Deal-breakers for men?

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Cafeaulait
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10 Apr 2013, 12:36 am

goldfish21 wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

So? What's up with the 'we got a badass'? Infantile. I'm not trying to challenge you, I am just stating a fact. And I think it's plain stupid to turn down someone for that reason. What if she is the most amazing person and partner and 6 months down the line she tells you she's a rape victim? Are you all of a sudding going to dump her?

I can't speak for unwonkdm, but I think everyone here has been pretty clear that if someone's past or mental health condition or ____ is dealt with, treated, behind them, invisible and virtually undetectable that they'd be open to the possibility of a relationship with them...

Didn´t read that at all. I just read: no, the relationship will still probably fall apart because I'm still not comfortable with it.

Cafeaulait
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10 Apr 2013, 12:37 am

Lilya wrote:

goldfish21 wrote:

Lilya wrote:

It is your personal choice and you are entitled to it, as well as I have the right for an opinion that your views are distorted on the matter.

Just as yours are based on your experiences.

Absolutely everyone is going to have a personal bias about almost everything that stems from their experiences in life.

While you state that it's his personal choice and he's entitled to it, you come across as trying to persuade him/others that their personal choice is "wrong," and needs to be corrected to fit your point of view. That's the only issue I have with your arguments.

Disregard if you're truly accepting that others' personal preferences and biases are theirs to have and hold & set deal breakers by, even if you wouldn't hold the same belief nor set the same boundary or deal breaker.

Probably because I am trying to persuade him and make him see another point of view. I don't see it as a negative to try to challenge someone's views and to be fair, I do see uwmonkdm's views as distorted and narrow-minded if you don't mind me being frank. I also see it as a double standard when someone (not just him specifically) admits that they have "baggage" or mental disorders, but demand their potential partner to be completely free of them.

I can't save the world, but I can keep trying. And I've never said my ideals are better than anyone else's. I can still speak of a topic I know enough of, which is slightly different matter.

I don't think you should try to persuade someone but there is nothing wrong with asking questions and challenging someones thoughts and beliefs.

uwmonkdm
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10 Apr 2013, 12:48 am

Cafeaulait wrote:

goldfish21 wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

Didn´t read that at all. I just read: no, the relationship will still probably fall apart because I'm still not comfortable with it.

Is has nothing to do with my comfort level; I am a realistic person. I know the actual challenges that implies, and I know it breaks up a lot of people.
I can't tell you for sure that would happen, but I said "probably". If she was the absolute perfect woman for me, then it probably would not break us up... if it was a relationship I was already having doubts about in the first place, then it's probably going to be the last nail in the coffin.

MjrMajorMajor
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10 Apr 2013, 12:52 am

Cafeaulait wrote:

I don't think you should try to persuade someone but there is nothing wrong with asking questions and challenging someones thoughts and beliefs.

Exactly. Especially when a blanket statement is being made for many because of the actions of a very few. This is true for too many threads btw, not only this one. Everyone is entitled to preferences and opinions, but being asked to defend them should not equate to a personal attack.

Lilya
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10 Apr 2013, 3:06 am

uwmonkdm wrote:

The baggage I actually do have, is from dealing with these women who were victims of assault, rape, molestation whatever; I finally had a "normal" relationship and I couldn't even take part in a normal sex life because of it.

I understand your point of view, but you should see the point of view that most women who go through this type of trauma are not peachy at the end of it. They don't recover and return to having a 'normal' sex life as you seem to think they do. The majority of my life over the last 5 years has been spent seeing this first hand; so don't tell me I'm wrong when I've seen it with my own eyes.
I tried to be understanding, I did everything they would ask of me, I would be patient.. nothing ever changed. Is it really that big of a deal that I would prefer to just avoid that situation entirely in the future after it has caused me such a great deal of pain and trouble?

My choices when it comes to romantic relationships are for my best interest and what will make me happier, so f**k off if you think you have the right to tell me what those choices should be.
You're not changing the world, you're arguing a pointless argument on the internet, go read a book.

You do make it sound like you accuse these women of your problems, which I doubt is the case considering your previous posts. You do put a stamp on all rape victims and suggest they are not able to recover at all and naturally I take an offense of that as I know that to be untrue with a lot of women.

And no, I wouldn't recommend any rape victim to get close to you.

There was a hint of sarcasm in my world changing comment, but funny, as I thought you and the rest here were real people. Or do you admit being a troll? I read plenty, by the way, and do good deal of charity work, that has included aiding sexually abused women.

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Lilya
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10 Apr 2013, 3:16 am

MjrMajorMajor wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

I don't think you should try to persuade someone but there is nothing wrong with asking questions and challenging someones thoughts and beliefs.

I'm not a native speaker of English, so I'm not sure exactly how strong tone there is with the word "persuasion", but it wasn't meant to come across as negative.

Still, when someone makes a comment like "all black people are stupid" (not equaling that to uwmonkdm's arguments specifically) one can always argue that "that's his/her opinion", but it's not easy or necessary even right to ignore.

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Greb
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10 Apr 2013, 4:23 am

uwmonkdm wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

goldfish21 wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

Didn´t read that at all. I just read: no, the relationship will still probably fall apart because I'm still not comfortable with it.

I'm just wondering about what you said: you have been with 3 girls that were rape victims. But you're 23, so, how old were they? how much time it passed since they were raped? how long was the relationships?

Are we talking about a person who was raped serveral years before and for whom you invested one or two years of your life? Or are we talking about a person raped a few months before the relationship, that you broke up after a couple of weeks because you couldn't have sex with her?

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Cafeaulait
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10 Apr 2013, 11:41 am

MjrMajorMajor wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

I don't think you should try to persuade someone but there is nothing wrong with asking questions and challenging someones thoughts and beliefs.

Exactly. Some people make me so very tired. I live in the Netherlands, a country where freedom of speech and opinion is very normal. We are very liberal.
What I can´t stand is when someones gives their opinion, tells a story or offends someone, they get mad annoyed when someone else bounces the ball back. You have the right to have every opinion or outlook you want, but other people have the right to respond to that. Positively as well as negatively. I always say: the knife cuts both ways.

uwmonkdm
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10 Apr 2013, 2:01 pm

Greb wrote:

uwmonkdm wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

goldfish21 wrote:

Cafeaulait wrote:

Didn´t read that at all. I just read: no, the relationship will still probably fall apart because I'm still not comfortable with it.

It was always years before, between 10-15 years old, and they were 19-22 at the time we dated. They went to therapy, had friends to talk to, yadda yadda... it was still like it happened yesterday. Two relationships were a year and the other two years.

To Lilya I'm just going to repeat:

Quote:

Is it really that big of a deal that I would prefer to just avoid that situation entirely in the future after it has caused me such a great deal of pain and trouble?

My sexual problems are due to dealing with this. I'm unable to be spontaneous and I'm overly careful, because I had to be for years... I don't know what 'normal' is anymore.
Whatever other issues you seem to think I have, are not due to this.
With that said, I am not blaming them, I am blaming myself for trying to make something work when I knew it was messing me up; therefore I have decided not to enter into that situation again.

I didn't put a stamp on all rape victims, the word "most" does not equate to "all". If you truly believe the western methods of psychology based on the disease model and pushing pharmaceuticals can cure anyone of anything, I suggest you read something other than your "psychology" books. (Look up the term "Neurosis")

Last edited by uwmonkdm on 10 Apr 2013, 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Greb
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10 Apr 2013, 2:19 pm

Are you telling that you were, for example, like 12 years old, she was like 20 years old, and the problem was that you both didn't have a healthy sexual life??

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uwmonkdm
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10 Apr 2013, 2:27 pm

Greb wrote:

Are you telling that you were, for example, like 12 years old, she was like 20 years old, and the problem was that you both didn't have a healthy sexual life??

They were 10-15 when assaulted, and 19-22 when we dated.
My sexual history was fine.
I'm done with this website anyway. I'm not going to sit around and be told that the world is all rainbows and candy when I've seen and traumatically experienced the exact opposite.
Then I continually get warnings for telling someone to f**k off and read a book, when they are clearly implying I have mental disorders, I'm a racist, I think all victims are useless... etc..
f**k this s**t. bye.

MjrMajorMajor
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10 Apr 2013, 2:29 pm

uwmonkdm wrote:

I think this is very understandable. When presented in the original list(s), this and a few other bullet points seem to translate into dismissive and callous offhand comments, which isn't true.

uwmonkdm
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10 Apr 2013, 2:33 pm

MjrMajorMajor wrote:

uwmonkdm wrote:

I think this is very understandable. When presented in the original list(s), this and a few other bullet points seem to translate into dismissive and callous offhand comments, which isn't true.

I'm a highly educated person, I don't make decisions lightly. I'm not some ret*d rape culture pushing redneck.
I'm glad one person gets it.
I'm still sick of all the arguing on this site though, I have better things to do. I've only been posting a few times a day and I'm still getting stressed out that I have to explain myself down to every last little detail or I might be labelled as some BS, or warned I might be banned for using the F word. Sigh.

MjrMajorMajor
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10 Apr 2013, 2:39 pm

uwmonkdm wrote:

MjrMajorMajor wrote:

uwmonkdm wrote:

I think this is very understandable. When presented in the original list(s), this and a few other bullet points seem to translate into dismissive and callous offhand comments, which isn't true.

I hear ya, and maybe it's good to take a breather. I think you've been a positive to the forum personally, but we do trend toward the nitpicky and pendantic. :wink:

Maybe visit WP again when you're feeling less stressed?

Greb
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10 Apr 2013, 2:50 pm

uwmonkdm wrote:

Greb wrote:

Are you telling that you were, for example, like 12 years old, she was like 20 years old, and the problem was that you both didn't have a healthy sexual life??

Well, I don't know if all the victims are useless. But let's see it in the following way: do you know where I see a victim right now?

You.

Of course, you're not a victim of a rape. But you have spent several years giving chances to women that perhaps didn't make any effort for you. Yeap, they were rape victims, but that doesn't make them necessarily good people. as*holes can be raped, as much as nice people. And any raped as*hole could be a victim, but keeps being an as*hole.

I don't know those girls, but, besides rape victims, perhaps they were not good people. Perhaps they were not nice girls. Perhaps you listened to their story, felt pity, and trusted a couple of girls that didn't deserve this trust.

And now you feel betrayed.

Now you're the damaged good.

And then perhaps, only perhaps, you meet a good girl. Would you like that she says "hey, he's a damaged good, I don't wanna know anything with him" or would you like her to give you a chance?

Just a thought.

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uwmonkdm
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10 Apr 2013, 2:58 pm

Greb wrote:

uwmonkdm wrote:

Greb wrote:

Are you telling that you were, for example, like 12 years old, she was like 20 years old, and the problem was that you both didn't have a healthy sexual life??

Pretty much spot on, except as I have said, I have no victim mentality delusion. I experienced a "normal" relationship for 4 or 5 months and I can at least rest assured that such a thing exists now, and she showed me that these are issues I have to work on. So I'm single, and plan to remain so for the foreseeable future.. and I have made the decision that I will not be involved in such a situation again.
Selfish? Maybe. But self preservation is much more important to me than political correctness.

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