Friend zone.. it is one-sided?

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I dont think people avoid your friendship because they love you? how strange? People either like you and want to be friends , want to be your lover, have no interest. If they have no interest move on - dont call them a user, thats all Im saying.

I am saying if you dont value someones friendship then dont call them the user. If you are pissed that someone only wants to be your friend then you dont like them enough, if you like someone you want to be friends with them. If you dont like them then you probably shouldnt sleep with them either.

you might not be able to tell if guys are sexist but most women can because the guys say sexist things. They curl their lip in distain, patronise or similar. Women know when guys are sexist the same way you know if someone is racist, it has nothing to do with reading minds and everything to do with how your treated. I expect you and I have different views on what constitutes sexism though.

There are several possible reasons why a fan won't like to be in friendship after "Let's be just friends" . maybe the guy can't stand the jealousy by seeing you with another guy , or maybe can't stand the idea to be around you without having affection from you? In fact, those are the main reasons why guys would avoid such friendship with one-sided love , it's not jerkness if they refuse it because it is an unfair friendship.

Guys who are just looking for sex can look for prostitutes and escorts instead ...easier and faster, don't you think so?






Again, sexism has nothing to do with "Friends zone " issue , not in most cases anyways, so many sexist guys are true 'ladies men" (yet they are good actors and don't show sexism in front of you) and some guys are not sexist yet they fall in the friend zone.






Oh ....and can you tell me exactly WHY are you assuming this? Have you ever knew my definition of sexism before assuming this? Do you know me enough to assume this? Or you believe that you read my mind?
Talking about racism ...now I just smelled subtle racism coming from you after this statement ....I dunno why.

Bullsh*t, gross, misogynistic, as usual. I live with my guy friend and I'd say he and my boyfriend are more psychologically crippled than I am by emotions. I'm crippled by depression from time to time, but I don't think that's what they mean here. This is the age-old sh*t spewed forth by a few masculinized cultures in their gender-wars.

I live with my guy friend, with whom I used to have a relationship. If you're basing your time with girls around whether or not they provide you sex, this seems deeply unhealthy to me. Basically...



...what Lotus said here. It's as simple as that. Personally, I think it's flattering for a guy to be such a close and appreciated friend. Even keeping a little bit of sexuality in the mix, such as flirting, hugging, and cuddling, can be a good thing.

I've found with my guy friend that, as long as I give him little massages and cuddles on a fairly regular basis, it's just as good as it was. I want more than anything he find himself in a good relationship in the future, and I'm also trying to help him with that. It's what friends do for each other, male or female. I don't discriminate there. Why should we women have to? We're not chimps [anymore], for crisakes; we won't put out just because you offer us your banana, in other words.

^Well, there's a difference. You said you'd been in a relationship with this guy BEFORE, so it's not the same as a regular friendship. My one close friend (who's a guy) and I do NOT exchange cuddles or massages...

Actually, it tends to be much worse. It makes him much more lonely because he lives with the woman he basically lost. That's why I give him the attention I do, because he does at least deserve that. However, with guys I'm just friends with from the start, such physical things are kept to a minimum, and with good reason; I wouldn't want to give the wrong signals at all, because I don't want him for sex and I'm already in a lifelong relationship. If the friendship gets to a truly comfortable point, and I know he's not in it for sex whatsoever, then such things can definitely develop.

I don't blame the women friends for not being like that with their guy friends. We know most single guys are starving for sex and we, generally speaking, don't want to hurt guys by leading them on to empty buffets, nor do we want to get fondled or molested in some way, so we keep it clean. I can't speak for all women, of course, I'm only speaking generally, again, from experience.

Advice: if you're with a 'friender' and you want something more, speak up! Let it be known. If you're already friends, it can't hurt. Let her know what you want and it's likely she'll be more up front with what she wants. It's different if it's a loose acquaintance, so the same advice doesn't apply to that situation.

That's why most guys avoid that kind of friendship , it's not because they are sexist. I think your friend is torturing himself.

Women should just be upfront with men about whether they want to start something or not. If a woman were more likely to give me a clear yes or no answer, I would be more likely to ask her directly in the first place. It hurts far less for both parties for the man to be told no at the outset. Generally, if I'm told a clear no (or even a less hurtful "I'm not really attracted"), it helps me to move on.

On the flipside, once the man has been rejected, he should take that as a cue to move on and not look back. I myself am guilty of not following that rule (though she was using an ambiguous rejection), and it sent me into a 3-year depression before I was able to let go. As such, I went through most of high school not really noticing until after I graduated that I had single women hitting on me many times throughout my high school years.

In general, if people (both genders) were a little more upfront, relationships would be a whole lot easier to start. Alas.

PS: for the record, "let's be friends" is not a clear answer in and of itself, although I usually interpret that as a negative due to statistical observation. Saying "I'm not attracted to you in that way, but I would still like to be friends" is acceptable, however.

If a [person] puts you in the "friend-zone", and you don't want to be friends, put him/her at the curb (-zone). If you do want to be friends, and they show friendship in return, then there's no issue with being in a "-zone".

People who b***h about being in the "friend-zone" might as well be straight-up about what their problem really is... They are not in the f**king-me-zone. As Cyberman says, if you ask and are shot-down... that's pretty much that.

Why, because he has an otherwise deep and very possibly fulfilling friendship with love and no sex? So, if you exclude only the sex, it's torture? I'm not sure even he sees it that way. I'd guess not. Besides, he and I both think I'm not his 'type'.



I absolutely condone and insist on total open communication in any of my friendships and my relationship, so I totally agree with that. It's important for guys to remember to ask, however. A lot of women wait to be asked, too, both as a test (I think) and because it shows them that the guy is going to be more emotionally open either way. I've noticed my friends like to ask quite a lot of questions, naturally, so we expect the same of guys.

But I also think it's important for guys to have girl friends, not just girlfriends. To up and leave what could be a satisfying friendship seems pretty foolish to me. If you're not clicking as friends, however, I can see that, but then it wouldn't be very prudent to have been looking for a relationship, either, as has been discussed already.

Personally, I let a guy know once he's made it obvious he's after sex. There has been one situation where I didn't, but the guy was a creep and I wasn't exactly terrible to him, either. It didn't last long and I made sure to avoid him. And remember, it's not very pleasant to turn guys down, either. There can be hostility or just very hurt feelings, and both are easier avoided.

You are still not getting it , not only sex is excluded in that case....

In my case? Hell of a thing to surmise, considering you're not in on it. Maybe for you, something else would be missing -- what, I couldn't say, that would be your personal issue with it -- but for us, the only thing that has been excluded is sex. But from the very beginning, we were both young virgins just trying things out, so that has a hell of a lot to do with it. I make sure to let him know he's not rejected and that I want to keep him in my life, since we've been through so much together. To end the friendship would probably be very hurtful both ways, and to have sex within it, at this point, would be the same.

It could also have to do with how a person approaches sex. He was very carnal and unloving with it, and I basically was a play partner. For instance, I could see a lack of sex being damaging with my actual relationship, since there's something much more going on there. Funny thing is, he, too, used to 'just' be a friend before it all started. One never knows when things will blossom into something else, either. Neither of us had any idea.

So, what exactly is excluded aside from sex, in your opinion?

Your friendship with that guy is unusual ...cuddling and massaging ...what else? is there also french kissing?




You are in love now,no? Imagine that you lost that dream/hope that your bf will be your partner for life , that one important thing excluded aside from sex. I understand that your friend is single now and you are saying that he's feeling lonely and you cuddle him to make him feel better ....so he's missing this hope.

Just a little anal-play. Nothing special. (I'm kidding, of course.) The cuddling really isn't intense, and it's not that often, either. It's along the lines of what I would ever do with my girl friends, but more masculine.



Oh, I get what you're saying, and believe me, that would tear me apart to have him feel that. But I just don't feel that's the case with him and I, and never was, which is what I was trying to get at. I feel that, if anything, we're closer than we were when we were sexual. Bizarrely, we're still legally married, but never wanted to do that in the first place. It was all about the benefits.

I do get your point, though. If you're really attracted to a girl and fall deeply in love, this would be a serious problem. However, if just casually meeting and finding attraction and she's not interested in sex, it shouldn't be taken personally, and the friendship itself may be salvageable and worthwhile as it is. I just mean to say it shouldn't be thrown away because of a perceived total loss of hope.

Overall, I think it's very possible to have a great friendship with someone with whom you previously sought a relationship, especially if you have a lot of things in common and a lot of other 'chemistry'. It's the rampant misogyny I see as a result of these encounters that really bothers me.

I said that you would know when people are racist like I (or other women) would know when men are sexist, because I have heard you call people racist in the forum so I can see that you feel that people are racist toward you sometimes and can tell that they are.

its the same reason that I think we have different views on what is sexism is because I have read your posts and so know that our views are very different.

its ok to be different, different is cool!

To add to the debate... all my married friends (being a mother I know lots of married people) are married to nice men. These nice men are also their friends *shock* horror* oh my god, nice men can get married! I have yet to meet a jerk or "ladies man" as you put it be married to any of my friends. When I was younger I knew friends who dated jerks but I dont know any who are married to them.

I stand by my opinion that if a girl is not interested in you sexually thats ok, get over it, find someone who does like you. If you like her that much value her friendship.

Agree to disagree LPP

Again!! Can you tell me what's my definition and view on sexism based on my posts that you read?





I kinda agree that.

Yes. Sometimes it's the situation and not the person that is the problem. For instance, sometimes the friendship is really good and not worth risking with a relationship. Sometimes he or I might have just come out of a long relationship with a painful breakup. Sometimes you just want to be single.