Help Me I'm Jewish!! ! (no, *really*.)

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Sheesh, I think some are really getting the implications messed up here!

I'm Jewish because I believe in G-d (well I'd still be Jewish even if I wouldn't believe, because I was born Jewish, but I wouldn't call myself Jewish, I'd call myself secular or atheist or something... definitely not "Jewish" because Jews are let's just say, not exactly liked in my native country), but I'm Orthodox because of two reasons.
1. I think it's better to be consistent and not go 'cherry picking' among mitzvot (commandments), observing only the ones you like
2. I like doing it. (This is what I meant above.)

I don't think I can abandon my belief in G-d, because I have always had it, and it feels natural to me. I could deny it but it would make about as much sense to me as denying my consciousness. Some people don't have this feeling, and I think it's perfectly fine if they are Atheists (though I'd prefer Jews to believe in Hashem = G-d, but I don't have any preference for Gentiles...) and some people don't have a feeling that consciousness as a first person experience is important (Dennett? ) and so they don't have that belief and it's also perfectly fine. And there are some who have a belief in the importance of the first person experience of consciousness but not belief in the existence of G-d, all sorts of combinations, this was just a comparison. Of course to most people either religion or the lack of it is very important, while the first person experience of consciousness is only important to those who are interested in philosophy of mind. But I think this is quite incidental! They seem to be kind of similar to me.

I could abandon being Orthodox and I still wouldn't lose my belief in some kind of Big Deity (TM). I would just practice it in everyday life in some other way. (Say I would go to Church on Sunday, read the New Testament, etc.) But those other ways are not as attractive to me. I would need something immersive and pervasive (*chuckle* pervasive!), like Orthodox Judaism. Most branches of Christianity are not attractive to me because they does not offer that much of a structure in everyday life. (They might be good for other people, but not for me.) Islam, on the contrary, would probably be a good match for me, and if I weren't Jewish I'd probably be a Muslima. But I happen to be from a Jewish family, and while everyone from my immediate family is secular or has some other religion, I have this feeling that
1. I have an obligation to preserve the ways of my ancestors (and do so in the modern world)
2. if I weren't doing it, no one else from my family would, and our family customs would be gone. (And the Nazis would win, in a sense.) They are mostly gone already, I can only preserve what's left.
If I weren't born Jewish, I'd probably have become a Muslima because it's much easier to convert to Islam than Judaism.

I hope it makes more sense now!

Wow, posting here is time-consuming because I still haven't learned to shut up and my posts invariably become super long So the other replies will have to come later! That Philadelphia should come up is interesting, because my American online friends are almost all from there, alas, most of them aren't Jewish. (My Jewish online friends tend to be from New York.)

Wrong. You don't join WP as an NT, and you don't join a religion if you don't believe it. I'm not about to go join some illegal alien rally if I'm not illegal. You don't join something for community, you do it first and foremost for its/your beliefs. And I'm sorry, but if you don't join for those reasons then you're just a follower and groupy.

1. There are quite a few NAS members here.

2. Maybe, maybe not. Depends on what you get out of it.
This is like saying one doesn't work somewhere, unless
they believe in the company - there are other reasons.

3. Maybe you're not, but people do like to give support.

4. Many religious people seem to do JUST THAT. No real
concern about the fundamental tenants of the religion,
but a sense of community with the other members.
Probably the best thing that religion has to offer
to those who can't touch it's REAL power.

I'm really tempted to post a Help me I'm NOT Jewish!! !! thread.

Did you read my reply? If yes, then I'm really puzzled.

Yeah, and I'm not arguing with you. I was replying to Krex.

Ramsus:

OK, I think I see it now, it's more of an 'in principle people would' sort of argument than a 'Dvora is' argument... maybe I'm a bit paranoid!

BTW this gets me wondering. Namely, why do people become Goths? It's usually 'the music' or 'the culture', and if someone joins because of 'the clothing' s/he is shunned. I know quite an amount of Goths (though I am not one... I'm into industrial music and this is why I know them), and it seems to me that clothing is just as important in the Gothic subculture as the music; if you don't dress the part, you're not a Goth even if all you listen to is Gothic music. But if you're just in for the clothing, you're a poseur. *scratches head* How does this work?

If you're implying I'm goth, prepare for the WP apocalypse. The lighting just struct me weird in that picture.

Last edited by Ramsus on 10 May 2007, 12:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

No, I can barely see you in the picture, so I definitely wasn't referring to you! I think if you were a Goth you'd have some extremely gothy icon (but then again, all the Goths I know are NT, so maybe I shouldn't generalize). It just occurred to me because I was looking at the gothic tribal fusion belly dance thread (yes, there is such a thread!) here at approx. the same time, and it got me wondering.