A True Nice Person

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No.

I'm really hoping others can refrain from posting bitter and nasty comments in here. When one thinks of being a true nice guy, that man will likely have to sacrifice something that matters to them for something even bigger than their ego. Hopefully the sacrifice is for good.

This is why I'm Christian, Jesus was the ultimate nice guy.

hmmm I'm sure a lot of women wouldn't mind that

There was this recent video which I quite liked

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rZu-tBi7DM

Can take no for an answer.

Oddly enough, from my pov, the totality of the Gender Wars is "please let's not say horrible things about women in this place, and if they are said, let's moderate them." That this constitutes a war is very strange to me.

Anyway. The thing about being nice in difficult circumstances, right on time.

I don't really think about "being nice", though. The things I think about are:

- interpret intentions generously (unless someone's plainly and repeatedly being an ass, but even then, global comments on the person aren't necessary)
- if someone needs help and you can give, do (unless they're simply draping themselves on you and taking advantage)
- don't screw people over
- clean up after yourself
- look for ways to encourage
- do your work well and honestly, with attention to what the client/user/etc actually needs, not what you think they should need
- show the love
- be sympathetic, but fair
- don't turn the other cheek, because masochism why, but retaliate seldom, definitively, and advisedly, because things suck when people fight
- which includes counting to ten
- given the opportunity to be sour/resentful v. generally pleased, pick the latter
- be aware that everybody's got trouble
- a long and thoughtful view is a good thing to have
- as is the idea that you might be wrong
- also the idea that on the off chance that your own experience is useful to someone else, it'll probably be in some way you wouldn't think of

When I think "nice", I don't think in terms of heroic sacrifice; I don't think heroic sacrifice really lends itself to niceness. Nor do I think of it as abject selflessness. A simple recognition that other people are important too, that seems to be plenty.

It's "Gender Wars" because we are fighting each other on the basis of Gender.

I never stated there was anything wrong with moderating sexist comments on an equal basis with racial/ethnic comments.

I absolutely agree with Tarantella's notions pertaining to "niceness."

I have to take partial issue with this. One could be inadvertently misinterpret what they need. One may think he knows what the client or user needs but really does not. One could be dealing in an unknown, unknown here meaning that one does not know that he does not truthfully know what the client needs but the person may think he knows what the client needs.

How does one discern what the client needs from what one thinks the client needs? For example, many people there misunderstood what you said when you meant that your ex-bf was AS and clueless. Many people including I inadvertently thought an universal was applied instead of a particular meaning you were just talking about him only.

It took me a long time to re-analyze that to realize I made that error in my interpretation. For whatever reasoning, I and others applied a universal to a particular when we shouldn't have applied the universal. I can't for the life of me figure why I did that.

Do you understand what I'm asking?

I have to take partial issue with this. One could be inadvertently misinterpret what they need. One may think he knows what the client or user needs but really does not. One could be dealing in an unknown, unknown here meaning that one does not know that he does not truthfully know what the client needs but the person may think he knows what the client needs.

How does one discern what the client needs from what one thinks the client needs? For example, many people there misunderstood what you said when you meant that your ex-bf was AS and clueless. Many people including I inadvertently thought an universal was applied instead of a particular meaning you were just talking about him only.

It took me a long time to re-analyze that to realize I made that error in my interpretation. For whatever reasoning, I and others applied a universal to a particular when we shouldn't have applied the universal. I can't for the life of me figure why I did that.

Do you understand what I'm asking?

Last edited by cubedemon6073 on 29 May 2014, 12:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Admitting you do want your "nice guy"'ness to be returned by kindness and love is the biggest internal hypocrisy struggle a "nice guy" has. Some say that admitting it, or even thinking it is what makes you "not a nice guy", but I disagree on that.

I think so. Try it like this: Often, someone who's providing a service to a client and is very strongly focused on doing a good job is working towards his own idea of what "a good job" means. The code should be clean and nifty to a particular standard, the cake should have this ratio of cake to frosting, the tabletop should be made to last X years. And if he were the client, that'd be fine. But he's not the client. Very often the client will actually say, "I don't need it to be pretty; I just need it to work" or "I'm only going to use it for a summer" or what have you -- and then the maker will ignore what the client says, and make the thing to his own much higher, or otherwise different, standards instead.

That's not a good thing to do -- not only is it disrespectful of the client, it often leaves the client with something that's unnecessarily expensive or useless. I have actually kicked IT guys out of my office because they wanted to build a network of beauty, and were willing to spend three hours futzing to make it happen. But I didn't want a network of beauty. I just wanted to print. Once we got to "can print", I wanted them out of my office. I've seen other people do this, too, and have even been told to my face, "oh, you don't want X, you want [much better thing that I like]."

Sometimes it takes time to understand -- or for the client to articulate -- what they really want. I've put together projects that were way over the top for client needs because I assumed that was the request, only to be reined in and told, "wait, no, we only need something like X." Something waaaay smaller. At which point I have to say, Oh, that's cool, we can do that, and scrap the other thing without delay.

The best way to find out is just to check in as frequently as their patience allows. "Is this pretty much what you were looking for?" And then you go from there. If they really don't know what they're after, you can give them samples/examples to choose from and try to navigate that way (like going to the optometrist -- is it better with one, or two? Three, or four?). You never really know, but paying attention and asking helps you get much closer.

Nice guys don't finish last. It is possible to be nice and to stand up for yourself if you are being mistreated. It is also possible to defeat your enemies while treating them with respect. I am generally a nice guy (helping because I have compassion, not expecting anything in return), but when someone disrespects me, they had better watch themselves. I don't like people who take niceness for weakness. I go into self-defense mode.

At work, a guy was treating me like a punk (I think it is because he is racist). I told him off without using curse words or threats of violence (even though I wanted to wring his neck. I don't like people who are racist or sexist). You know what happened after I stood up to him? He started treating me with respect. He also got in trouble with the managers. He got marginalized. He will probably end up getting fired. I just left that job and will have multiple good references because I treated everyone with respect and was nice to everyone (including him). He was a game-player who believed in the philosophy of every man for himself. Who won?

(Also, women started flirting with me after I stood up to him. I was nice but not a doormat. It works.)

No I'm a nice guy with girls and they've chosen me before anyone else but if they're the b*tchy type they'll more likely go with the bullies and with age it doesn't really matter that much what type you are It's just a childish thing, I know a stupid wannabe-bully idiot and he's not liked at all and he hasn't scored the nicest girls and he couldn't if he tried either, I'm sure most would pick a nice guy over him.

Yawn.

Nice guys don't finish last.

People with boring, unattractive personalites finish last.
I wish people would stop thinking their worst trait is being "Nice".

This.