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Sabreclaw
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04 Feb 2018, 8:35 am

AngelRho wrote:
Sabreclaw wrote:
Marknis wrote:
I read an ebook by someone who is in his late 50's who's never had a girlfriend despite his attempts and he's accepted he will most likely die alone. Back when I first learned I had Aspergers, I read similar stories and they molded my outlook. With every passing year, this fear becomes more and more apt.


Nobody on this site seems to understand how brutal it is to watch everyone around you effortlessly attract people while it's impossible for yourself to do so. And you'll just get conflicting advice; be yourself, change yourself, ask out a huge number of women to try and get a few dates here and there, only ask out special women, get out more, focus on your hobbies, abandon your hobbies and develop new ones, focus on yourself, give up, keep trying, etcetera.

Nobody can agree on the magic formula because there is none. People in our situation are fundamentally flawed to begin with, the standard advice doesn't apply to us because we're bad fits with society in the first place.

You might be right.

However, that’s about as helpful as “standard advice.” I’m more a proponent of meeting large numbers of women. I dislike targeting specific women because it sets you up to obsess over someone who is, based on pure chance, NOT going to reciprocate—or even if she does, the long-term outlook isn’t good, or at least not in your favor.

But even if you don’t take my advice, the main thing that gets you there is consistency, and that’s with anything you want to do in life. People who get dates all the time on websites are people who’ve been at it enough to learn the tricks. Some are quicker than others. And I think that creates the illusion that they possess something we do not. My wife and I are a very unlikely couple, but we got together. You owe it to yourself to at least try.

This reminds me of something my daughter did. She really wants to get into art, and I’m totally clueless. I can do some crude pencil sketches and that’a about it. So she’d Take pieces out of this art kit she got for her birthday and spend the next hour sobbing because she couldn’t figure out how to make it work. This went on for nearly a month. So I took a look. One part was a spiral art stencil. So I fit the two pieces together and ran a pencil through it. She’s like, whoa... Now I can’t keep my kids away from making spiral art.

You aren’t missing anything. You just haven’t stuck with it enough to understand it. You can’t just try one thing a few times and expect results. My daughter thought the art kit was something like the Trolls movie where the lead character cuts a few things with scissors, adds glue, opens up a scrapbook and it instantly spits glitter at you.

Real life doesn’t actually work that way. I’m uncomfortable with the idea of going up to one girl you like just to ask her out on one date and spending the rest of the year crying because she rejected you. I’m uncomfortable with most early emotional attachments, period, for that very reason. It sets up unrealistic expectations and messes you up inside. Save it for when the attraction is mutual.


I know your stance on this. However, plenty of other people have the exact opposite stance. So when there's so many gurus around with differing opinions, all insisting insisting their way is the right way, all the advice ends up being a meaningless blur of concepts. Marknis has to find his own way, not rely on the opinions on some random folks on the internet as gospel.



Sabreclaw
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04 Feb 2018, 8:36 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I know exactly how it feels to watch others achieve effortlessly things which takes lots of effort on my part.

Do you have a retirement plan at the library? Are you a civil servant?

If you are, you have a pension coming to you.


There's a difference between "things" and our primary biological urge. Being shut out of sexual relationships for no apparent reason is mind-boggling and infuriating.



kraftiekortie
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04 Feb 2018, 9:15 am

I’ve felt that way at times, too.



Marknis
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04 Feb 2018, 9:52 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I know exactly how it feels to watch others achieve effortlessly things which takes lots of effort on my part.

Do you have a retirement plan at the library? Are you a civil servant?

If you are, you have a pension coming to you.


It feels like the universe is giving you a huge middle finger.

I am told I have retirement money. I don't know what makes one qualify to be a city employee.

I don't want to live for that pension if my life is going to remain the same until then.



kraftiekortie
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04 Feb 2018, 10:06 am

You just GOTTA get to Austin. There, you could give Bible-belters a (metaphorical) middle finger.

I would stay at the library if I were you.

If you can get a full-time job at a college library, you’ll probably get free tuition.



AngelRho
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04 Feb 2018, 2:46 pm

Sabreclaw wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
Sabreclaw wrote:
Marknis wrote:
I read an ebook by someone who is in his late 50's who's never had a girlfriend despite his attempts and he's accepted he will most likely die alone. Back when I first learned I had Aspergers, I read similar stories and they molded my outlook. With every passing year, this fear becomes more and more apt.


Nobody on this site seems to understand how brutal it is to watch everyone around you effortlessly attract people while it's impossible for yourself to do so. And you'll just get conflicting advice; be yourself, change yourself, ask out a huge number of women to try and get a few dates here and there, only ask out special women, get out more, focus on your hobbies, abandon your hobbies and develop new ones, focus on yourself, give up, keep trying, etcetera.

Nobody can agree on the magic formula because there is none. People in our situation are fundamentally flawed to begin with, the standard advice doesn't apply to us because we're bad fits with society in the first place.

You might be right.

However, that’s about as helpful as “standard advice.” I’m more a proponent of meeting large numbers of women. I dislike targeting specific women because it sets you up to obsess over someone who is, based on pure chance, NOT going to reciprocate—or even if she does, the long-term outlook isn’t good, or at least not in your favor.

But even if you don’t take my advice, the main thing that gets you there is consistency, and that’s with anything you want to do in life. People who get dates all the time on websites are people who’ve been at it enough to learn the tricks. Some are quicker than others. And I think that creates the illusion that they possess something we do not. My wife and I are a very unlikely couple, but we got together. You owe it to yourself to at least try.

This reminds me of something my daughter did. She really wants to get into art, and I’m totally clueless. I can do some crude pencil sketches and that’a about it. So she’d Take pieces out of this art kit she got for her birthday and spend the next hour sobbing because she couldn’t figure out how to make it work. This went on for nearly a month. So I took a look. One part was a spiral art stencil. So I fit the two pieces together and ran a pencil through it. She’s like, whoa... Now I can’t keep my kids away from making spiral art.

You aren’t missing anything. You just haven’t stuck with it enough to understand it. You can’t just try one thing a few times and expect results. My daughter thought the art kit was something like the Trolls movie where the lead character cuts a few things with scissors, adds glue, opens up a scrapbook and it instantly spits glitter at you.

Real life doesn’t actually work that way. I’m uncomfortable with the idea of going up to one girl you like just to ask her out on one date and spending the rest of the year crying because she rejected you. I’m uncomfortable with most early emotional attachments, period, for that very reason. It sets up unrealistic expectations and messes you up inside. Save it for when the attraction is mutual.


I know your stance on this. However, plenty of other people have the exact opposite stance. So when there's so many gurus around with differing opinions, all insisting insisting their way is the right way, all the advice ends up being a meaningless blur of concepts. Marknis has to find his own way, not rely on the opinions on some random folks on the internet as gospel.

Ok, my opinion or approach isn’t the point. If you want to go the creepy obsessed route and jump from heartbreak to heartbreak, that’s your business. You CAN win that way and plenty of people do. I simply prefer a method that increases the odds of success and focuses on small wins along the way. The more small victories you win, the more encouraging the process and hence the more enjoyable and motivating. I used the “fall in love at first sight” creepy approach in the past and it drove me nearly suicidal. Some people can make it work, and I eventually did, but I also gained a totally new perspective on dating as a whole. If I were back in the dating game, it would look nothing like in my past.

The point is not HOW you do it. It’s how much you stick to a plan that works. Your way, my way...doesn’t matter. Try this one time, try that one time...no, it doesn’t work because you haven’t worked it out enough to really know what you’re doing. It’s like learning to read but quitting because you’re too pissed off that learning ABC’s is haaaaaaaaaaaarrrrddddd. I feel the same way about programming computers. It just pisses me off too much. I still make mistakes. In fact, the project I’m working on now has a mistake so deep in my work I’m finding it impossible to find and correct it. I’m finding other mistakes I made along the way and fixing a TON of copy/paste recursive kinds of mistakes, but this ONE THING still messes up.

Not that everything works just like whatever is on my mind at the moment, but are the problems repetitive kinds of errors or is it a single nit picky thing that ruins the whole? Or is it more lack of practice and too much difficulty understanding the code? For my purposes, the computer knowledge is simple and specific, i.e. the skills are within very simple steps that work together to build complexity and nuance. Here is a formula to build an array, here is an object that calls for a specific point in the array at a specific time. My problem has been that the answers I need are too simple to comprehend when what I want is the complex end result—and because I’ve always been used to that, it’s too easy to just go for the final result, even though that’s more time consuming than building an app that can do the work instantaneously.

You have to “program” yourself for winning at relationships. The “code” isn’t so much understanding the opposite sex as it is your own capabilities. The changes you need to make aren’t complicated. The key to understanding yourself is believing that the answers are simple one-liners, not a deep, complex script that you need advanced knowledge or specialized skill to understand.



Marknis
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04 Feb 2018, 3:28 pm

I just can't buy into anything you say, AngelRho. You keep leaving out the fact you love the Bible Belt and how you agree with its anti-intellectualism.



AngelRho
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04 Feb 2018, 7:57 pm

Marknis wrote:
I just can't buy into anything you say, AngelRho. You keep leaving out the fact you love the Bible Belt and how you agree with its anti-intellectualism.

Can’t reply to that right now...too busy watching the Super Bowl.



AngelRho
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05 Feb 2018, 10:39 am

Marknis wrote:
I just can't buy into anything you say, AngelRho. You keep leaving out the fact you love the Bible Belt and how you agree with its anti-intellectualism.

Depends on what you mean by “anti-intellectual.” People posing as brights aren’t necessarily so. It just means they speak in certain self-referential patterns in order to maintain an air of superiority. Just because you’re a snob doesn’t make you better than everyone. But people subscribe to all sorts of obscure ideologies that only they can understand because it makes them feel better about themselves. I have no need for pseudo-intellectual security blankets in my life, but some people do. I don’t judge them, and I don’t waste my time with useless arguments.

As to omitting the other detail, it’s not relevant. I don’t hide the fact that I’m a Christian, either, but it’s NOT RELEVANT. I figured you’d be grateful that I DON’T bring it up. I’m not offering anything that doesn’t apply universally.

Getting back to something that IS relevant...

Why not keep working at those online dating websites? Work through it slowly, find out what works for most people, adapt it to yourself. Keep what gets positive responses, abandon what doesn’t. You can do this.



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06 Feb 2018, 5:26 pm

Ehh, a lot of people seem to struggle with them. I find them super-impersonal and awkward. Then again I'm not a shining beacon of charisma.