Betraying an aspie...

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Because being loyal has nothing to do with forgiving, and Aspies NEVER forget anything...especially when they have been wronged.

Aspies are loyal, you're right about that. But they are in no way forgiving. This is because Aspies are very methodical. They see black and white. They see 1, then 2, then 3. Basically, Aspies are very judgemental between right and wrong. When it comes to being loyal, they'll be loyal as hell until you betray them. After that, you'll see the full force of the emotionless unforgiving heart that the Aspie is cursed with. They can be COLDER than COLD.

Thats funny cause its part of my way of living to forgive everyone and anyone no matter what. To find a way to forgive them, even if I still believe they may need punishment to learn.

I guess because when I was younger I despised myself at such a level and thought I was so "wrong" compared to those around me that I constantly messed with people in order to push them away.

So it became one of my goals to have limitless compassion, granted it doesn't work half the time but still, if I have been wronged I like to try understand WHY they have wronged me, whether its really something I have the right to be angry over, and whether its more important that I release my anger to them or in another medium that can maybe help others.

I do not forget, but I do forgive.

I feel I don't really care about anyone, like a soulless machine, and yet at the same time somehow because of this I feel I don't need to take revenge, maybe since I've found music people just don't have the ability to hurt me.

I have been lied to by another aspie. I am usually forgiving when the person says they'll never do it again. But this aspie has repeatedly lied. First he told me he was 25 when we first met online and then after I told him my age he said he was 15. He explained to me why he lied and I forgave him thinking it was just that one time. Then he told me he was born in February 1987 and told me this story about him being at an amusement park in summer of 1989. Then he changed his birth date to November 1987 and it confused me because I said I thought you said you were born in feb. 1987 and he said "No I said I was born in November 1986."

I don't remember other lies he has told me but he has told me quite a few so I wasn't even sure if if any other stories he has told me were lies too or the truth and I wasn't even sure if he was going to keep lying so I said I didn't want to talk anymore since he can't be honest. He apologized again and said he doesn't trust people online so he lies and I said so why does he talk to them then. Don't even bother if he can't trust anyone because I sure don't like being lied to. We never spoke again.


There was this other aspie I knew in real life. I call him The Dev-Man because he was a bully and very manipulative and mentally ill. He was a chronic lair, abused his mother to get his way, bullied teachers and kids in his school, bullied my brothers too behind my back and he lie about it. I felt betrayed by him because I thought he was a real nice kid but he turned out to be nasty and I thought all aspies were like that for awhile and thought that was how I'm supposed to act till I joined aspie groups. I also felt he took advantage of my by using my naivity by making up stories because he knew I'd fall for them but my mother told me that was not what he did because he does it to everybody.


So I guess I'm different than the majority of the aspies because I am forgiving and I always believe they mean it when they say they never do it again but when they do keep on doing it, I stop believing them and trusting them and kick them out of my life.

Yeh it seems quite easy to end up going down that path. I was myself for a while because I felt if I didn't really care about anyone why should I bother being nice to them.

Until I discovered the wonders and returns of respect.

I still feel what most call truly giving is really selfish ego-boost material but at least I feel I'm being honest with myself.


A lot of us are forgiving i'm sure, there as a be a point though, a line in which you do not let others use and abuse you.

I can't speak for anyone but myself. But I see a big difference between forgiving and trusting. Forgiveness is a gift granted, but once betrayed, trust must be re-earned. I will forgive anyone anything, but once my trust is betrayed, I do not give it out again lightly.

As an example: my father bullied me into giving him the logs of private conversations on MSN between my husband and my mother. He betrayed my trust, because he knows that I cannot disobey someone if they're in my face ordering me about and he took advantage of me. That was nearly four years ago. I haven't spoken to him since. I forgave him long ago, and bear him no ill will. I wish him all happiness. But I cannot and will not trust him, and as such I cannot allow contact between us, because I cannot trust that he will not take advantage of me again.

Very well stated. I don't know if I trust anyone completely, I feel the only thing that gives back to me what I give to it is music.

Hmmn!

When I open up to someone, and they do or say something to me that really hurts my feelings, then I feel betrayed by them, and let the friendship live on in a state of mutual tolerance. I tell that to a lot of people, it works if you say it the right way. When one of those "friends" gets mad about that, just say "No, it's not that I don't like you. I just tolerate you."


Also, am I right by this? I let my friend borrow my Spanish book like everyday for a few weeks, and she'd give it back at Lunch. It worked the same way everyday. Then one day I notice she didn't give it back as soon as I walk in, which she usually does. Upon asking where my book is, she's like "Oh I almost forgot! I think someone accidently picked it up but I'll get it back!" My Aspie mind, I think "oh crap I lost my book I lost my book!". Lo and behold, two days later, I come into Spanish class and my book is on the back table. She proved irresponsible. Yet the next day, she asks "Hey can I borrow your Spanish book?" And looked obviously offended when I wouldn't lend it to her. Is there any problem in that?

When I give someone my trust, I give it all...not just some of it. When someone betrays me, they take all of that trust away. Since I gave it all at first, I have none left for them.

I don't think this is just an aspie thing...no one likes to be betrayed.

Well that depends. If you said it like: no because you're irresponsible then I can understand if she's offended. People can be like glass, and you have to say things carefully. If you did say it carefully it could be that she either did not, or did not know she left the book there but that somebody brought it back instead. And she is offended that you don't trust her.

If she DID forget it, then she is probably offended that you punish her for one small mistake. You have borrowed the book to her for a few weeks. And she only forgot it once. I would have said that the book is important to me, and that I really didnt like it that she lost it. And let her borrow it. (Make sure your name is on it though)

I can forgive most anything, but if I place my trust in somebody and they betray it...
I believe that trust is the most important thing in the world, the foundation on which love and friendship is build, if you betray someone who trusts you...

Lets just say that it is no coincidence that the 9th level of hell is reserved for betrayers.

I have been betrayed so many times by so called friends that I hardly trust anyone anymore.

When I meet someone new and see something about them that seems even the slightest bit untrustworthy (my standards may be a little too high), its extremely difficult, sometimes impossible them to earn my trust.

My mother has often said that anyone that manages to earn my trust must be a good person.

It's so hard to define betrayal. Is an e-mail of the "I still care about you but can't talk to you ever again" matter something that you would call betrayal? Since technically I haven't been betrayed in the literal sense, but I psychologically kind of feel that way. And it hurts so much since it's so hard for me to find people I can relate to. I don't trust most people nowadays so this gives few opportunities for betrayal. It's so hard to define "forgiveness". since my ex-girlfriend never betrayed me. but she left me. so technically she did nothing wrong. But I still feel *kind of * betrayed. I don't dislike her and am still *very* emotionally attached to her, so the feelings are really really mixed. if she ever sent me an e-mail to me, I'd definitely respond, but with very mixed feelings (i don't know). I'm so tempted to wallow in my own self-pity that it's kind of sad.

...I just don'tknow...she told me that she's learned (through me) not to hurt people and to be mature. but by telling me those words, it feels like she used me. she told me that I had nothing left to offer to her (since she said that she changed). explicitly. it was honest and i valued that honesty. but it was so heart-wrenching that it's so hard for me to express my heartbreak other than to write on my emo-blog. I honestly' don't know. >...< it may last for a long time. the world is cruel. and few people care. the fact is that our genes are so overly focused on self-replication that it fills us up with all sorts of painful emotions. and the world is indifferent. it is. i wish i could make a god to believein. i don't know.. if you're curious, you can try to go to http://simfish.wordpress.com which is my current blog. maybe i can express myself a bit better there.

I've been betrayed a few times. I did not take it well, I'll admit. The guy that betrayed me the worst was someone that I never forgave. Depends on the level of betrayal, I think, at least for me.
When I was 13, I liked/loved the guy that I mentioned. I wanted to talk to him and he would say things to me, and then tell my friends something opposite. I was friends with him, and the entire thing was terribly confusing. I told him that I liked him once over IM and I got no response. Told him another time, and he said he loved me. He made it sound like a relationship. I was confused. I had no idea how things were. A friend asked for me and the guy told him that he was dating some other girl. I was broken. I had another friend who was there for me and I made a choice. I told him off in just two words "f--- you." I wanted to talk to him after that to clarify, maybe to make the break a bit cleaner. After that, I've only seen him once, last year. I never forgave him in words, mentally I have though.
Seems I never learned though, 'cause something similar happened after that. I hope that I've learned now. I do find it difficult to be in a relationship now, which is why I haven't been in one since June. Too confusing and painful.

Painful topic for me, this, tonight. I'm an Aspie woman with a former friend who is plainly Aspie. After months of trying to sort out the friendship after a row, I asked him, "Are we OK?" He told me he didn't want to talk to me. He would not say why. He did this in front of others, seemed very pleased with himself, and hurt me to the heart. Later I found out he does this - is all charming and chatty to women new to the place where I encounter him, then just turns - withdraws, is silent and angry. Usually he asks them out and they refuse (I asked him out and he said No, which I accepted - no grudge!) It doesn't sound Aspie - it sounds highly planned and manipulative - but he has some major Aspie traits - obsessions, strict routines, monologuing, sensitivities to light, heat and sound, very poor at friendships - doesn't hold conversations: lectures people. Also when he rejected me he had been trying to charm some new woman, and anyone at all skilled in mind-games would never have let the mask slip like that.

I reacted angrily to his angry behaviour, several times: but really there is no "reason", there is no "betrayal." I think the present blanking may be due to the fact that I am friends with people he dislikes, and maybe thinks I'm ganging up on him (a breath-taking insult to me, fif so).

And I too, before I gained insight, took grudges to ridiculous lengths. I was as angry and unforgiving as him. I assumed I was right and they were EVIL.

So what I have to say is this: Be sure that the "betrayal" really was a betrayal. We are hyper-sensitive to everything. We find even friendship difficult. We find it very, very hard to trust people. On the one hand, we can be taken for a ride by genuinely abusive people. On the other, we can turn on true friends because we don't understand their motives. It's a tough one and I have no answers. But we need to know that we, too, can be in the wrong.

That doesn't speak for everyone here. I'm pretty forgiving - some would say too forgiving.

I guess in addition to Asperger's, I also have Benefit-of-the-doubt syndrome.

I can relate to this. Unfortunately, this time my behavior might be getting construed as "betrayal."I was friends with this woman that I met at a support group. The friendship lasted over a year. Over time, she began to wear on my nerves. She was loud, emotional, and needy. Of course, being an Aspie I couldn't process this right away. I began to avoid her not sure why she was upsetting me so. I met a wonderful guy, and my time began to be consumed by this new relationship. She began to press me to hang out with her, even though I had told her that I was in a new relationship. As an Aspie, I have never been able to juggle multiple friendships. Also, she began to behave strangely. She would call, and ask if it was alright to come over. Sometimes I would agree. Then, she wouldn't show up. Once she invited me to accompany her and her daughter to the beach. I waited all morning, left a few messages, only to have her call me later and say she had forgotten that she invited me. Also, since she was being whiny and insecure, even stating that she was envious of my new boyfriend, I stopped calling her or accepting invitations to hang out. My counselor advised me to let the friendship "die a natural death." For a month, I didn't hear from her, then I accepted one call. I wanted to end the friendship, but didn't know how. So I said nothing. A month after that, my boyfriend and I were shopping, and ran into her. The hurt look on her face almost made me cry. But I didn't know what to say. Maybe she felt betrayed by me?