Alpha females

Post Reply New Topic

There's no arguing that humans don't live in packs. And if you had honestly taken serious biology and zoology, I don't think you'd be arguing what you are now.

0_equals_whatever, your argument basically says: Humans exhibit pack behavior, but isn't truly pack behavior for some reason I'll remain unclear about, so instead will write some long lecture to seem more educated than I probably am.

I stopped taking you seriously at all when you made the claim that humans can't be Alpha Males.

Pack behavior is exhibited in this very thread. You're seen as someone with more posts by raccooneyes, thus easier to stand beside, and I'm the lone wolf, so I am to be argued against regardless of what my argument is. You could have argued that elephants are the fastest flying creatures on the planet, and raccooneyes still would have been compelled to agree with you. A bit of an exaggeration, but you get the idea.

Wrong again, humans have never exhibited pack behaviour.

I have quite bit of interest in pack behaviour in wild dogs such as dingoes and in wolves, because there are certain behaviours that domesticated dogs can exhibit that don't happen in the wild. This shows our influence on dogs and potentially other animals.

You clearly don't know what pack behaviour is. You are using very lapse and vague assertions.

Saying that human exhibit pack behaviour is like say sheep exhibit shoal behaviour. Just complete nonsense.

Dude that fact that you are on the internet arguing with me, and you have a roof over you head means you are not a lone wolf, but frankly it irrelevant how you think of yourself.

for the record i think the whole thing is silly.
i'll just repeat what i said about alpha males to save typing anything new because it's pretty much the same arguement anyhow

What. Case.

...?

All you've managed to say in all of those long paragraphs is:

"Humans aren't pack animals, they don't have packs, no packs."

I mean seriously. Why don't you realize this? At least I've come forward and pointed out that in human groups there is the leader/Alpha. And even more than that, I pointed out human FAMILIES.

What is a family if not a pack? Answer that question.

What. Is. A. Family. If. Not. A. Pack.

???

And how is behavior in a human family so unlike the behavior in say, a wolf pack?

Parents. Sound familiar? Alpha Male/Female.

Spanking and Discipline. Sound familiar? Alpha asserting authority over a lower-ranking member (for better or worse)

Teenagers getting kicked out of the house. Sound familiar? A wolf pack casting out a member who then becomes a lone wolf.

Argue against that. I'd love to see you try. And don't dodge these questions. Answer them individually. Don't give me some long paragraph that dances around subjects, face these subjects and answer to them. If you aren't willing to do that I don't ever want to hear that you had any sort of argument.

I'm really failing to see the point of any of this. Humans appoint themselves "leaders" of groups (in arenas like politics, for example, they often get elected to such positions) for a variety of reasons; other people either defer to that power dynamic, challenge it, or ignore it altogether - again, for a variety of reasons. "Lead, follow, or get out of the way," innit?
Personally, I prefer to walk off in a semi-perpendicular direction from both leader *and* group, but that's just me.

Now, despite my experience as an “alpha female” in a context that comes reasonably close to the analogy of alpha status in other species, there is a lot to be said for ignoring the whole concept of “alpha” status in the human realm. It’s too confusing, and I don’t think it really has significance in a dating or romantic context. A less confusing set of terms might be nice.

0_equals_true wrote some very thoughtful and clearly well-informed thoughts about the differences between the way humans live and the way true pack-animals live.

I’d like to add that we don’t generally see a subordinate human tear the throat out of the alpha male or rip off certain reproductive thingies in order to become the leader. Human males don’t usually come into a new community by killing off the previous males and then kill all the babies (Except when our leaders get the young men all programmed for war and send them off to commit attrocities in foreign lands, but that’s another discussion)!

The opportunity to become an alpha female in the true pack-sense is pretty limited. Family groups are not the same. My experience running a small business probably comes closest, and it had enough in common that I could FEEL a difference in status.

In fact, when we closed down that business, even though it made sense to do it (we had a more lucrative enterprise to run) I felt a sense that I had lost a huge chunk of my identity. That had been my little “empire” to run. My employees....

People who had plantations with slaves or hired hands probably were aphas in a similar sense. They were a mini-aristocracy in a little world of their own, and other people they could give orders to.

But these circumstances are so rare. I guess one question would be whether there truly are similar opportunities within corporations.

Still, I fail to see much connection with dating.

Peope DO respond to lower or higher status individuals in predictable ways. I think that's an easier way to talk about the topic that (I imagine) the poster really would like to address.

I am indifferent toward them.

Masculine women and feminine men. I like this. I want to find myself a scrawny little male Beatles fan and take him to my apartment. I'd like to hold him against my door and give him some knock out kisses and tell him that he has to marry me and take my last name, if he wants sex from me.

Here's the song

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6869FHpbliI[/youtube]

Condoms are also very important. I want the pleasure and not the parental responsibility. If he doesn't believe in condoms, it's right to the next 130 lb Beatles fan, until I find one.

Humans are WAY more then a ranking.

We're more like a set of sliders set from 0 to 100

But..yeah... IN THEORY, "Alpha" 's and all their will-imposing will do fine around other alpha's: Mutual respect and understanding.... And lower ranks....Domination.
The reverse is true when you're further DOWN the ladder.

This theory, however, is invalid:p