Do women simply just dislike Aspie men?

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There you go, Karamazov is a prime example of someone who possesses the ability to self- examine, clarify and modify, a great asset indeed in relationships.

Also guys,
Read through Teach’s post above timestamped approx 45 mins before this one: a lot of the outline of problems she’s giving are also things that have proved to be an issue between me and Mrs K.
Some we’ve worked a way around.
Some we are still adjusting to, and may never find a final solution.
Some rise up as live issues: I had a meltdown this morning as a result of sensory issues brought on by all the shouting that ensued from me being an unresponsive blank when support was needed.
(Still headache and floaty feeling atm, but we’re ok again).

I think I said on another thread a month or more ago, and I’m going to repeat it:

Marriage is a contract you sign without having worked out any of the details: you spend the rest of your life working them out, changing them and re-changing them over again... and being held to account by them.
It’s not an end or a solution, but an alteration of the basic context from which you deal with all your problems: none of which are, or can be, ended or solved by it.
You do it together because love, even when it hurts and bewilders like nothing else... and it can be the source of joy beyond anything else too.
For better and worse as the service order doesn’t, but should, say.

I gave this advice to GI in the other thread; it’s very applicable here.

Btw, it’s an advice that I live it and do it.

Yes a meltdown often follows an argument with us too. It really illustrates to me the incredible depth of feeling that is generated and is not channelled effectively ,there is an abundance of feeling that can't find the correct exit point and seems to create a short circuit.

It is an intimate moment for me because I am made aware of the sheer intensity of his feelings, when I had previously thought he was being uncaring. This meltdown seems to say "I feel so intensely that I could explode but I don't have a clue what you need."

Some comments:

^I'm not picking you apart, Teach and you do acknowledge later in your post that your guy isn't devoid of emotion, but I'd point out in your quote above that given he can be emotional then rather than him having no ability to interact on "an" emotional level, he may have difficulty interacting on your emotional level (ie just different than his).



^Theory of Mind. Taken from AUSM.org: "Many people with autism struggle to understand that other people have different thoughts, beliefs, values, and experiences than their own, due to difficulty with theory of mind." It's good that you have the understanding to know that he's not being intentionally selfish or intentionally self-centered in that respect.



^This speaks to the fact that he's not "emotionally incompetent" but that you two have different ways of expressing emotion. Is one way "wrong" and one way "right"? Or are they just different?



^I don't know that "needy" is the word I'd use, but I do agree with you that many NT women go beyond having a desire for an autistic man to "know what they're thinking" (ie picking up on non-verbal communication or "emotional energy" as you put it), they actually have an expectation of it and an expectation that their man react to the perceived emotional cues in the moment. I say "perceived" because those emotional cues may be so subtle to even an NT man that it's unrealistic to expect the other person to pick up on them. I think the chasm between a person with those kinds of expectations (rather than being direct and making your needs and desires known in an obvious way) and a person who doesn't or can't pick up on such cues underlies the reality in my opinion that such NT women are not compatible with most autistic men and vice versa. Neither person is flawed, they're just not compatible. That's what the now defunct site heartlessaspergers got wrong. Blame was placed entirely on the autistic man in the relationship as being flawed and THE problem in the relationship. Wrong.

Regarding being direct and verbalizing your needs and desires in a relationship with an autistic man:

"When I'm feeling sad, I really appreciate if you [ ]."
"It really makes me happy or brightens my day if you [ ]."

The autistic man should take note of those kinds of things and do whatever is necessary to remember them. This can include putting a note in his calendar as a reminder and act on those things. If a woman would expect her man to spontaneously remember such things or worse, be hurt by the fact that doing such things isn't organic for him, those expectations would be unrealistic. That doesn't mean that he doesn't love or care about her. He's got a pretty "full plate" simply trying to navigate the world.

I agree with you, Teach that compromise in any relationship is a must. It's also a fact that relationships are work; they require attention, effort and a dedication to doing your best to contribute to the well being of your partner; notice I didn't say "make your partner happy". It's not a person's purpose in a relationship to "make their partner happy".

Thank you Magna. Not emotionally incompetent but different. I do realise that I am not "better" but that because it is an NT dominated world I am measuring according to those standards and that's unfair. We are definitely communicating in two different emotional languages and neither of us has an interpreter. What you have brought to my attention Magna is that it's just as frustrating and baffling for him.

Aside from all this stuff about “understanding” Aspie proclivities, the guy should have asked Teach how she was doing during her isolation.

Aspies aren’t total dummies.

He's taken.
Erm,
But not by me.
Hands off.

((((Pepe)))

"Love" is extremely seductive, but it doesn't change the fact it is a mechanism, designed by the evolutionary process, to facilitate the reproduction process.
I'm assuming you know this, and you are happy with the trade-off.

BTW,
If "sex" wasn't part of the deal, would you still have gotten "married"/defacto-ed?

Last edited by Pepe on 29 Apr 2020, 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

Erm,
Thanks,
But did you wash your hands first?

If you 2 weren't in a sexual relationship, would you put up with all the drama?
And if so, what the hell is wrong with you guys?

If it is companionship you want, doesn't it make more sense, in finding that with the same gender?
More in common. Fewer misunderstandings.

This monogamous relationship is merely a social construct, for the purpose of, predominately, reproduction.

I would put up with all the drama, I do that unconditionally with people I care about if I am convinced that they aren't deliberately hurting me. Life is not always convenient. I don't give up on people I love, love to me is not evolutionary/biological programming or conditioning, or romantic mushiness, it's the ability to care for someone else as much as we care for ourselves. I still love people who have hurt me deeply and consistently, I separate from them but I can't stop loving. It's a bug in my default, I don't have the capacity for resentment, hate or revenge.

Yes: the concept that such an emotional-cum-cultural tendency has it’s origin in, and is sustained by, selection pressure for character traits that are focused upon the production and rearing of healthy offspring is one I’m aware of: and endorse. It’s clear, elegant and satisfyingly counter-metaphysical as an explanation.
But, my subjective experience is that this can (but by no means will or must) lead to a whole series of additional benefits for the adult humans involved: which are worthwhile in and for themselves, given the proviso that this is neither automatic nor easy.
I think you’ve probably noted this already, but I’ll spell my thought out clearly for the benefit of anyone else reading through this thread:
There is a strong tendency in many human cultures to ascribe salvatory properties to romantic love, this is a delusion.
Believing in it will be wholly counter-productive to the mental health of both oneself and any romantic partner one may become involved with.

Interesting question: it’s a hypothetical I’m not really sure if I can answer.
I have both anxiety and sensory issues in that particular department: my wife is the first women to have shown patience and compassion towards me in that regard.
To be brutally honest however I think the principle gain I get is that I have someone in my life who actively wants me to be content with my lot, and has put (still is putting) a lot of effort into making sure that I do enough of what is required to be respected by NTs at large, but no more than that to guard against psychological disintegration... which was what I was coming out of the backside of when we met.
Marriage was her idea, she proposed to me: I doubt it would have ever occurred to me to ask!
She’s told me that the principle positive for her is having someone quiet and gentle who’s always there regardless of how hectic and stressful all else in life gets: and also that I just let her get on with being who she is without making any demands as to her behaviour/conduct (apparently this is very unusual in her experience and a great treasure).

Interesting discussion! Alot of good advice here.

The only thing I can add is that from what I’ve seen, read and experienced, Aspie men can appear very mysterious and alluring to both NT and ND women. I guess it just depends on attraction. Attraction is truly in the eye of the beholder.

If one is ugly, then attraction is only in the eye of the beer holder.