Free ebook on dating for Aspie men

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Complex, just reading through this (the book) to see what you have here.

I think the most interesting thing about all this, or most guys who have the problems with insecurity, is it really does start with parents who don't raise them with an understanding of what the world really is or what its about. I think it can happen much more easily to aspie guys just because, if you start off as a kid with one hand tied behind your back socially, you're pretty much a worm on a real big hook. I went though all of that, did learn how to dress very much like my friends (not trying to be them, I made friends with people who really reflected a lot of things that I could relate to and try to really sort out what my NT likeness really was - if I took a step back and stopped taking AS as my primary identity). I also did work a lot at getting better at things, bettering my walk and bettering my movements.

Like anyone else though, I tend to need external stimulus to realize things quite often. Yeah, we can all sit there day after day and be obsessive about trying to solve a problem but if we're still working with old information, no matter how many times we review it, it doesn't come together like it should unless a new ingredient gets added.

Something, just reading about your buddy Phil, or a lot of things that you said about insecurity - its helping me to really understand what's going on with me. My insecurities never came in the form of blaming other people but what it did come down to, my neurological overload made me look 'special' (in a real condescending sense), people would realize I was ok or would like me once they got to know me but very often thought I was ret*d or not-all-there; even after years of having lots of great friends, parties in the summer with 10 or 15 people down my basement 3 nights a week, all of a sudden when I went back to an environment where I didn't have status pretty much given - the highschool treatment seemed to pick right back up.

I at least wisened up a lot through all that, came to understand human nature from the ground up, had a lot of anxieties but worked my way though well enough to control myself a lot better, came to control my reactions to the days where I did feel like I looked ret*d and could barely say a thing that didn't come off a bit choppy (for some reason, years of work, discipline, and learning has only had so much more power than chemistry).

The hard part about AS though, knowing your different, is that if you are trying to do your best and make a go of it - especially as a guy - you tend to try and criticize yourself through other people's eyes to find what you still need to work on with yourself. Eventually you get better at being able to laugh off or tell off people who really are blatantly wrong about you and are more than likely just trying to start a pissing contest. Still, this can yield a lot of bad habits that take just as long to purge - one being, when you're looking like isht, feeling like you need to talk and push yourself to say things - when you have nothing to say - just so you aren't creepy silent. That tends to manifest as insecurity a lot, self awareness over gestalt issues and the fact that you can much more often than not get responses from people on things that seem very incongruent with your behavior and intentions; once you really start getting the social knowledge down your all of a sudden in that gray zone where the scale starts to tip and your really creating most of the problems yourself - you can realize this and quite easily have no idea where to go from that point.

I definitely appreciate you posting that book just because, with what I was saying before and in reference to what I just described, I think you dropped one of those linking points. Being that I am pretty determined to help myself, when I do have a viable and efficient means figured out, you bet I'll be all over that one (though I'll also admit - the fact that I do have shy and insecure mannerisms when I overload means that I'm probably doing this far more just get myself on point and gain more in terms of emotional health - may have effect in the primary context that your describing it in but its still going to take me not fearing my appearance at all, that could still take years).

Thanks for the kind words Gwenevyn, and most importantly your criticism. Of course you're correct, there is nothing wrong with being a bit nerdy or even having hobbies that are outside of the adult mainstream. I certainly wouldn't tell anyone to completely give-up something that they enjoy. However (and you understand this a little further down in your comments) is that most guys who have trouble getting a date have that trouble in part because they spend massive amounts of time and money on their hobbies to the exclusion of all else. Over the years, many of these men have spent so much money on their hobbies that they are often sitting on small fortunes worth of collectibles, which is wealth that often can be better spent improving ones life, or even as you suggest helping the less fortunate.

Just speaking from my own experience, when I was younger I used to spend all of my money on records, comic books, and even toys (and many of these things I would buy two of, a side-effect of the AS no doubt) all the while living in my parents' basement. There are a lot of guys like this. There is nothing wrong with records, or comics, or even toys--but living is important too. After I moved out, I certainly didn't sell all of my things, but I did sell the doubles and the things that I realized I was collecting just for the sake of collecting and that I didn't actively enjoy. Once I devised my "keep only what I actively use and actively enjoy rule," I managed to sell enough things to buy a whole new wardrobe and several pieces of exercise equipment, two of the best purchases I've ever made!

So, while perhaps it came out differently in my book, the both of us basically agree.

Yeah, when choosing between:

a.) Being into some geeky endeavor and not hiding it, just letting it be a part of the "self" that you project

and

b.) Being into some geeky endeavor and hiding it


A. is infinitely better. The reason is, if you attempt B, the girl will eventually find out about it. And the fact that you enjoy something that you feel that you must hide, that you are ashamed of, is muchos negative points regardless of whatever the thing is.

Is this a good book ?

It's free, so download it and make a judgment.

Well, I wouldn't hide anything. Having said that, often times people are more accepting of our hobbies or interests after they are attached to us. Most NTs play the geeky things down at first, then allow them to show after a friendship has been formed. It's a judgment call though.

Thanks Complex. I just read cover to cover. I appreciate the solid information and your unique writing style.

I think I learned much more about myself than I learned about women. Then again, maybe that was the whole point.

techstepgenr8tion,
You and I have had a very similar experience. It's important to remember that I wrote the book before I knew I had AS. Which is strange, but makes odd sense. When we have correct information, it's a lot easier for people like us to get through life, although sometimes even the correct information is hard to interpret.

Hi Complex. Just writing to congratulate you on the book. I like your writing style and you make a lot of good points. I feel some of it could be classified as general self-improvement and isn't just relevant to dating, but very valuable nonetheless. Just out of interest have you ever read or tried any of the stuff from other 'pick up artists' out there? That stuff tends to be more about becoming a hardcore player but there's some interesting parallels.

Anyway, congrats again and thanks.

Thank you for the kudos tybald! Personally, I find having a successful relationship and self-improvement intertwined. Women in general I find to be completely desirable in every way, not just sexual. For reasons I've layed out in my book, you have to be a quality guy if you want to be with a decent woman. Women are bombarded with guys who want something from them. If you want a woman to choose you, you have to be worth it. In retrospect, there were many good women who wanted to date me, but I was just to Aspie to get it. One of the big requests I've received is to write a new version with a chapter on flirting. To be honest, I'm much better with flirting than I was in the seven or eight years since I wrote the book, but I still don't understand it well enough to be able to articulate it to others. I will continue to ponder the issue, and if I crack the code I will share the secret with everybody here. If there is anybody who understands this (maybe a female member), please share!

For those of you who are skeptical, I used the principles in the book to win my wife. I paid a heavy price to learn the knowledge I posses. Much like in the book of Genesis, knowledge costs. While my wife loves me, she has put up with a lot of s**t to stay with me. I am mostly mainstreamed, but I'm still an Aspie, with the help of my wife and family, I continue to evolve.

This book was mainly written seven years before I was diagnosed with AS. I've always known I was different, and for the past number of years I've suspected that I have AS; but I was raised in a "no excuses" household and never allowed myself to entertain the possibility seriously. After reading a Wikipedia entry on AS, and then finding this site and being confronted with 18,000 people like myself, my suspicions were confirmed and I decided to get diagnosed. If I weren't raised as a norm, I would probably be flipping a hamburger some place and would have never had a relationship with a woman (something I've wanted since I was six).

I still don't know why I wrote this. I wrote it many years before I was diagnosed. I printed about four or five hard copies and had some help in editing from friends and a few coworkers. Most people were supportive. A few just humored me, and one or two even thought less of me for the endeavor. At one point I paid an editor $150 to go over it and help with the grammar. Back in 2000, Barnes and Noble launched an on-demand publishing site called "iUniverse" and the original idea was to publish it through them and sell about 5000 copies to clueless guys. The first draft was about 79 pages. Then I realized that iUnverse would only publish something that was minimum 123 pages, so I wrote more.

After a few years I became embarrassed by this book. Last Halloween, I deleted all copies from my harddrive, destroyed all backups, and burned my hardcopy as a sacrifice (I have this weird Halloween tradition, but that is another story). When I found this site and was diagnosed, it all made sense. I used a program to recover a deleted copy from my harddrive (there were about five versions, all were overwritten except an early full-length draft). After recovery I did two quick edits, converted to PDF, and released. There are probably still several spelling and grammatical errors. But I wanted to get it out because I felt that other Aspies, who need direct information, unambiguous information could use it. As I've said, if you find fault with it, please tell me and tell others. I don't want to distribute crap.

I've wanted a relationship with a woman since I was six years old, but I never knew how. My life has been difficult, but not anymore difficult than any other Aspie. I always wanted to improve, but have had many setbacks such as my first girlfriend and being accused (falsely) of sexual harassment. I transformed my body to be more attractive to women, twice in my life. I have paid for the knowledge I have, literally, with blood, sweat, and tears. The original intention was to sell it and make a little money. But when I found out who I really was, I decided to share what I know with my fellow Aspies for free, because I felt it was important and the right thing to do.

This book is not perfect, but it is the sum of my dating knowledge as of 2001. Guys, women are not unknowable, alien sex machines, they are people too. But, they communicate somewhat differently than men and have somewhat different needs. If you approach women as other people, but take the time to learn how they are different, you will find ways to relate.

If demand is sufficient, I will write a second, updated version of this book. Any subsequent versions will be made available from this site for free. If this site is interested, I would like to host it here permanently. My goal is 5000 downloads. So far, after a week we're at exactly 250.

By the way, I did not ever read any other girl getting guides and I never will. This work was completely a product of my own experience.

A few interesting side notes:

An unabridged version of this book exists on my harddrive with three additional chapters. I edited these chapters out because I did not believe them to add to the overall whole. If demand is sufficient, I will release the full version.

About four or five hard copies were produced in 2000 and 2001. The cover and title page of these versions featured photos of Bettie Page. I burned my copy, but my friends Joe and Paul may still have their copies. I decided not to use the Bettie Page photos on the ebook because she would not receive any compensation from a free distribution.

I will be be happy to elaborate more on the origin of the book if anyone is interested.

Other people involved in this book's creation were:
Zoe (consultant), Joan (consultant), Joe (consultant), Emily (consultant), and Ed (editor)

This book took hundreds of hours to write and edit.

This book was partially inspired by The KLF: "The Manual, How to Have a Number One the Easy Way"
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listin ... 772&sr=1-3

Last edited by Complex on 21 Mar 2008, 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sounds like we have very similar experiences of being raised as 'normal'. Interesting!

Yes, as I was raised as a norm even though most who knew me well (including myself) knew I wasn't some how. It was assumed that I had just inherited some of my Grandfather's less than desirable traits. Even though my family knew I was different, I was expected to try very hard to conform to accepted societal norms. I got better at it over a long period of time, but it probably wasn't until I was about 27 that I really "got it" as it were.

That and certain things and events in your life, especially when your dealing with a rather messed up group of people, can throw you for a look - even if you had things right for a time. I guess it all takes a lot of self-knowledge, going through the trials by fire and knowing you have it correct even after all of that for it to really shake out. Being resilient to life's insults takes easily as much bearing as it does self-assurance; the former is needed to make the later a stable thing (being able to tell which direction is up sometimes can be very confusing and the more your grip of that comes into question the more easy it is to deviate off course and get thrown by other people's ways of thinking - that leads to following which is almost never a good thing particularly for 'real' self improvement).

it's a very fine balance between individualism and knowing when to yield to society.

Up to 300 downloads now. Once again, this book is currently free from copyright, please feel free to redistribute.

The odometer is ticking up.