I don't want to date poor people

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How do they watch t.v and smoke weed all day every day if they're poor? How do they have a t.v to watch or weed to smoke if they aren't doing anything to bring in any money? Who is providing them this lifestyle?

If they are getting unemployment money, then that would imply they've worked to earn that, and will be going back to work at some point, as I imagine there is some form of limit as to how long you can be on unemployment.

Last edited by Sweetleaf on 01 Sep 2016, 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I completely agree with this. Having a more successful job would finish me off. Although, being English I don't have a good grasp of the US constitution... So maybe not that bit.

Frankly, I can use a few bucks.

I want to travel the world!

Centrelink. This is the Australian welfare department. Remember I'm talking about people I know in real life and people I know in real life live in Australia.

Please don't think I'm talking about you. I'm only talking about people I know in real life.Do poor people own TV sets? Yes. Yes they do. So long as they're not homeless they probably have a TV. Maybe back in 1950s you had to be rich to afford a TV.

A basic TV set is cheap nowadays. A little while ago when they stopped analogue TV lots of people bought flat panels (if not sooner) and people would just give away their old tube TVs. You could even find working TV sets left out on the footpath.

Those sets can't get digital but a few years ago there was a government program to give free converter boxes to poor people.

How do I know they watch TV and smoke weed? Because I know them personally.

How can they afford the weed? I guess weed is cheaper than cocaine. I don't really know how much weed costs.I'm not sure how your American system works. In Australia individuals do not have to pay into the system or have previous employment. Again I'm only talking about people I know personally and those people live in Australia.[/quote]and will be going back to work at some point, as I imagine there is some form of limit as to how long you can be on unemployment.[/quote]There is no time limit in Australia. My mother has been on it nonstop for the last 34 years. This is not uncommon. I was on it for 12 years. Even when I had part time work. You become ineligible when you have full time work. You're eligible when you turn 16.

But then they will find out anyway about your income as you two start dating more and more and get more serious.

and will be going back to work at some point, as I imagine there is some form of limit as to how long you can be on unemployment.[/quote]There is no time limit in Australia. My mother has been on it nonstop for the last 34 years. This is not uncommon. I was on it for 12 years. Even when I had part time work. You become ineligible when you have full time work. You're eligible when you turn 16.[/quote]

I just still would think watching t.v all day would get boring...do they ever go outside or do anything else? Either way that does seem like a different sort of system, why are they on welfare, is it just provided to anyone deemed poor or who doesn't have a full time job?

Australia has a much better welfare system than the United States, for better or worse.

Anyone at least age 16 who is not in school or working can file an application to Centrelink. NO prior jobs or work experience of any kind necessary.

You don't even have to graduate high school - dropouts can get on it too.

Most 16 year olds however are still in school and so have to wait until they graduate at 17/18 before they can do this.

For 16-25 year olds, the payment is called the 'Newstart Youth Allowance', which I've heard doesn't exist in America - you either work and earn cash or have to depend on your parents in the U.S. That's not the case here.

17-25 year olds (high school graduates to university age) who are studying will get a different kind of Youth Allowance for students.

There is also a 'living away from home' one that is slightly extra money, etc.

After age 25 it simply becomes Newstart, or the 'dole payment'.

The unemployment rate is a high 10%. Some people on the dole are trying to find work, others are just lazy. It is a category in Australian society that is significantly harshly judged by the unempathetic and non-understanding middle class.

Don't get me wrong, though - some are just plain lazy. The lazy one's are called 'dole bludgers'.

Most people on the dole don't live luxurious lifestyles, especially those with families to take care of and support.

Many aren't just sucking off the system, many try to find work but I've seen a high pattern of people on the dole generally being uneducated or undereducated and from very poor backgrounds.

It is in my experiences most unemployed men and women on the dole who have children are lower-middle class and often struggle just to get by.

Most people on the dole however can still live relatively stable lives, enough to pay the bills and put food on the table, and aren't at too much of a risk of homelessness.

Also, statistics say at least 25% of people on Newstart have a disability of some kind, so they are unfortunately lumped into the 'dole bludgers' category as well.

In the past few years our strict, conservative government has upped the criteria to get onto the disability pension.

It is now unrealistically high and difficult to meet and even many people who should be on it aren't.

Exactly.

Personally most young girls and women I meet anywhere close to my age through my family or family of friends are 'unambitious'.

Now, my definition of ambitious is a bit more general. To me it simply means trying your best to be happy and successful in some, most, or all categories of life - socially, financially, career-wise, educationally, etc.

I am working my hardest to be fit, mentally and physically healthy, well-groomed, interesting, social, friendly, educated, financially well-off, etc. despite my lower middle class background.

I haven't let the negative parts of my family drag me down.

Most other lower-middle class girls I meet have succumb to this.

Even the one's I've met that are actually functioning pretty well and quite independent, they appear mentally screwed up in the head (sociopathic, neurotic, etc.)

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a shining example of a mentally healthy person, but at least I'm trying to be.

A lower middle class girl giving even a half-a55éd effort in life as I am is all I ever ask for in a woman.

It's not like I don't give these types a chance, either.

I don't turn my nose up in snobbery or anything.

Here's the girl's I had a crush on last year in year 12:

Girl 1: Asperger's, though very high functioning. Social Anxiety Disorder. ADHD. Depression and insomniac.

Girl 2: OCD, bad home life, traumatic background, openly expresses creepily sociopathic behavior (i.e. not afraid to threaten to stab people and not joking about it, etc.)

Girl 3: N.T., though high school dropout, lower middle class. Very similar background and personality. Almost like opposite sex versions of each other. Just as 'ambitious' as I am. Laidback. Amazing.

Girl 4, aka ex-gf number 1: BPD, traumatic past, aggressive, depressed, suicidal, self-harmer, etc.

Girl 5: Bad home life, rough background. In foster care due to bad relationship with parents. Possible disability of some kind.

Girl 6, aka ex number 2: Middle class, actually pretty damn normal. N.T. Talked funny though due to being deaf as a kid, and very unique, weird and quirky personality (in an endearing way).

According to a friend from high school, it's a 'bad pattern' I've fallen into to keep gravitating towards messed up girls.

Honestly, I'd like a girlfriend who's had a rough background and possible mental disability like I do, but as the evidence shows most of them don't turn out to be very nice or easy to get along with except for a few rare gems out there.

I feel like it's a recipe for disaster - toxic and unhealthy relationships.

Is it really impossible to have a healthy relationship with one of these types?

Girl 3 was my dream girl, the one I think I would have had the most healthiest relationship with even if we don't last very long, and we're still friends today because I got back into contact with her. She liked me back, , though at this point only wanted to be friends. I'm over her now, though hopefully one day I'll meet someone similar to her.

Weren't you on welfare and playing games and watching tv all day, retro. Heck you got 2,000-2,5000 a month which is way more then I get. Yet now you got a job and fancy yourself middle class(what you got on welfare would be middle class income in the USA) you look down on the lessor people? Honesty it's stuff like this that make me feel horrible which causes me to have a messy room. Mean I'm so horrible and my life is pointless, so why bother trying to clean or keep organized doesn't matter anyways. I struggle to do things most people do easy and so I'm not successful and so lazy kids job stealing loser not even worth women's time of day. But hey I've seen it time and time again, people climb up and look down on their friends and family As being lessor.

I see someone brought a sickeningly depressing zombie to life. My god, why did I have to read this s**t.

I think he hates working full time. That's why he's begrudging anyone who doesn't. That's why everyone hates those on welfare or even disability (when they judge it is somehow illegitimate). 90% of "middle class" people hate their job. It's no wonder they hate anyone who they think isn't doing their "fair share" of the burden.

As if there is even a need for all this "work". You'll notice that labor-saving technology has increased exponentially, yet we work more now than we did in the 1950s. I don't have the energy to post the "labor participation" statistics, but it basically peaked in the late 1990s. Despite the supposed "recovery" both after the dot-com bust recession and the 2008 recession, the participation numbers haven't recovered. Maybe less work is needed, hooray! But wait... we must have the designated set of "losers" for everyone to shun. Never mind these people really aren't even f*****g needed in the economy anymore. It is by design that there is a pool of unemployed. Feminist "empowerment" pushed everyone to work harder, labor-saving technology advanced, and now we get a bigger pool of unemployed to show for it all. The employment game works a lot like musical chairs. The ones that don't get a chair are usually the ones who are disabled or otherwise don't neatly fit into the corporate work structure. We can't find a way to "share" the work and make it so everyone has an equal shot, you know, let people work as they can. We need people to shame. There is a dedicated group of "lazies" for this purpose. If you make a system so hopeless for people, is it any wonder they decide to throw their hands in the air and smoke weed in their bedroom all day? The alternative? Where are the f*****g jobs?

Don't worry, Retro will probably burn out in utter exhaustion and quit at a certain point. Then he'll be back to whining instead of looking down his nose.

Wait, what did RetroGamer do?

You guys have to understand that even though many unemployed people here are disabled (25%, statistically) and some are trying hard to look for work, some really are just lazy. It's a big problem in Australia and anyone who's lived here and experienced it will know exactly what I'm talking about.

Statistically there is some evidence of this, as our employment rate is about 6%.

And anecdotally, it is not uncommon to know more than few young Aussie men who are unemployed and spend their social security money on their fast cars and alcohol and cigarettes and such, and young women on alcohol, cigarettes and their young kid they had at a young age.

It's not as bad as it used to be though, the last 15 years has seen a big drop in unemployment.

Australia has a different welfare system where anyone post-high school age can get onto a decent payment fortnightly from Centrelink, our social security branch.

You don't need to have worked or have any experience before and you don't even need to actually graduate high school.

Any post-high school or high school dropout can quite easily get onto the Youth Allowance payment within a month or so after applying, so it IS quite easy for some to abuse the system and lie to Centrelink that they're looking for work if it means continued secure payment.

It is not easy to live off welfare payments, but it is enough to live stably and entirely possible to spend your entire life without working, though most do get jobs eventually, of course.

Of course, when tragic events such as a broken down car or other sudden expenses sneak-up on you, those on welfare without a back-up plan are at a high risk for falling into homelessness or poverty.

However, I agree with you marshall.

I am aware statistically we work more hours than ever, despite technology 'evolving' (and I use that term very loosely, I feel it's only been downhill since about 2010) and there's also studies that have found prehistoric humans of millenia ago that lived a hunter-gatherer lifestyle only had a 14 hour work week.

This is also true for existing tribes today that continue to live the hunter-gatherer way.

Modern hunter-gatherers also report much lower stress levels.

I definitely think the world and society should do away with or reduce corporate culture and the whole 'work to live, live to work' wage slavery concept.

Also, according to the Australian statistics, there's not enough actual jobs available anyway in the country compared to the number of unemployed.

What's amusing is the fact I see from a lot of Baby Boomers or Gen X's who originally claimed to have wanted a future where their kids and grandchildren get to work less hours and have more free-time complain that millenials today are so 'lazy' and 'entitled'.

Now wait a minute, Sly.

Even if the U.S. is in a 'recession' right now, our dollar is only worth 55 U.S. cents.

I'm not sure if this does mean RetroGamer's welfare payments is worth American middle-class, just pointing it out.

Anyway, I have no idea how the hell he could have manipulated the system to get that much a fortnight, because that's pretty high! The disability pension isn't even that high, and it's one of the higher payment types.

I'm on a payment that's like a halfway between disability and regular unemployed (think if you were injured from work and needed 6 months off according to the doctor, in Australia you'd be on my payment plan). It's the regular unemployed payment with a few 'supplements' on top, e.g. disability/medical supplement, etc.

I only total about 700-800 a month for a total of about 8,400-9,000 a year. Decent, but definitely not even lower-middle class.

Do you think the OP has found her dream rich boy?

Are you sure? They may have changed the system since I was that age.

When I was 16, you had to be 16 to claim payment but there was no rule saying you had to drop out of school to get it. I got the payment and continued in school for another two years.

You are right that some of the payees have a genuine need and some of them don't. I was on Youth Allowance (as it was known back then) for a few years, first as a student and then as a "jobseeker" while I made very little effort to find a job (like many others). I realize that many really do try to get a job and I realize that if they don't find work quickly, it's not their fault if jobs aren't available. When there are more workers than jobs, they have my sympathies. I dislike the right wing rhetoric that they're "refusing to work" when they're looking for work and there's no work available". I dislike the right whingers complaining when a city has a million workers and nine hundred thousand jobs, the right whingers expect all one million of them to fit into nine hundred thousands jobs. Or for very competative fields where only the top players can be successful, the right whingers expect 100% of them to fit into the top 50% by "trying harder" (which will only raise the average, raise the bar and mean people have to work harder merely to keep up with the average. It will not give everyone a competitive advantage and it will not fit more people into the top 50%).

After a few years I went onto the DSP, even though my status as "disabled" had more to do with what I believed I could do than my actual capabilities. I believed I could not work full time. I have now proven myself wrong. Living in a suburb specifically designed for welfare recipients, I knew many others who shouldn't have been on the DSP and many who truly needed to be on the DSP.

If it seems like I'm harsh to people on Centrelink, it's because of my own experience. I know people game the system because I used to do it. I know that sometimes people's incapability for work has more to do with negative attitude than actual capability because that was me. Like many others my symptoms were psychosomatic. I was under the false belief that asperger's makes it impossible for me to work (for various reasons, partly due to the dodgy medication they shouldn't have put me on, partly due to my awful experiences in 2003, etc).

So the reason I have a dim view of some Centrelink recipients is because I was like them and I have a dim view of myself. It took my a big shift in thinking to get used to the idea of working and now I'm trying to adjust my thinking to be able to work without regretting my past (focus on my work now, rather than have self-pity and regret for the prior years in which I wasn't working. Yes I made mistakes but being paralyzed by past regrets is also a mistake).True. I had a hard time getting on it myself. I was rejected the first few times. Now it's even harder. My mother had a very easy time getting it back in 1982.

In some ways I would have been better off not applying for the DSP. When I was having a hard time in high school, I gave my my ambitions of doing an bachelor of architecture and getting on the DSP became my new goal. Were it not for that I could have tried harder (though I may still have chosen the wrong subjects, I didn't understand the system). I wouldn't have graduated high school to become a NEET.

Once I got the DSP, it could still have been useful if I used the extra money to fund further education (it's considerably more money than Youth Allowance. Even if I wanted to study part time I could have, Youth Allowance - Student only pays to full time students).That's a good definition and certainly ambitious girls will like you better if you're ambitious (and vice versa).

I know a lot of unambitious people. I have friends who either become NEETs or come up with career plans that are totally ridiculous (some of them take dodgy correspondence courses from unaccredited universities, some try to become video game designers (for which there is zero work in Adelaide and little work in Sydney (so that only very qualified game designers find work, not ones with diplomas from scam schools) and some don't bother to do the assignments (I know a guy who fits all three of these criteria for failure).

I also know a lot of young people who are ambitious. I must work to fix the defects in my thinking so that when I meet an ambitious young person who just graduated with a STEM degree at age 22, I admire them for their achievement rather than resent them for being more successful, harder working and younger than me. This petty thinking is holding me back but old habits die hard.Sometimes I get the opposite problem. I've made great strides to improve my life in the last 3 years but I'm still not good enough for middle class girls. Perhaps I never will be. with a late start I can never catch up with those who started early.

It was chasing after middle class girls that made me depressed about being a NEET, made me despise myself for a year, made me very depressed and then convinced me to embark on a career. I suppose I should thank those snobbish girls for my success. It's a double edged sword because before I started chasing after those girls I didn't despise myself for being a NEET and I had a very happy and relaxed life a NEET. Now my life is hectic and stressful.

But girls really like it when they hear which company I work for and they like my luxury apartment on the top floor (but the rent for it is painful). My housekeeping skills have improved greatly since this place is so nice and actually want to keep it tidy. The unit I had before was dark and dingy so I didn't care when it got squalid.

I notice that poor people often have cluttered, untidy homes like I used to. I don't want to be like that. It looks bad. Girls don't like it.I need to work on that too. I've done much to improve the practical aspects of my life but I need to improve my ways of thinking.

I used to think "I can't do this, I can't do that". I stopped that and replaced it with a very unhealthy perfectionism. I need to dispense with that as well. I need to improve my thinking so I can work on improving myself without worrying about my imperfections.And well you should. My ex made zero effort in her life and that made her hard to live with. She came from a middle class family but she had lower class attitudes. She had no ambition not only in her work but also in her life.

She worked as a cleaning lady and had no desire to leave this. She complained about how much she hated it but when I suggested she try for a different job she changed her tune and said it was the best job for her.

She made no effort to improve her career and no effort in the non work related parts of her life. Even before I told her I wanted her to lose weight she already made a lot of negative comments about how fat she was yet she was. She said she hated being fat and yet she didn't make any effort at all to change it. She accepted it as her fate (even though she had zero body acceptance). She just accepted it as something that happened to her.

This is what bothers me about poor people. There way of thinking. They think in terms of stuff that happens to them. Whatever happens to them, good or bad, they accept it. What happens to them is often dependent on what other people do (employers, government, etc). If something bad happens to them like weight gain or poverty, the complain about it but they accept it. They make no effort to change it.

Wealthier people do not think in terms of things that happen to them. They think in terms of the things they do. If they're living in poverty, they do something to get out of poverty. If they're fat, they do something to get thinner. They don't view their wealth as being under the control of some Centrelink administrator. They control their level of wealth.

When ex started to get depressed. There were things she could have done to alleviate it. Yet she didn't. She was resigned to her fate. She didn't like it but she didn't try to change it.Yes I was.Yes because I despise the way I used to be. That's why I don't like seeing it in other people.

True I would have prefered if I had never been like that. I regret it a lot. But I cannot change the past. I must accept my despicable past, though I don't have to like it.It makes me feel horrible to when I think that I didn't become middle class younger, that I don't have a university degree, that I don't have any savings, that other people my age have all these things. That other people my age are richer than me. Other people had their first girlfriend younger than I did. Makes me hate myself. When I think of how many mistakes I made it makes my life seem pointless. Those mistakes can never be undone but I must move forward.

Also, tidy your room. It's something you can control. My girlfriends always complained when my apartment was untidy. You should keep your room tidy because one day soon you might meet a nice girl and she'll get turned off when she sees your room.Yes I hate my job which is why I like it. There's a masochistic element to it. I want to spend more time doing things that I hate so it will make me more tough. Anything I enjoy is bad for me and anything I hate doing is good for me. That's why I want to get overtime.

Also overtime means more money. Time and a half. $42 per hour on weekends. I can use that to pay off my credit cards.There's nothing fair about it. I know there's not enough work to go 'round. That's why I want to hoard all the work for myself, so I can claim credit for it.

I know that if we measure society not in terms of money but in terms of tasks that need to be done we could have 50% of adults unemployed and still be able to deliver essential services. Our economy is not based on practicality so I have to learn to thrive in the system we have, not the system we need.Of course. So I can get more overtime pay.So long as I stay out of this group the girls will like me.I know that but my main concern is impressing girls.How did feminist empowerment push everyone to work harder?Ironic that less work to do actually means we have to work harder to stay employed. I cannot change the system so instead I must learn how to thrive in it.I don't want to share my work, I want to hoard it. I want to get as many hours as I can.If it helps me get girls, why not? If it elevates me above other men, the girls will like me.The tragedy of our times. If you work your butt off or if you're lazy, either way you'll be accused of laziness so why work?

With automation we could have had a post-scarcity society. With corporations unwilling to pay anyone other than employees, shareholders and politicians that means we will never live in a post-scarcity world. Our technology may become advanced enough but our society will never be advanced enough. The powers that be will always ret*d society to prevent that from happening. The powers that be will do whatever it takes to hold onto their power. As George Orwell said — If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

I cannot change this future so instead I must learn to thrive in it. If my success must come from climbing on the backs of others, so be it. I know I got my job more out of sheer luck than skill. I don't look down my nose at the unlucky people. It's not their fault. Yet I also have no desire to join them. As our society becomes more automated the number of available jobs will shrink. Girls like employed guys so the number of guys they view as acceptable will decrease. That will mean girls competing over an ever shrinking pool of employed guys, of which I am a member.

The corporations will never relinquish their power so I say — If you can't beat them, join them.

It's much better to depend on yourself than it is to depend on others.

However, it's wrong to criticize those who depend on others.....as long as they are not harming anybody in the process.

If I were in the Australian system, I would have left home at age 18.

And have no time or energy for hobbies or things that could enrich your life. You like a meaningless sedentary life where you spend 8-12 hours a day sitting hunched over at a computer and another hour or more commuting to and from work. How do you have the time or energy to work out after work and cook a healthy dinner for yourself? You'll just get weaker if you don't have time to take care of your body. I don't see the point in working more than 30 hours a week. Every time in my life I tried working 40 hours I was miserable and suicidal. I want to have time to work out. I have control over my body when I work out. I can decide on my own lifting routines. I can set my progress goals. Work is just something forced upon me. You have no power when you're working for someone else. You do what they say. If they don't want to give you breaks to stretch every hour or so, they don't have to. You can sit at the computer 4 hours straight until your back hurts from lack of activity. I think better when I can move around.


Well, when I worked full time I had more money coming in than I could spend. The only lavish thing I ever did was eat out alone at nicer restaurants more often than most people because I got tired of cooking every night (of course I had to deal with feeling self-conscious eating alone in a restaurant, but f**k it was better than some fast-food crap). I was nowhere near paycheck-to-paycheck in my spending. If only I could spend it to have more free time and not be so exhausted all the time. There was no s**t I could buy that would make life tolerable. I'm not as easily entertained by mindless garbage as most people. I ended up saving quite a bit, but then when I went on disability I wasn't allowed to have any "assets" so I had to give it all to my parents. I had to sell my car to my parents. What's the point in even saving if I just lose it all whenever I burn out?


Of course, you're contributing to the problem. Some poor unemployed lazy oaf could use those hours. Some of us know how to code well, or whatever you're doing now.

Anyways, I know I can't change the system. If it were up to me I wouldn't have government put the unemployed on the dole to be shamed. I'd have the government "make" part time work for them, or give them access to training/internships. There always things to be done. The only barrier is the lack of an instant profit incentive. Of course it's cheaper to just put people on the dole than to create real work for them. Other people claim making people do volunteer work in return for their "dole" is like a nanny state babying. I say it is better than loading shame. It's certainly better than the US system where a lot of them end up in jail (expensive BTW) because they have nowhere else to go. f**k the violent gang-bangers, but I have no problem with corner weed sellers. What else is there when there aren't enough jobs to go around? In America we just arrest them and throw them in jail with all the violent thugs and gangsters where the only way to survive is to become one yourself. People profit off it to boot.

You seem to see women as trophies to improve your "social status" and nothing more. If I was female I wouldn't want to date you.
It taught that women must work just as long hours as their husband. Otherwise they feel inferior. Striving for social status became a competition. Women were and still are forced to work more and more hours in order to combat the "gender wage gap". Women who work less than their husband are shamed almost as much as men who make less than their wife. Given the same amount of jobs, more people wanting to work creates higher unemployment. Higher unemployment strikes fear into the working class, making them work harder because they are afraid to stand up to their boss when they believe they might not find another job easily if they lose the one they currently have.


Nothing new to respond to. Yea, I wouldn't want to date you.

Yea. Whatever. I'm not interested in changing the system. I just want to find a niche where I can be semi-productive, yet not burned out. That is hard to find. There is no balance in the corporate world. I just have to keep looking. It's put off for now since I'm temporarily moving to a foreign country where I'm not even allowed to work other than teaching/tutoring English as a second language. Have to see how that goes.

Last edited by marshall on 03 Sep 2016, 3:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.