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abaisse
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05 Mar 2011, 12:09 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:



and 60% of your people still reject evolution , a higher number than all European countries ....except turkey (in case it's considered as european).

And about 40% are against the teaching of evolution in schools and about 28% of teachers are ignoring evolutionary biology.


Despite the fact that these percentages hold absolutely no weight unless someone has knocked on every door in America and gotten an answer.....

The latest national poll I read in media outlets from December 2010 did not state this. Perhaps you are thinking of the number 60% because it was said 60% of all people who attend church weekly believe in Creationism. The other weekly church goers believed in evolution under the direction of God or secular evolution. Of Americans with college degrees, only 37% believe in Creationism.

Furthermore, our public schools are ran by the states, not the federal government. In my state, you cannot teach Creationism. The schools teach evolution.

I just took a position as a graduate teaching assistant. Creationism isn't even entertained in those circles.



The_Face_of_Boo
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05 Mar 2011, 5:47 am

Laz wrote:
SOMEONE HAD TO OPEN THAT CAN OF WORMS! :roll:


Yummy...worms....
Image



The_Face_of_Boo
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05 Mar 2011, 5:59 am

abaisse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
abaisse wrote:
MCalavera wrote:
Out of curiosity,

Quote:
If I get into a long term relationship with someone, but he's completely against any children we have going to church with me... that's a problem in the relationship.


Why is it a problem for someone liberal like you?


It's only a problem for me because I would want my children to share in something that brings me peace. My future husband is allowed to share his beliefs (or lack thereof). The child can reject my beliefs when they are old enough should they choose to do so. However, I want to give the child the option of believing and share in Christmas caroling or helping out at the church's service projects for the community. Some of it isn't even religious. It's simply traditions and giving back to the community that I want my child to take part in. Teaching a child compassion and charity is important in my parenting. Many of my opportunities to express those values are through church activities. As you know, I already have a daughter. It brings her joy to make other people smile.


Making children to go to chuch each sunday and make them listen to what priests every week is also a kind of brainwashing.

I am against any form or shape of brainwashing.

I wouldn't mind if they'll make a Christmas tree or enjoy easter eggs or sing Ramadanian songs.

And once my children become little older and more aware, I wouldn't mind if they'll go to a Church or to Mosque or even to a Buddhist temple, as long they're no going to some crazy cult or to some extremist faction that promotes and encourages violence and inhumanity.

Their future religion or the absence of it will be THEIR choice, and not the result of an ideological raising.

If my child asks me what's god , I will explain it to him what god means in every religions and philosophy. It'll be his or her choice to choose whether to believe in anyone of them.

That's how a true liberal would raise his/her children.


Look, I am not going to try to explain it to you because it is beyond your understanding. Most of my family is from the Middle East. There is a huge gap between us. It's nearly impossible for you to understand how religion can be optional, separate, and liberal. I've had this argument with my Middle Eastern family a million times, only with them on the other side wishing for me to be more conservative because liberal America has ruined me and caused me to leave the religion of my birth. :roll:


What part of Middle East may I ask?

And what's your point again?

I see absolutely no difference between your way of raising and how most regular moderate Christians raise their children.

and enough with this nonsense "since you're from middle east, then it's impossible for you to understand separation between religion and state."



Last edited by The_Face_of_Boo on 05 Mar 2011, 6:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

The_Face_of_Boo
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05 Mar 2011, 6:03 am

abaisse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:



and 60% of your people still reject evolution , a higher number than all European countries ....except turkey (in case it's considered as european).

And about 40% are against the teaching of evolution in schools and about 28% of teachers are ignoring evolutionary biology.


Despite the fact that these percentages hold absolutely no weight unless someone has knocked on every door in America and gotten an answer.....

The latest national poll I read in media outlets from December 2010 did not state this. Perhaps you are thinking of the number 60% because it was said 60% of all people who attend church weekly believe in Creationism. The other weekly church goers believed in evolution under the direction of God or secular evolution. Of Americans with college degrees, only 37% believe in Creationism.

Furthermore, our public schools are ran by the states, not the federal government. In my state, you cannot teach Creationism. The schools teach evolution.

I just took a position as a graduate teaching assistant. Creationism isn't even entertained in those circles.



Image

Image

Have a nice day.



ProfessorCrow
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05 Mar 2011, 6:10 am

As a militant agnostic (Yep, we're out there) I could never, and would never have a relationship with someone who practices organized religion.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, I simply can't get along with someone who by THEIR own religion is forced to believe that I will burn in hell/suffer for all eternity when I die.

Sorry. Stop pretending to respect me when your religion leads you to believe that I deserve the worst punishment imaginable.

The love of my life is in a Catholic family, and is Agnostic, like myself. (as well as an aspie, must be fate. )

I was lucky enough to be raised by a very liberal family. My father is a doubting Catholic, my Mother is a spiritual reincarnation type believer, and my Stepfather (who I actually get along with very well) is an agnostic/atheist.

Living in Tennessee, I've been able to observe the Baptist religion very closely, yet from a distance. Funny how Christians are supposed to be a secular people, yet all of these baptists I see are racist, sexist, bigoted, illiterate, absolute douchebags.

Aw well. I've decided to pretty much avoid any and all members of organized religion (excluding a few. Buddhism, even Judaism are tolerable to me.)

I actually get very worked up over all of that religious business. Luckily the rate of non believers is sky rocketing and eventually, Christianity and similar religions will be like Greek Mythology. Eventually. That brings me peace.

Have a great day, everybody!

-Crow



abaisse
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05 Mar 2011, 6:13 am

You provided charts without stating the source or when the data was collected. My numbers are what the media has reported recently through the Gallup Polls as of December 2010.



The_Face_of_Boo
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05 Mar 2011, 6:17 am

Science journal.

newscientist.



simon_says
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05 Mar 2011, 6:20 am

Ive dated a christian before. But it was casual christianity and it didnt come up often. But I would not date a creationist. That's just debasing yourself. It would be like dating a heroin addict.

Ive found more issues with politics personally. I make fun of the far right and far left equally and someone might incorrectly assume that I'm one extreme type or the other. I once dated a woman of the far left, who is moderately famous today, and we had some problems over politics.



abaisse
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05 Mar 2011, 6:22 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Science journal.

newscientist.


Okay... And from when? Atheism is a growing group, so that number changes. There's a secular humanist group here that meets regularly. They have more members than most of the area Protestant churches now.



The_Face_of_Boo
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05 Mar 2011, 6:30 am

abaisse wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Science journal.

newscientist.


Okay... And from when? Atheism is a growing group, so that number changes. There's a secular humanist group here that meets regularly. They have more members than most of the area Protestant churches now.


I think it was around 2007-2008

the gallup poll you're talking about is this:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/145286/Four- ... onism.aspx

while in 2009: http://www.gallup.com/poll/114544/Darwi ... ution.aspx

I am skeptical regarding this huge change.



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05 Mar 2011, 7:04 am

But those two polls ask different questions. The first one is more interesting as theyve been running the same poll for 30 years. It's always been in the 40%+ range, peaking in 1999 at 47%, and has since dropped 7 points in just 12 years.

Ive felt for some time that the internet is doing a number on creationists. They routinely embarrass themselves in a very public way and they must be noticing it. I see fewer creationist debates online today than I did 10 or 15 years ago. Hopefully gallup will start showing some numbers in the 30% range soon.



wefunction
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05 Mar 2011, 12:35 pm

ProfessorCrow wrote:
As a militant agnostic (Yep, we're out there) I could never, and would never have a relationship with someone who practices organized religion.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, I simply can't get along with someone who by THEIR own religion is forced to believe that I will burn in hell/suffer for all eternity when I die.

Sorry. Stop pretending to respect me when your religion leads you to believe that I deserve the worst punishment imaginable.


Since you've read earlier in this thread, maybe you'd care to read and learn what Christians who disagree with that stupid judgmental philosophy actually believe. The comments are equally available in this thread. It won't compliment how you've been judging people based on how they live their lives but at least you'd have some true information how every day Christians interpret their religious text. Don't get me wrong; I'm certainly in favor of people being as discriminating as they want to be about who they date on the logic that someone who's too critical will limit their own options and guarantee that they end up alone, sparing others the annoyance of dealing with them. I just think we should make it clear that you're dismissing valid information so you can justify your reasons and continue to perpetuate a misconception.

Now for the fun part...
Agnosticism is not a stand alone belief. There can be agnostic christians, agnostic muslims, agnostic jews, agnostic atheists and even agnostic buddhists. Agnosticism is a layer of belief, which is reasonable and complimentary to the complicated mind and heart of any individual. In some religions, agnosticism can be considered a "crisis of faith" but typically agnosticism is welcomed because it facilities discussion, debate, question, re-evaluation, and often a strengthening of faith. Agnosticism is natural. Someone can surely be a true Agnostic, possibly even a militant one if they don't mind people rolling their eyes when they hear it, but Agnosticism is not opposed to a belief system, not even an organized one.



abaisse
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05 Mar 2011, 3:18 pm

wefunction wrote:
ProfessorCrow wrote:
As a militant agnostic (Yep, we're out there) I could never, and would never have a relationship with someone who practices organized religion.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, I simply can't get along with someone who by THEIR own religion is forced to believe that I will burn in hell/suffer for all eternity when I die.

Sorry. Stop pretending to respect me when your religion leads you to believe that I deserve the worst punishment imaginable.


Since you've read earlier in this thread, maybe you'd care to read and learn what Christians who disagree with that stupid judgmental philosophy actually believe. The comments are equally available in this thread. It won't compliment how you've been judging people based on how they live their lives but at least you'd have some true information how every day Christians interpret their religious text. Don't get me wrong; I'm certainly in favor of people being as discriminating as they want to be about who they date on the logic that someone who's too critical will limit their own options and guarantee that they end up alone, sparing others the annoyance of dealing with them. I just think we should make it clear that you're dismissing valid information so you can justify your reasons and continue to perpetuate a misconception.



QFT My Christian denomination believes everyone is saved by grace. No hellfire here.



Weiss_Yohji
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06 Mar 2011, 12:26 am

abaisse wrote:
wefunction wrote:
ProfessorCrow wrote:
As a militant agnostic (Yep, we're out there) I could never, and would never have a relationship with someone who practices organized religion.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, I simply can't get along with someone who by THEIR own religion is forced to believe that I will burn in hell/suffer for all eternity when I die.

Sorry. Stop pretending to respect me when your religion leads you to believe that I deserve the worst punishment imaginable.


Since you've read earlier in this thread, maybe you'd care to read and learn what Christians who disagree with that stupid judgmental philosophy actually believe. The comments are equally available in this thread. It won't compliment how you've been judging people based on how they live their lives but at least you'd have some true information how every day Christians interpret their religious text. Don't get me wrong; I'm certainly in favor of people being as discriminating as they want to be about who they date on the logic that someone who's too critical will limit their own options and guarantee that they end up alone, sparing others the annoyance of dealing with them. I just think we should make it clear that you're dismissing valid information so you can justify your reasons and continue to perpetuate a misconception.



QFT My Christian denomination believes everyone is saved by grace. No hellfire here.


The whole baptism thing sticks my craw. Infant baptism, adult baptism, full immersion, sprinkling holy water on the forehead, believer's baptism--why can't you all just agree to be glad you don't have to be circumcised?



abaisse
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06 Mar 2011, 12:33 am

Weiss_Yohji wrote:
abaisse wrote:
wefunction wrote:
ProfessorCrow wrote:
As a militant agnostic (Yep, we're out there) I could never, and would never have a relationship with someone who practices organized religion.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, I simply can't get along with someone who by THEIR own religion is forced to believe that I will burn in hell/suffer for all eternity when I die.

Sorry. Stop pretending to respect me when your religion leads you to believe that I deserve the worst punishment imaginable.


Since you've read earlier in this thread, maybe you'd care to read and learn what Christians who disagree with that stupid judgmental philosophy actually believe. The comments are equally available in this thread. It won't compliment how you've been judging people based on how they live their lives but at least you'd have some true information how every day Christians interpret their religious text. Don't get me wrong; I'm certainly in favor of people being as discriminating as they want to be about who they date on the logic that someone who's too critical will limit their own options and guarantee that they end up alone, sparing others the annoyance of dealing with them. I just think we should make it clear that you're dismissing valid information so you can justify your reasons and continue to perpetuate a misconception.



QFT My Christian denomination believes everyone is saved by grace. No hellfire here.


The whole baptism thing sticks my craw. Infant baptism, adult baptism, full immersion, sprinkling holy water on the forehead, believer's baptism--why can't you all just agree to be glad you don't have to be circumcised?


We don't baptize. :)



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06 Mar 2011, 12:37 am

abaisse wrote:
We don't baptize. :)

I mean in general.

In the end, it's all the same worship of a talking dead guy who was his own dad.