Are relationships always this complicated?

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Okayish by our standards. We won't see each other this weekend because her family says she must spend all of Chinese New Year with them. She keeps wanting me to play this game called Maple Story with her. I'm not really into it. It seems like a girl's game and I suspect it installed a rootkit onto my computer.

She claims to be a tomboy but she's a girly girl. In her mind the fact that she plays computer games of any sort makes her a tomboy. She seemed to be getting into Borderlands 2 but she's used to mouse and keyboard, not Xbox controls and with her vision problems, she can better focus on a screen less than one meter away.

I gifted her Borderlands 2 on Steam but her laptop is broken (possibly due to Maple Story and it's rootkit). She has a rather nice MSI gaming laptop and with that she could play co-op at her house or mine. I was tempted to buy a $2,800 gaming laptop so I could lend it to her but since I crashed my car last week that's no longer an option.

We haven't had any more arguments. I convinced her to wait on Maple Story because last night i was exhausted. I had just been to a class after work (this is my punishment for not going to college at the normal age, before I started working). I told her I would play Maple Story after I've finished my assignments, which I'm behind on due to my computer being infected by a rootkit so I couldn't use it. Fortunately, I was able to borrow a laptop from work.That's the plan. I see everything in life as a stepping stone. Maybe that means I'm using her but how many people end up sticking with their first relationship for life? Only those who are very very lucky. The rest of us have to do it by increments.yes up to a point.Flowers eh? On Valentine's Day she complained when I got her a card instead of flowers. I thought she would like the corny poem I wrote in the card but she's a visual thinker so she didn't react to my florid prose

The next time I see her I have a gift for her (not a teddy bear like she was demanding last week). She was playing around with my 3DS in the online store and she saw the Animal Crossing: New Leaf trailer. Her face lit up when she saw this. Especially since it has a drawing component and she's an art major.

I bought her the game then told her I had a surprise for her. She wanted to know what it was. I told her that would ruin the surprise. he got really mad at this so I told her. She seems to like it but she can't play it until next weekend. If need be I'll lend her one of my 3DSs. She says she left hers in Sydney. I guess some people just don't like surprises eh?

I hope I didn't hurt you, it just seems you are replicating how your family judges people which isn't right in my eyes. I don't feel many normal women would like this either.


It would appear I am not deserving. I see no reason for getting a vasectomy as theres no sex involved in my life, I also would like to have kids even if they scare me. but mainly no gf/wife and not going happen so no sex so no risk. I also don't think insurance would pay for a optional surgery anyways.

to be honest it doesn't sound like this is the girl for you for various reasons, the whole kids and wanting/not wanting can be a big issue. guys seem to handle not having kids better then women do. that is wanting to have them but the partner doesn't.

I'm attempting to just accept lonely life and hey its only 3-8 more years. maybe less given world events.

Oh yeah...the car. How's the insurance going with that?

I hope you guys, if you don't get married or even live together, could at least benefit from each other. One thing that's good about your relationship: no pretenses! You both laid it out on the line, so to speak. You made a social faux pas--but at least it's all out in the open. And I think she will survive; she sounds like she might be a resilient person. If you had really hurt her, that would have made you kind of a heel.

Don't let her goad you into moving in with you. That would be a much, much worse mistake than you making a social faux pas. Moving in with each other implies COMMITMENT. Forget about having kids, unless you've been seeing her for at least a couple of years without any major arguments.

$2,800 is too much to spend for anything, particularly if you already have a decent gaming set. Spend that money on a vacation!

Am I correct in assuming that she's ethnic Chinese? Now...that's interesting...learning about different cultures. It seems like she's assimilated, though. Her parents seem like they're into the old-time traditions. It's the year of the Ram.

No, relationships are not always this complicated. Bad ones are.

Okay so I advised you not to date another large girl while you have the same attitude, but you did, and you are having basically the same issues. My new advice which I don't expect you to take, but it's just as genuine as the last one, is: Get out of this relationship and don't get into ANY other relationship until you truly understand what people are telling you in this thread. Your attitude really does need to change for you to have a happy, uncomplicated, healthy relationship. And it has to change more than simply acknowledging the replies here then doing nothing about it.

I hope that doesn't come across as harsh but I don't know any other way to say it.

I haven't read the whole thread, so these points may have already either been made or become inapplicable, but here goes:

1. You have a lot to learn in the tact department. That is something you should work on regardless of who you are with. I don't know any women who would have been OK with how you handled what is a pretty hot topic discussion. Weight issues tend to be sensitive ones for women - may as well accept that now, and work on the proper responses. What are some proper responses? "You are beautiful the way you are, but if losing weigh would help you feel healthier, I am happy to do whatever you want me to do to support or help you." Don't jump into advice unless she asks you. Keep the discussion focused on how she feels about it and her assumed desire to improve her health. Remind her she is beautiful as she is. Encourage shared activities like hiking or biking instead of saying things like, "go work out."

2. I read your post and my thoughts ended up with a simple, "this is not the right woman for you." I don't see how you can meet the type of needs she seems to have. I am sure you are a decent guy, but this sounds like a pretty needy woman who knows how to play manipulation games. It sounds to me like she needs an unusually patient, empathetic, and yet self-assured guy who will be able to help her with her issues while, at the same, keeping very firm and clear boundaries. If you can't get the weight question right, and need to come here asking about the kinds of pressures she is putting on you, you are not that guy. I think the two of you are at risk of spiraling each other down instead of lifting each other up, and that is not the right direction to be headed in.

It can be very destructive to be in a relationship with someone that is a mismatch for you in the ways I sensed in your post; there are women you can have a "I just want a girlfriend" relationship with, and there are women you can't. This woman is firmly in the later, and staying with this woman sounds to me like it will eat you alive.

And then there is this:
3. The way you talk about her is very disrespectful and demeaning. Not a good sign, either. You both are going to eat each other alive.

Not all double standards mean hypocrisy exists. It's pretty simple, to me, why I can tell a man he's fat but not a fellow woman: the man usually expects to hear it that way, appreciates the honesty, and has less trouble keeping that criticism separate from his perception of his overall worth. Women, by and large, even when willing to call themselves fat, find it hurtful to hear the word thrown at them, and know that it means society, as a whole, is judging them as having less overall worth than a slender but less talented woman. Society, as a whole, definitely treats and perceives overweight men and women differently: men can be fat and successful, with the fact they are fat getting noted but not harming people's perception of their intelligence, abilities, and right to hold important or powerful jobs. Society does not, overall, give the same courtesy to women: if we are fat, we are supposed to hide and be ashamed of it, and there is NO WAY voters will put a truly fat woman into an important office. Men joke all the time about how famous people should dump spouses that got fat; women don't do the same in the flip situation.

If there is hypocrisy here, it belongs to society, not women. We're just dealing with the reality of it.

All that said, I know there are plenty of issues that work in the flip, e.g. where men don't get a fair shake and negative comments are going to be taken much harder than they would be by a woman. But since those aren't part of the situation under scrutiny, we don't need to go into them.

PS - it sounds from your latest post that you have quite a few positive things to bring into a relationship, like trying to pay attention to what she likes and needs, and being willing to evolve with the nice things you try to do for her.

But it still doesn't mean I think this particular relationship is a good one for either of you.

nope that is just part of sexism where men have to man up and take it. knowing many guys and being one myself, it hurts just as much as women, but we are told from young to hide it. so well feel bad, resent those who said it and go to the gym to gain their approval. i think the whole fat ccos is gone, most are in great shape, men are expected to be in good shape and get compared to models too. I've spent my life wishing I had those six pack abs women always talk about loving

I've seen women joke about that. also hardly ever see non thin politicians. is obama fat? bush? clinton wasn't even that fat but was constantly made fun of for being fat. fat guy jokes are all over. people slow down on the street and point and yell hey tubby. women be like "you too fat for me" when it comes to just sex, guys will sex a fat woman, women will still run from fat men.

lesson telling someone they are fat is mean, not helpful regardless of sex, just men have to hid it and man up and women can get defensive and cry.

men go home and cry in private, so no one knows.

Don't worry about it. I'm fine.True on both counts. My family is really judgemental but I have a habit of assuming the worst of them, which makes them seem even more judgemental. If they're not their to judge, I just assume they would make the harshest judgement possible if they were there.Sly, why would you say that? You deserve a girlfirned as much as anyone. I'm sure you could be much kinder and less judgemental than I am. I'm sure you could have a healthy relationship without getting hang up on looks. I mean, imagine yourself in my place. Dating a girl who's plain looking, about 10 BMI points overweight and has a lazy eye. Would you hold those things against her? I don't think you would. I think you would love her for her instead of for her looks, instead of whether or not you think your friends and family approve of her. I think I'm guily of getting a girlfriend mainly to increase my social status. I realise that's not a good thing. Being raised poor in a middle class family I tend to get hung up on that.Sly, don't accept that. If you give up now you really will spend the rest of your life alone. You can chane your life but not by sitting on your laurels.

You must fight your fate, do not accept what destiny has in store for you. If you refuse to accept your lot in life and vow to pursue your goals with hard work and ruthless oppurtunism you can get what you need. Make a plan, start doing it, let it go wrong and then improvise like hell. carpe diem jugulumThey haven't yet told me how much it will cost. The suspense it killing me. I think I may have killed my disposable income for the month. Gf offered to pay half because I crashed while following her instructions. She says her family will give her hundreds of dollars for Chinese New Year. I know I shouldn't take her money but I'm really peaved about losing money so I probably will.I think we can.I know, right? What I like about her is that I feel so comfortable around her. I get so nervous around most girls. I feel I can be more open with her instead of pretending.I think so too, anyone who can survive being in a horrible family like she is must be very resilient. She's a survivor. She doesn't seem to expect much out of life.I hope I haven't. Even if I may not spend my life with her I still care about her and I don't want to see her hurt.That's what I think. I don't mind having her around but I think if she lives with me it will be too hard to get rid of her should I need too.

The reason she wants to move in with me is that she's living with her grandfather, who she claims has sold his impressively large house on top of the hill (I've only seen it from the outside but it's magnificent) and is moving to Hong Kong some time next week.

That's why she wants to live with me soon. She doesn't want to go back with her awful father in Sydney and she doesn't want to live with her annoying sister in Adelaide (not really her sister, that's just what she calls her best frenemy).

I don't know if she's lying about her grandfather (who she also hates). I was kind of hoping gf would inherit it so I could move in and live in a big fancy house.

Meanwhile, if gf lives with me I could do better on my subsidised housing claim. I would have a stronger claim with two residents, I would have a stronger claim if one of us is escaping he abusive family, I would get a bigger house (house size is based on number of residents, one of my friends and his girlfried get a two bedroom house for only $100 per week) and I could also have her claim for a house from the feminist organization (like my friend's brother's girlfirned did, they got a very nice two story townhouse for only $180 per week) (both friend and friend's brother's girlfriend also got $5,000 furniture grant).

My social worker is already convinced she can get me into subsidised housing but tha would greatly bolster my claim and I really want one of those townhouses (or better yet, that big house on the hill).That's what I've wanted to do all along. I don't get on with kids very well. The thought of parenthood scares the crap out of me.Yeah but I already wanted this thing anyway. I get it for only $2,000 with employee discount. I want it partly as a second computer, for when I need two computers at once or if the desktop fails. My netbook isn't very powerful so it makes a poor backup for the desktop. Vacation? She wants us to go to Sydney in April. That sounds fun but I'd like to have a nice laptop to bring along on this and future holidays (with or without her).Pretty much. She's half Chinese and half Vietnamese.I know right? I'd love to learn about Chinese and Vietnamese culture but since she doesn't want me to meet her family I want to get to see any of their festivals Right now I'm missing out on Chinese New Year.

The close I might get to learning about her culture is through her cooking. I think it would be fascinating to sample authentic Chinese cuisine, not that rubbish in the so called "chinese restaraunt", which seems to consist chiefly small lumps of chicken fried in batter. I've been informed that these dishes originate in San Francisco, not China.I think she's assymilated better than her parents and much better than her grandfather, who she tells me speaks very little English. Bare in mind she was born in Australia, she still retains a slight stacatto accent due to speaking Cantonese at home.Well that's good to hear... sort of.I know, you gave sound advise and I disregarded it. Though this goes against my better judgement I'll disregard it for a while longer because I still have some issues to work out.I think I'm starting to get this. There's this guy at work who's super charismatic, he's always happy, everyone likes him, he's tall dark and handsome, he's got to be at least 6'6". He's been married since he was 19. He's a technical genius but you wouldn't know it because he doesn't talk like a nerd. He's always patient when helping me with my problems because I don't yet understand the mainframe so well, even though we both started at the same time.

So our team did the usual Friday lunch thing together at a resturaut. His wife took a break from her studies and joined us. I was surprised to see that she was quite ordinary looking. If it's not based on her looks then he must be truly in love. His looks are a seperate matter since in looks and demeanor he's annoyingly perfect.

Gf said the same thing about me. I think when she calls me perfect she means it as an insult.Good idea but... I think I'll go on acknowledging replies. As for being more respectful towards women, I think that's something I can best learn from hands on experience, not theory.Don't worry about it. I have been acting like a jerk after all. Sounds pretty scary It's regretable that we have this double standard, though I admit I've been helping to perpetuate it.

Regardless of double standards can't those overweight just lose it? I did. I lost 120 lb so I find it hard to understand why others can't do the same thing. Gf has already lost much weight and she says she'll lose much more so long as I stop talking about it. I agreed to this on the condition that she stop telling me not to take temazepam sleeping pills (which she claims are leathal), which she agreed to.What about President Taft?Go home and cry in private? Sure but I've been called worse names than fat before I went home to cry. There's one six letter word I can't stand. I'll let you guess what it is.

According to studies, overweight women are twice as vulnerable as men, and discrimination strikes earlier - but that means that overweight men are vulnerable and discriminated too.

And that's balanced by what short guys face vs short girls.

He has a point, most seems not attracted to overweight people, including overweight people themselves.

Notice here how person 1 and person 6 (both are obese) got 1 and 0.

I've met some pretty sexy chubby women in my time!

Ever heard the expression "large...and in charge?"

Mama Cass was pretty cool and pretty with a fantastic voice--yet she was quite heavy.

Do you like this girl or are you only with her so you won't be alone? If the latter, I'm sure you can find someone else you actually like to be in a relationship with.

People may joke that those men are fat, but they still vote for them. Hilary Clinton? I've heard many people argue that she can't be President JUST because they think she is fat and ugly.

And women may admire a 6 pack, but how many women come on here posting that they don't want to date a fat guy, or think they deserve a guy with a 6 pack? None. Yet a huge percentage of the threads by guys talk that way.

NO ONE should be called fat, and of course it always hurts, but it does hold women back in life more than it does men.

And, yes, in the life isn't fair category, there are many flip situations where women have it easier:
Being short
Not having career prospects
etc

BUT, forget all this arguing about who can, is or should sensitive to what; the real point is not to be so shallow and to be careful when dealing with potentially sensitive subjects in a dating situations.

Playing Devil Advocate here, OKCupid is not exactly representative of the female (or male) population in general. Every single person I met off that site neatly fit into two categories:

1)Cluster B Personality Disordered (aka crazy, severe mental issues, dangerously unstable)
2)Tree Hugging, Starbucks Drinking, Apple Loving, Backpack-and-save-the-world Hipster

Predictably, only the former category every responded to a request for a second date no matter how well it went. I met exactly zero "regular" women there. The females there are generally more shallow than a baby pool and I can imagine the men are FAR worse. Now back to the OP.....


My BPD ex did almost the exact same sob story on me. The more I learned about Borderlines the more I realized it was not about love or money but about CONTROL. Do not get lost in the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) she is going to lay down on you. How long have you been going out? My ex lasted almost 4 months before her first major blowup. If our experience is anything like mine (and it is) she will take over and you will feel like a prisoner in your own home.

I also second what yellowtamarin says about not getting into any relationships until you change your attitude. I know you probably won't listen (I certainly didn't at the time I went through it) but you will be able to look back and see it clearly once this relationship implodes and can learn and grow from it.


That doesn't raise a red flag for you? Who is anyone to demand a gift? I really hope you wake up and smell the coffee before its too late!