I Need Your Opinions On A Difficult Situation!

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I have five main issues with my fiancee:

1.) She has terrible personal hygiene (i.e. doesn't brush her teeth, takes a shower once a week, etc.) and has a BMI of 75 (which is up 20 points since we first met).

2.) She refuses to keep the house even remotely clean (i.e. dishes all over the sink/counter, empty bottles/boxes & clutter everywhere).

3.) She comes up with a budget, but then does not stick to it, puts nothing into savings, and then wonders why we are having financial difficulties (I help out with the rent and other small things).

4.) She puts her work (45 hr/week plus she volunteered for weekend duties) and her best
friend before me.

5.) Her attitude towards life is "I enjoy the journey and take everything on a whim" with no life purpose; she quits everything from craft projects to college if it no longer serves a purpose.

Whenever I try to talk things out like an adult (nothing like learning tact on the fly!) and make suggestions, she throws a temper tantrum and tells me to "get out."

Is there anything else that I can do? Or should I "get out" the next time she throws a temper tantrum?

Disclaimer: I hate giving advice. People take it, it doesn't work, then blame the advisor.

That said, I have experience with women like this. MY experience with MY situations tells me that she won't change. It doesn't matter what you do, she will not change except through the natural evolution of the personality, and then you're stuck with the product of said evolution, which may or may not be what you wanted.

I faced the same choice, and eventually, after learning the above lesson, got out, because the alternative was intolerable to me. You need to evaluate which would cause you the most distress, leaving or dealing with what you've described on a daily basis. I don't see another alternative, but I am not in your situation, so I cannot be sure. All I know is what I've dealt with.

As far as the untidiness, lack of hygene and spending go, she may be depressed. Maybe she would benefit from some kind of counselling, although she may toss you into the street again if you suggest it. It's quite selfish of her to put her passing crankiness ahead of the well-being of someone she claims to love.

If she keeps telling you to "get out" every time she gets pissy, I think you should at least have figured out where you can go in case she actually means it one of these times. Do you have friends you can crash with, parents who would let you move back in until you find a new apartment, anything like that?

As far as the finances go, I think you should have a bank account that is only yours that you can start saving some money in - just because she's comfortable living paycheck to paycheck is no reason you should have no security. I would be stressed out to no end if I didn't have something saved for a rainy day. Also, you should not tap into this savings when she gets into financial difficulties. If she wants to live on-the-edge and she has you to bail her out every time she gets into trouble, she will never have any reason to straighten out her act. Letting her have the consequences to her choices is the only way she'll learn to make better choices - what's called "tough love" in some circles.

As far as the hygene, untidiness and your being the last in line for her time/attention, only you can decide if this is something you can live with permanently - do not think she will change, if you were that important that she would change for you, she would have done it already. You're only affianced right now...she is probably not going to become more malleable later on, when she has your commitment.

I think if she puts you last behind work and social acquaintances, and if she keeps throwing you out every time things don't go her way, she doesn't value you. I personally wouldn't stay with her - if she's willing for you to go out on the street every time she's cranky, she's not concerned about your well-being and she doesn't deserve you. That's just my opinion, you have to decide for yourself. At the very least, though, if you decide to stay with her set up the bank account, start saving, and have someplace lined up to go if she tosses you out - it's your responsibility to provide yourself some security, you cannot and should not leave that to anyone else.

Don't worry duncan, I won't blame you if something doesn't work out. I've actually been on several other forums with this problem and they've all said more or less the same things you have.

The problem, as you say, is deciding which way I want to go. It's tearing me up inside since I don't have any flesh and blood friends, just pen pals and electronic friends and she's really the only "friend" that I have in everyday life. I'm just tired of being a doormat, but being passive by nature I have a hard time sticking up for myself...maybe this is the lesson this relationship is trying to teach me?

There really is only one question you should ask yourself.

Do you love her?

If the answer is yes, then it is worth trying to work it out.

If the answer is no, then there is no reason to stick around.

If you are with her out of comfort and companionship, well my friend, that isn't enough.

Forget about the hygene and the messy house. The budget thing can cause a lot of grief down the line.

Dump her and get out NOW! She sounds exactly like my ex-wife and getting a divorce was the best thing that ever happened to me. These types of women are completely incapable of change. Get rid of her now, you won't regret it.

1.) Her entire family is pretty much like this too. Her mother is bankrupt, in serious debt, and is living on a thread and does not want to do anything about it. She comes from a family that believes that it's wrong to get outside help.



2.) I already do, my mom would let me live with her until I would be able to get my own apartment. If anything, I am a super-organizer/planner.



3.) I have both my own savings and checking accounts and I have drained them both making up for her lack of frugality. Yes, I am crawling up the walls with not having much in savings, but I did that to myself and it's my responsiblity to get out of it, which is why I have set a personal boundary of half the rent, groceries, and utilities starting in January. (We'll just have to see how that goes.)





As for the last two points, I see what you are getting at and like I said to duncan above, for the first time in my life I'm actually standing up for myself (only took 28 years), but it's a very scary proposition for me. However, I do have another plan too: next time that I try to talk with her and give her suggestions and she tells me to "get out" I'm going to do just that permanently. It's time that I take care of myself; I've already accepted that I am different from mostly everyone else and that those differences are not something of which I should to be ashamed of (thanks WP!)

Now it's time to put that self-acceptance/love into action and follow through on my Goethe quote. Hopefully, I will have learned my lesson with this relationship and learn to be a little more observant and discerning in future endeavors.

I do love her a lot, but the problem is when I try to work it out with her, tell her my thoughts (which takes A LOT of courage on my part) she gets totally pissed off at me and tries to kick me out of the house. Even when she does take my very practical suggestions, she cannot stick with them for more than a week or two at a time, which is irritating considering that I have had to show a lot of determination and willpower to overcome all of the different obstacles in my life, including AS. I just don't understand why she cannot do the same: it's not very logical to me!

Last edited by Plutonian_Persona on 28 Dec 2007, 12:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Plutonian (you don't mind if I call you by your first name, do you?), there's a metaphor I use for people like this, and have had to explain to my wife as well:

Think of yourself as a scuba diver, and the people in your life as equipment. Your SO is being a weight belt. Now remember, the very purpose of a weight belt is to keep you under water - in fact, it really wants to drag you all the way down. Sometimes, it's necessary to cut loose of the weight belt, so you can swim toward the surface.

Judging by what you said about her family, she's going to keep on being a weight belt, too. She's an adult now, and only a profound realization of what's bad about her situation can possibly make her want to change it. And as long as you're there to keep her off the bottom, that's not going to happen. My advice, and worth every penny I'm sure, is to do what's best for both of you - cut loose, and swim.

Deacon, I don't mind that you call me my "first" name at all. Thanks for the advice through metaphor too: it makes a lot of sense. I always think that I can be a positive catalyst for change and "save" people from their troubles. I never realize that some people cannot be changed no matter hard one tries because they have to be their own catalyst.

To use your metaphor: She's going to drown in life and I'm going to swim!

I do kinda have to go with the consensus. You seem to love her, but does she truly return this? I have a daughter, and she is the center of my universe. I love her very much, and I would do and have done anything I need to so she will be happy.

I also have a doormat. It's a very useful tool.

If you are being treated like this, and no end is in sight, and any attempt by you to change the situation is met the way it is, it would seem to me to be a clear--and very difficult choice. It may be that leaving spurs her toward real change, and you two can work it out. It could be that leaving is the end for the two of you, and new beginnings for you both. But I've been in that place you get when the one you love sees you as a useful tool, and beats you down in the process. Not a good place, and the longer you stay in that place, the harder--and more necessary--it will be for you to leave.

Material love is her m.o. (i.e. what have you bought for me lately to show you care?) I can't afford to buy her the things she wants everyday, because I don't work right now, although it is not for lack of trying (reference: 200 apps and 30 interviews).

As a matter of responsibility and "pulling my weight" I do all of the cooking, cleaning, taking care of the dogs, and other domestic chores plus pay half the rent and chip in for groceries. I also go to interviews, informational sessions, and any other job related information I can get my hands on.

I show her that I care by:telling her that I love her everyday, that she is still beautiful in my eyes even though she is big, and that I am concerned for her health and safety if she continues on the path she is on right now. I also give her backrubs when she's had a tough day, let her cry on my shoulder whenever she wants, etc.

Yet, it is like I have said above, all I hear is:

"Why don't you take me to dinner?"
"My friend says this the correct way of doing this, she's right, you're not."
"My friend does this with her best friend, why don't you do that with me."
"You never have any fun and dance at large parties, I do" (and this is after explaining my disability).

Well, it's like I said above also, if the situation isn't improving soon and I sit her down again and get the temper tantrum, I'm gone because I have a lot of life to live and a lot of love to give. For the first time in my life I LOVE myself and I'm not going to be weighed down anymore.

THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR YOUR ADVICE AND SUPPORT!

It sounds like you're very good to her and could probably do better. I only know one Aspie guy (who I'd like to know a lot better), but I don't understand why you all think that women don't like you or appreciate you. You must not have met the right girls yet.

Any suggestions about how I could be doing any better? If you name it, I've probably done it.

I meant meet a girl who treats you better. Online dating seems to work for me (even though I think I'm NT, I think it's easier to meet men online).

Oops...I took your sentence a little too literally/pedantically (as usual), my fault! Anyway, it seems like I am attracted to women who have no sense of self-esteem or self-love, but that's probably because I have never really liked or understood myself until now. In fact, all of the women that I have gone out with for the last 10 years, I have met through online dating.