When choosing a partner who needs to...

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so there's hope for us yet? yay!

Absolutely.

Thats basically what I've been trying to get at. I think I am not the only one who cannot see beyond his own flaws, and is thus convinced he has no shot at having a relationship. This is an area of mines which needs serious work. It's difficult to change ones feelings especially if they are so ingrained in one, but try we must.

Exactly. I think it is something done over time, and eventually it leads to inviting someone into your life that you feel you can trust to test your boundaries. It's an opportunity to grow and to learn new things about yourself. The flipside of that is the fear of rejection and that Aspies as a whole tend not to like change very much. I think the risk is worth it though. That just my two cents worth.

Even more important -- what made Sally break up with her boyfriend may be what makes Cindy fall in love with hers.

I have a couple of criteria, mostly a list of dealbreakers -- like smoking. I try to keep my list as short as possible.

Very true.

I think one has to be careful with criteria though (in general) because sometimes, the one who looks like they're all wrong for you and you would never consider at one point in time, could end up being your perfect mate. You just never know how it's going to turn out. There are a lot of risks involved when you invite someone else into your life, however limited. It's a matter of determining when and if you're ready to take on the challenge.

Here's the problem: too many women buy into what "the media" says, as well as what their friends say (who are also influenced by the media.) Therefore, they won't even consider dating guys like me. Why should they, when there are other guys who fit their media-influenced idea of "boyfriend material"?

The one thing I notice is alot of you guys lack confidence and self assurance. I am on the spectrum, and that is a turn off. One thing is to be confident and not to fear rejection. I mean rejection will happen, but there are plenty of girls who find oddball guys attractive.
Its a self fullfilling prophecy, if you think you are helpless you will be.

Secondly the keys are listening to her and having enough stuff in common where you can do some stuff she likes that you like as well. Even taking her out to dinner is a good idea, just not the same place all the time.

Another thing is be open early on about not picking up subtle hints and body language, say that you have a disability, but let her initiate that conversation further.

Lastly be honest and ask her to be the same. Really its about communication and NT men fail alot too with women because of a lack of it. Relationships live and die on talking to the other partner and being clear on limits,likes, dislikes, etc.

Also the physical thing...don't admit you are a virgin...its a dealkiller for alot of women. Its the one thing you should never say.

Hmm...Also not all NT women are alike, they are all a little different!

Part of it's not so much fear of rejection, but just unsure of what to say. As a person who hates small talk, I'm at my wits end when it comes to engaging a strange woman in initial conversation. My natural inclination would be to go up to a woman and ask, "What game do you like more, Settlers of Catan or Carcassonne?" But since that question would be meaningless to probably 99.99% of women, and would probably lead them to thinking I'm creepy, I'm not going to ask that.

I think the most likely answer is this - its beyond their control, it something that despite their efforts they'll realize that its things far more subtle than the content of their social skills that govern this.

That said, I think for us guys being hard on ourselves is a protection mechanism. Although raking yourself over the coals isn't seen as the most healthy thing to do in excess, its a welcome exchange from seeing one's self as a victim of things you can't control - which is far more hellish than just bullying yourself a bit. That and, until someone's given it their all they really have no idea what ratio of their problems are fixed/unmoveable vs. how much they can correct with manual effort, usually it takes going through that as far as you can take it before you can find any sort of peace with yourself or your situation.

Usually men externalize their frustrations onto external things like women, society, and other factors while women tend to internalize their frustrations....that's how I see it anyway.

I can relate to you there. I've dealt with self-confidence problems all my life, and only lately am I making any progress. I think that all the years of being bummed out, finally brought me to a point where I just said "Screw it, I'm not trying to be anyone else anymore". I was always trying to change myself to be more "perfect" in other's eyes, and it's exhausting and impossible to maintain. I realized that a relationship won't work like that anyhow, because eventually the real me will come out, and screw things up.

So, I decided to just be myself and see what happens. And in all honesty, I feel much better about myself, and more confident. Now all that energy that I was spending on trying to "fix" myself, has been re-directed at just "being myself". Life is much easier that way, and i suspect that it'll work out better in the long run. If only for the added self-confidence, it's worth it to me.

Sometimes you just have to tell yourself to not care so much.

I agree with you 100% there. It's a big waste of time trying to please others, and pretending to be someone your not. When I was younger, I was so afraid of rejection and what people thought of me. Anymore I really don't care what people think. It has helped me out a lot, and I think people actually like me better now.

Also, if you want to find the right person for you to have a relationship with, you have to be yourself anyways, because one day you might find each other, and not realize it, because one, or both of you is pretending to be someone else.

Bingo! You guys are very right in that. Woohoo. I feel like we've had a breakthrough moment in the Love & Dating section.

Well I've stopped caring what other people think... and I don't try to please everybody anymore or really try to be well-liked... Sure, it's gotten me a whole bunch of "friends" (i.e. what the world calls "friends", not by my definition), but nothing in the love department...

That doesn't mean you're doing anything wrong, TOS. It just means that timing isn't right yet. Just because we do all of the "right" things, it doesn't mean we get what we want, when we want it. Keep at it.