6 Harsh Truths that will make you a Better Person

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Marknis
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05 Jan 2017, 12:52 pm

Sabreclaw wrote:
It's not necessarily bad advice, but it throws individualism out the window and doesn't even try to acknowledge the fact that there's countless cases where these things didn't apply. It's just another person who thinks they're an experts on relationships and just love to let everyone know the REAL advice is. Frankly, that kind of attitude is insufferable.


All I needed to know. I am allergic to herd conformity and anything that tells you to drop your individuality. The rednecks and rap kids who terrorized me at school showed me the ugly side of those things so I can't stomach anything that is basically punishment in disguise.



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05 Jan 2017, 7:38 pm

I think many are overlooking that the article is bringing forth some ugly truths (even if it is from a gloating nobody on a Cracked article) and it is up to you to use those truths in order to find your own way to improve as a person.

While they offer a little advice, they are leaving it for the most part up to you to make changes and figure out what changes to make.


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06 Jan 2017, 3:20 pm

TheSpectrum wrote:
I think many are overlooking that the article is bringing forth some ugly truths (even if it is from a gloating nobody on a Cracked article) and it is up to you to use those truths in order to find your own way to improve as a person.

While they offer a little advice, they are leaving it for the most part up to you to make changes and figure out what changes to make.


Seems like garbage they'd hand out to corporate office workers to read, in an attempt to encourage them to progress in into borderline sociopathic businessmen. I can't even decipher what exactly the 6 harsh truths are supposed to be.

I got:
-love and kindness don't really matter, unless it directly results in doing things for other people they can't get elsewhere.

Which I don't really get because I have seen this disproven more than once...it seems people do value those things even if they don't necessarily get something out of it they couldn't have gotten somewhere else. For instance would you reject a gift from someone just because you can go get the same item yourself? Imagine how nasty that would play out 'oh thanks for the gift but I can just go by this myself you should have gotten me something I can't afford and/or can't get on my own.'

-You are your job and in addition your job dictates how much respect you get, regardless of how you yourself behave as a person.

I don't really get this, It doesn't make sense that I should adjust my level of respect for someone based on what their job is...if I am out and about and interact with any employees i have the same base level of respect and its up to how that person acts whether that increases or decreases.

The only part that kind of made sense was the end where it says listing a bunch of faults you don't have isn't a good tactic to appear more attractive, you have to show what good/interesting traits you do have in addition to lacking those faults.


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06 Jan 2017, 4:11 pm

I love this quote from inside the article

" the standard maneuver when narcissism is confronted with a greater power -- quietly seethe and fantasize about finding information that will out him as a hypocrite. So satisfying."

Which pretty much sums up the motivation for writing the article itself. It's basically some narcissist pushing his own trite world view on others, and telling them they are hypocrites if they don't agree with him. Too funny.

There is another way of looking at transactions. The way I look at it, there are people who love you just because you are you, or you are their family, and they don't really look at what they get from you unless the imbalance becomes intolerable.

Then there is the rest of the world, and that's where relationships are transaction-based. The article ignores the private world, and it's too cynical about the public world. Of course people look at what you can do for them - but a lot of people understand that this works two ways. You have to tell people how you want to be treated. This is something autistic people need to work on, because the default stance is to do the right thing, or the usual thing, which makes you predictable. You have to impart the message that whether you are nice or not depends on how they behave. And most people have something to give.


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07 Jan 2017, 12:59 pm

You know what's kind of funny? My mother said I could easily get a girlfriend if I wanted to because I didn't have so and so negative qualities. I agree with the article that listing faults you don't have does not make you in any way desirable.



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07 Jan 2017, 1:32 pm

Sabreclaw wrote:
You know what's kind of funny? My mother said I could easily get a girlfriend if I wanted to because I didn't have so and so negative qualities. I agree with the article that listing faults you don't have does not make you in any way desirable.


I wouldn't say it doesn't make one desirable in any way, but if they have no positive traits in addition to lacking those faults that is the problem.


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07 Jan 2017, 1:42 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Sabreclaw wrote:
You know what's kind of funny? My mother said I could easily get a girlfriend if I wanted to because I didn't have so and so negative qualities. I agree with the article that listing faults you don't have does not make you in any way desirable.


I wouldn't say it doesn't make one desirable in any way, but if they have no positive traits in addition to lacking those faults that is the problem.


My mother just has a lot of contempt for men in general. She thinks the majority are abusers. I tried arguing with her, but she won't have a bar of it. She's going to be really disappointed when she sees I'm still single in the next few years, lol.



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07 Jan 2017, 2:04 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Sabreclaw wrote:
You know what's kind of funny? My mother said I could easily get a girlfriend if I wanted to because I didn't have so and so negative qualities. I agree with the article that listing faults you don't have does not make you in any way desirable.


I wouldn't say it doesn't make one desirable in any way, but if they have no positive traits in addition to lacking those faults that is the problem.


So, then you're agreeing with the article and Sabreclaw.

This bit reminds of my what's known as "hygiene factors" in organizational behaviour. Things that just have to be there as a bare minimum for someone to want to work at your workplace. Things like heat, light, washrooms, water etc. None of these things make an employer a particularly attractive place to work and they are not motivators, they're just baseline things (known as hygiene factors) that must be there in order to be an acceptable employer vs a desirable one.

Also reminds me of Chris Rock's "N* vs black people" comedy sketch where he talks about some guy saying "I ain't never been to jail!" and his response is:: "You're not SUPPOSED to go to jail!! !"

But yeah, same same.. not being a jerk doesn't make you desirable, it just means you're not particularly undesirable. Too many people don't really fully comprehend this & conversations with mothers/others about how someone isn't a bad guy doesn't actually make them an attractive guy. I know mothers, and others, who say these things mean well.. buuuut reality is that just because someone isn't a laundry list of faults, doesn't mean they're a catch, either. Same goes for people thinking these things of themselves.. "but I'm not a jerk like so-and-so is, why does he have a gf and I don't?" well, that guy may very well be a jerk... but there's something about him that IS desirable.


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07 Jan 2017, 8:35 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Sabreclaw wrote:
You know what's kind of funny? My mother said I could easily get a girlfriend if I wanted to because I didn't have so and so negative qualities. I agree with the article that listing faults you don't have does not make you in any way desirable.


I wouldn't say it doesn't make one desirable in any way, but if they have no positive traits in addition to lacking those faults that is the problem.


So, then you're agreeing with the article and Sabreclaw.

This bit reminds of my what's known as "hygiene factors" in organizational behaviour. Things that just have to be there as a bare minimum for someone to want to work at your workplace. Things like heat, light, washrooms, water etc. None of these things make an employer a particularly attractive place to work and they are not motivators, they're just baseline things (known as hygiene factors) that must be there in order to be an acceptable employer vs a desirable one.

Also reminds me of Chris Rock's "N* vs black people" comedy sketch where he talks about some guy saying "I ain't never been to jail!" and his response is:: "You're not SUPPOSED to go to jail!! !"

But yeah, same same.. not being a jerk doesn't make you desirable, it just means you're not particularly undesirable. Too many people don't really fully comprehend this & conversations with mothers/others about how someone isn't a bad guy doesn't actually make them an attractive guy. I know mothers, and others, who say these things mean well.. buuuut reality is that just because someone isn't a laundry list of faults, doesn't mean they're a catch, either. Same goes for people thinking these things of themselves.. "but I'm not a jerk like so-and-so is, why does he have a gf and I don't?" well, that guy may very well be a jerk... but there's something about him that IS desirable.


I am agreeing with that single point from the article yes, but as my last post mentions I wasn't a fan of the majority of the article.


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07 Jan 2017, 10:07 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Seems like garbage they'd hand out to corporate office workers to read, in an attempt to encourage them to progress in into borderline sociopathic businessmen. I can't even decipher what exactly the 6 harsh truths are supposed to be.

I got:
-love and kindness don't really matter, unless it directly results in doing things for other people they can't get elsewhere.

Which I don't really get because I have seen this disproven more than once...it seems people do value those things even if they don't necessarily get something out of it they couldn't have gotten somewhere else. For instance would you reject a gift from someone just because you can go get the same item yourself? Imagine how nasty that would play out 'oh thanks for the gift but I can just go by this myself you should have gotten me something I can't afford and/or can't get on my own.'


I agree and care more about the intentions behind it. I also sometimes think it's attractive when guys try to help others, even when they aren't doing anything for me. Then at the same time, I don't like it when jerks pretend to be nice by doing things for me because their real intention is to gas-light and manipulate.



Last edited by slw1990 on 07 Jan 2017, 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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07 Jan 2017, 10:13 pm

slw1990 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Seems like garbage they'd hand out to corporate office workers to read, in an attempt to encourage them to progress in into borderline sociopathic businessmen. I can't even decipher what exactly the 6 harsh truths are supposed to be.

I got:
-love and kindness don't really matter, unless it directly results in doing things for other people they can't get elsewhere.

Which I don't really get because I have seen this disproven more than once...it seems people do value those things even if they don't necessarily get something out of it they couldn't have gotten somewhere else. For instance would you reject a gift from someone just because you can go get the same item yourself? Imagine how nasty that would play out 'oh thanks for the gift but I can just go by this myself you should have gotten me something I can't afford and/or can't get on my own.'


I agree and care more about the intentions behind it. I also sometimes think it's attractive when guys try to help others, even when they aren't doing anything for me. Then at the same time, I don't like it when jerks pretend to be nice by doing things for me because their real intention is to gas-light and manipulate.


It's kind of like if someone opens a door for you, sure you can do it yourself but it is a nice gesture..and I think more people appreciate it than don't. It certainly matters to me when people do something kind even if its something someone else could do or something I can do myself. Basically if you think someone owes you something because you did something nice, that is a problem....like if that person who opens the door for you then says because they did that for you, you have to bring their goods to the car that wouldn't go over very well.


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07 Jan 2017, 10:22 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
slw1990 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Seems like garbage they'd hand out to corporate office workers to read, in an attempt to encourage them to progress in into borderline sociopathic businessmen. I can't even decipher what exactly the 6 harsh truths are supposed to be.

I got:
-love and kindness don't really matter, unless it directly results in doing things for other people they can't get elsewhere.

Which I don't really get because I have seen this disproven more than once...it seems people do value those things even if they don't necessarily get something out of it they couldn't have gotten somewhere else. For instance would you reject a gift from someone just because you can go get the same item yourself? Imagine how nasty that would play out 'oh thanks for the gift but I can just go by this myself you should have gotten me something I can't afford and/or can't get on my own.'


I agree and care more about the intentions behind it. I also sometimes think it's attractive when guys try to help others, even when they aren't doing anything for me. Then at the same time, I don't like it when jerks pretend to be nice by doing things for me because their real intention is to gas-light and manipulate.


It's kind of like if someone opens a door for you, sure you can do it yourself but it is a nice gesture..and I think more people appreciate it than don't. It certainly matters to me when people do something kind even if its something someone else could do or something I can do myself. Basically if you think someone owes you something because you did something nice, that is a problem....like if that person who opens the door for you then says because they did that for you, you have to bring their goods to the car that wouldn't go over very well.


That or they are trying to make you doubt your perception by gas-lighting so that you can be easier to control and manipulate.



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07 Jan 2017, 10:28 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Sabreclaw wrote:
You know what's kind of funny? My mother said I could easily get a girlfriend if I wanted to because I didn't have so and so negative qualities. I agree with the article that listing faults you don't have does not make you in any way desirable.


I wouldn't say it doesn't make one desirable in any way, but if they have no positive traits in addition to lacking those faults that is the problem.


So, then you're agreeing with the article and Sabreclaw.

This bit reminds of my what's known as "hygiene factors" in organizational behaviour. Things that just have to be there as a bare minimum for someone to want to work at your workplace. Things like heat, light, washrooms, water etc. None of these things make an employer a particularly attractive place to work and they are not motivators, they're just baseline things (known as hygiene factors) that must be there in order to be an acceptable employer vs a desirable one.

Also reminds me of Chris Rock's "N* vs black people" comedy sketch where he talks about some guy saying "I ain't never been to jail!" and his response is:: "You're not SUPPOSED to go to jail!! !"

But yeah, same same.. not being a jerk doesn't make you desirable, it just means you're not particularly undesirable. Too many people don't really fully comprehend this & conversations with mothers/others about how someone isn't a bad guy doesn't actually make them an attractive guy. I know mothers, and others, who say these things mean well.. buuuut reality is that just because someone isn't a laundry list of faults, doesn't mean they're a catch, either. Same goes for people thinking these things of themselves.. "but I'm not a jerk like so-and-so is, why does he have a gf and I don't?" well, that guy may very well be a jerk... but there's something about him that IS desirable.


I must be one of the few that thinks niceness itself, as in being a genuinely kind person and not just neutral, IS more than a baseline trait, because all i really need in a girl is I'm attracted to her, we're compatible and she is a nice person exactly.

Anything else really is just icing on the generic vanilla cake for me but I guess 95% of people have much higher standards than I do.

Niceness is a privilege, not a given, and the vast majority of people are not nice at all.

Those who mistreated for having clear visual deformities, disabilities such as downs, or are just extremely ugly, at often mocked or laughed at and someone actually being 'nice' to them, and by that I mean genuinely nice, not neutral, would be appreciated.

Secondly, I believe the vast.majority of people have committed at least one crime, even if no one ever knew, petty theft counts, and that for.most people it would probably actually be ditticult to resist committing crime in a situation you were guaranteed to get away with it, so yeah I even have slightly more respect fpr those who are law.abiding, but again I guess is only me who respects the goody Two shoes/boy scout types who never have a bad moral bone in their body.

A better analogy would be a workplace with all the baselines AND a good reputation vs a workplace known to mistreat workers but offers better pay, more worker benefits and is at a nice holiday resort.

Certainly most may pick the second but its ridiculous the first place would get so few offers or opportunity, just like a 'nice' guy, and I mean a genuinely hardworking, honest, supportive and caring person, is for some reason seen as having 'nothing to offer' due to not making much money or not driving yet, or still lives at home, etc
when.personally i consider honesty, kindness, selfessness, etc. things noble and admirable virtues of character that only a rare few actually have.

Actual niceness in a human being is as rare as gold, and about as valued as rusted Iron.



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07 Jan 2017, 10:31 pm

And no, I do not consider myself a nice person.

But I do value it highly.



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07 Jan 2017, 10:38 pm

Outrider wrote:

I must be one of the few that thinks niceness itself, as in being a genuinely kind person and not just neutral, IS more than a baseline trait, because all i really need in a girl is I'm attracted to her, we're compatible and she is a nice person exactly.

Anything else really is just icing on the generic vanilla cake for me but I guess 95% of people have much higher standards than I do.

Niceness is a privilege, not a given, and the vast majority of people are not nice at all.

Those who mistreated for having clear visual deformities, disabilities such as downs, or are just extremely ugly, at often mocked or laughed at and someone actually being 'nice' to them, and by that I mean genuinely nice, not neutral, would be appreciated.

Secondly, I believe the vast.majority of people have committed at least one crime, even if no one ever knew, petty theft counts, and that for.most people it would probably actually be ditticult to resist committing crime in a situation you were guaranteed to get away with it, so yeah I even have slightly more respect fpr those who are law.abiding, but again I guess is only me who respects the goody Two shoes/boy scout types who never have a bad moral bone in their body.

A better analogy would be a workplace with all the baselines AND a good reputation vs a workplace known to mistreat workers but offers better pay, more worker benefits and is at a nice holiday resort.

Certainly most may pick the second but its ridiculous the first place would get so few offers or opportunity, just like a 'nice' guy, and I mean a genuinely hardworking, honest, supportive and caring person, is for some reason seen as having 'nothing to offer' due to not making much money or not driving yet, or still lives at home, etc
when.personally i consider honesty, kindness, selfessness, etc. things noble and admirable virtues of character that only a rare few actually have.

Actual niceness in a human being is as rare as gold, and about as valued as rusted Iron.


I don't think people are usually talking about genuinely nice people when they complain about 'nice guys', that is more specifically guys who will be 'nice' to a woman they are interested in regardless of if the interest is mutual and expect her to become his girlfriend in return for being nice. Like a guy who might be very nice to a woman until she turns him down for a date, then all the sudden shes a selfish sl*t, wh*re b*tch because she didn't date him in return for the kindness.

Even you say you would date a nice girl, but she'd still need to be compatible and attractive to you, so even for you niceness alone wouldn't be enough for you to want to be in a relationship with her.

But yes I would imagine most people have committed at least one crime even if unintentionally.


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Last edited by Sweetleaf on 07 Jan 2017, 10:42 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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07 Jan 2017, 10:40 pm

It's just cynical 'what have done for me lately' horse**** for the most part, how does that make you a better person at all? They might be 'harsh truths' even in that the world really is that crappy, it seems like something that would just make you more bitter and angry. Apparently everything is about what you can do for someone else, apparently this guy thinks taking a karate or cooking class somehow makes you 'interesting'. Yes, you will be happier and people will treat you better if you have lots of money because most people at their core are very selfish and shallow. These selfish shallow people tend to run roughshod over the people that don't play that game which is probably why they 'succeed' in life.