Does Shakespeare annoy the wits out of you?

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gnatterfly
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30 Oct 2011, 8:36 am

I am reading King Lear in my British Lit. Class this semester, and it annoys the daylights out of me....in fact, so does the rest of Shakespears's works!! :x
All the mistaken identity, the lack of communication amongst the characters, and the catty deception.. it's all so disorganized that it makes me want to take some extra time on the punching bag!
Anyone else hate Shakespeare for these reasons (or other reasons perhaps?) :?


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BrandonSP
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30 Oct 2011, 9:01 am

I would probably like Shakespeare if someone would just translate his prose into modern English.


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gnatterfly
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30 Oct 2011, 9:02 am

I love translating it!! ! I love the technical aspect. It's the situations that bug me :P


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safffron
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30 Oct 2011, 9:20 am

They're 16th Century soap operas, which explains their appeal. (I write the obvious,)


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DrewLewis
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30 Oct 2011, 10:33 am

Shakespeare's stories are pretty good. Some of them become great movies and pop culture success.



lelia
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30 Oct 2011, 11:13 am

TVland has its conventions; Shakespeare's time had its conventions. Neither are realistic. But, oh, the language and poetry of Shakespeare!



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30 Oct 2011, 1:43 pm

I've been assured over the years by pretentious literature snobs that my dislike of Shakespeare is due either to my own stupidity or something being lost in translation between Middle English and Modern English. I don't buy it. Even when it's translated into Modern English, I still don't find Shakespeare nearly as brilliant and clever as he's made out to be. I wonder how many people genuinely enjoy Shakespeare and how many people simply nod their heads in polite reverence.

According to this article, I'm not alone:

Quote:
1. Voltaire called Shakespeare’s works an “enormous dunghill.”

2. Tolstoy was equally unimpressed, calling Will’s writing “Crude, immoral, vulgar and senseless.”

3. George Bernard Shaw really waxed poetic about how much he hated Shakespeare. “There is no eminent writer, not even Sir Walter Scott, whom I despise so entirely as I despise Shakespeare,” he said. “It would be positively a relief to me to dig him up and throw stones at him.” But there was a writer he hated more – Homer.

4. British poet Walter Savage Landor had no love lost for the prolific writer either, and apparently would have been a great fit at Saveur or Bon Appetit: “The sonnets are hot and pothery, there is much condensation, little delicacy, like raspberry jam without cream, without crust, without bread.”

5. Charles Darwin may just have been too evolved for Shakespeare: “I have tried lately to read Shakespeare and found it so intolerably dull that is nauseated me.”

6. English playwright Robert Greene dismissed Shakespeare as a mere amateur who has been romanticized over the years, calling him “An upstart now beautified with our feathers.”

7. J.R.R. Tolkien, in speaking of his days at King Edward’s School, said that he “disliked cordially” the Shakespeare section of his English literature studies.

8. Dr. Samuel Johnson, a well-known English writer and scholar in the 1700s, had his red pencil out while reading Bill. “Shakespeare never had six lines together without a fault,” he once said. “Perhaps you may find seven, but this does not refute my general assertion.”

9. Samuel Pepys spent an evening watching A Midsummer Night’s Dream, then recorded in his diary that [he] “had never seen before, nor shall ever again, for it is the most insipid ridiculous play that ever I saw in my life.”

10. King George III was maybe not so firm in his hatred, but more disapproving of the melancholy turn many of Shakespeare’s works took. “Is this not sad stuff, what what?”



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30 Oct 2011, 4:35 pm

I actually kind of like Shakes....

Via my mediocre American education I've only been exposed to Julius Caesar, Romeo & Juliet, Macbeth, Hamlet, The Tempest, and maybe one or two more...

Sometimes getting through the plays was hard work, but I always found something worthwhile in them--something new to think about or something that improved me in some way.

The biggest problem with Shakespeare is the way his works are (usually) taught. Basically,students are simply charged with reading the works and perhaps told to look for certain themes... The thing is, these works are meant to be experienced as performance, not read! The language is difficult enough. This wrong approach to teaching simply compounds the problem of understanding them.

Here's the way I attack Shakespeare. I read the play. I watch the play. I read the play again and refer to a summary/analysis text such as 'no fear Shakespeare" if I'm still having problems grasping the meaning. Finally, I WATCH THE PLAY AGAIN!

This method is hard work, but sometimes that's what it takes.

As far as the OP's criticisms go, certainly, some of Shaky's methods and plot devices are a bit silly.

But there's also something basic, true, and compelling at the heart of his best stories that make them worthy of consideration. Who hasn't asked Hamlet's question or felt Romeo's passion? And don't get me started on Julius Caesar! There's so much there that people should be thinking about (fate vs free will, personal ambition vs public service, compromise vs stubbornness, the power of words and the danger of the mob, etc...) even though most people aren't... :roll:


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31 Oct 2011, 1:52 am

Call me a literate snob, but I rather like Shakespeare. I admit, I only really came to have an appreciation for the bard while in college, when I had taken a required Shakespeare class, but it turned out to be one of the most enjoyable classes I had ever taken. I loved the language, as that it was almost foreign, but at the same time, it wasn't. The first assigned play, The Taming Of The Shrew, I admit I could barely make heads or tales out of. But as time passed, I had gotten use to the English of Shakespeare's time.
Without a doubt, my favorite play by Shakespeare is Othello, and, dare I say it, my favorite character was Iago. What can I say, I've got a soft spot for bad guys, and few can match Iago in villainy!

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31 Oct 2011, 1:19 pm

Jory wrote:
I've been assured over the years by pretentious literature snobs that my dislike of Shakespeare is due either to my own stupidity or something being lost in translation between Middle English and Modern English.

Shakespeare wrote in (early) Modern English. Middle English is older and considerably harder to understand* - it's still recognisably English, but there's a lot of different vocabulary and some odd letters. Old English is more or less German, as you'd expect.


*in that you could reasonably expect most people to read a Shakespeare play and more or less make sense of it, but they'd mostly be buggered trying to read Sir Gawain or even the Canterbury Tales (and utterly stumped with The Seafarer in OE. :) )


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blueroses
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31 Oct 2011, 7:57 pm

GoonSquad wrote:
The biggest problem with Shakespeare is the way his works are (usually) taught. Basically,students are simply charged with reading the works and perhaps told to look for certain themes... The thing is, these works are meant to be experienced as performance, not read! The language is difficult enough. This wrong approach to teaching simply compounds the problem of understanding them.

Here's the way I attack Shakespeare. I read the play. I watch the play. I read the play again and refer to a summary/analysis text such as 'no fear Shakespeare" if I'm still having problems grasping the meaning. Finally, I WATCH THE PLAY AGAIN!

This method is hard work, but sometimes that's what it takes.


Very true and a good approach for teaching all drama. If someone isn't going to teach it that way, I think they should just stick with covering his poetry.



gnatterfly
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03 Nov 2011, 6:38 pm

I don't like TV either...so that probably explains it....I can't stand the lack of communication between characters!! ! These stories are dull, long-winded and pointless!


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03 Nov 2011, 8:05 pm

I hear William Shakespeare is going to start a blog called http://tobeornottobe.blogspot.com/

Doth he dare Sir Brootay? He doth! Well play William, well played.



monkees4va
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05 Nov 2011, 6:19 pm

HATE his works. Think the man did an awful lot for the english language and I respect him for that, but honestly I find his works teeth-pullingly awful. It's actually the main reason I'm put off studying for an english degree, as two thirds of it will be based around his works.


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blueroses
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06 Nov 2011, 10:52 am

monkees4va wrote:
It's actually the main reason I'm put off studying for an english degree, as two thirds of it will be based around his works.


I'm not sure how it is in the UK, but I managed to get an English degree in the US with studying Shakespeare only in a 200-level English lit course and a senior seminar in Shakespeare, both of which were mandatory. I did a lot of American lit and journalism coursework instead. But, there are plenty of other reasons not to get an English degree, so I'm not really trying to sell you on it ...



gnatterfly
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07 Nov 2011, 7:34 pm

Teeth-pullingly!! I like that Monkee4eva!! I couldn't agree with you more!!


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