'art music' or 'classics' to agree or disagree with your strong assertion.


The definitions on Wikipedia are clear if you want a start.

By the way, I don't understand this need to be mainstream as expressed by some people here. Being mainstream and fitting in society seem very different things to me. I'm rather sorry to say that, in my opinion, being mainstream and follow the masses if you take for reference society in general is not really the best way to chose...

Edit : Arf, excuse me, it seems I've confounded popular music and pop. Sorry. :roll: It doesn't change what I said, because pop is in popular music, but it was a bit out of place.