Look out! It's a Nice Guy! DESTROY HIM!!

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Can you quote, please, where is it said that it deserves a reward?

You know, I didn't know any of this. I thought dating was synonymous with being in a relationship and was the same thing. This is all very interesting. I think there is so much misinformation about what relationships are, what one is to expect in each one, exactly what niceness means, and how a guy is supposed to court a lady and vice versa. The problem I see is pragmatics and I don't think it is just aspies that have this issue. I think a lot of NTs do as well.

I think part of the issue stems from Hollywood and a fantastical representation of how people truthfully are. Another part of it stems from not being provided guidance on how to court when younger, how to establish boundaries and how to respect boundaries. In today's world certain things are assumed to be common sense and common knowledge. In the past, social skills like courting were rotely taught. When nice guys are told to be nice guys they're interpreting it wrong. They're only satisfying one necessary part which is really just being a civilized human being. That is it, nothing more. Nice guys TM need to accept that they're interpreting things wrong and have a skewed view of what nice is and feminists need to accept that they're wrong on the sense of entitlement bit concerning nice guys TM. Nice guys TM don't feel entitled. They feel they did earn it. Therein lies the heart of the issue. The nice guys TM have a warped view over what a relationship is, dating is, what one is supposed to do to earn, and what nice truthfully is.

This is my two cents.

Well, this is my analysis on this

Exactly, this is what my wife and I are doing right now.

Differences in culture might confound here. Nonetheless, I tend to see a MARKEDLY smaller amount of men harping on and on about "Nice but unattractive women". However, it could be that they're just less inclined to speak about it openly.

Quote, please?



It is not. I gave up. I'm just stating the fact. Why do you have such a problem with me doing so?



Yeap. I did. I already have said it. Did you really read what I write?



Good point. Let's apply it to women that are with men that abuse them.



Quote, please? (again)



Avoiding? What makes you believe that I could even be interested in you or your female friend so you need to avoid me?



I think you're confusing nice with stupid.



You're with your friends because you get something from them: having fun, a common interest, learning, good conversations, good sex, or whatever. Of course, you can deny it. I doesn't change it.



I don't blame women. Do I? Can you quote me, please? I just state that many women nowadays (I would say most of them, but that would be wrong, since my population sample are single women, so let's say most of women that are single) are basically selfish, careless and unempathic. I'm not blaming them since this is not a crime. Being selfish, careless and unempathic is nothing to be blamed about. BUT even though, I have the right to express this. What it's not the same as blaming.



Sorry???? You said that I was blaming. I asked you to quote me. Simple. Where's the problem?



(1) Where am I giving here my opinion about forced Afghanistan marriage being good or bad? Can you quote where I do so? Because in what you quoted I'm NOT giving any opinion about it.
(2) It was not me who brought the subject of forced marriage. I was answering to another post which brought it. So it's not me who is bringing something that is not part of the topic.



You're stating that those people are not even worthy of having a relationship with another person. I repete: not being worthy of having a relationship. Being under the level of what is required for a human being to be worthy of a relationship.

It's not me who stated this opinion, but you. I just put it in less polite worlds. I'm sorry if you don't like your own statements when they're expressed in a clearer way.



I want to state a few facts:

(1) I'm able to use humour in the middle of an argument. You are not.

(2) I didn't make any personal attack against you. You did.

(3) I didn't make up any statement and said that you said it. You did.

(4) However, it's you who accuses me of being violent and prejudiced. Ok



WHAT??????



I don't think so. I like to use those expressions, since I use to be very specific about somethink being an opinion, or an experience, or a fact. And I like to make it clear. Indeed, I'm quite a bit jaded of people who never use it because everything that they say is a revealed truth. They don't think. They don't say. They [drum roll here] .... [more drum roll].... they speak THE truth.



Sorry. I never did otherwise.



Definition doesn't involve that something has to be achieved. It just states that you're worthy of.

For example: you apply for a job. You have a better CV and are more skilled. The other person has connections. Who deserves the job? you. Who gets it? him or her. Deserving is about being worthy of, not about achieving.



I don't get what you say here. Mars? the planet???



Yeap. It's quite harsh. But it's not me who said it. I just made the logical deduction from your words.



Deserving is not related with being able to achieve or influence. It's just about being worthy of it.

I'm gonna explain with an example:

Imagine that you were sterile and I say to you 'you don't deserve to have a son'... how woud you feel?.

Nothing can be changed, it's not about fairness or unfairness, it's just medical stuff. And let's suppose that you're a good mother, but there's no way you can have a biological son.

And the men saying 'you don't deserve to have a son'. Really, how would you feel when you hear it?

Well, this is exactly what you're doing here.



Again. It's not about earning. It's about being worthy of.

I'm not referring to a specific post in this thread. it's just that in my experience, the context in which a person would describe themselves as a "nice guy" often has a subtext of deserving a reward. It goes like this: "I'm a nice guy, so when do I get my lucky break?"

The funny thing is, I actually do agree that being a good person deserves a reward. I'm just saying that being a Nice Guy often doesn't involve being a good person, just an inoffensive person.

The truth is, modern society is built in such a way that it's actually quite rare to find yourself in a situation requiring moral courage. The difference between a "Cocky Jerk" and a "Nice Guy" is something like whether or not they would cut into a queue. But which one of the two would save someone's life in a dangerous situation? It's hard to say.

Yeap, of course, there's a difference between being good, and nice, and politically correct. I'm gonna put an example: I'm not only have been called mysoginist, like here, but racist too. Because I'm not bloody politically correct.

However, when a friend of me, immigrant, a very worthy person, was almost expelled of the country because of a bureaucratic problem, it was me who offered her a marriage of convenience so she could get the papers and stay. But I'm a bloody racist. And violent. And a mysoginist. And even worse: not cute. Of course.

That so? How come it's not more common, then? I don't think it's as easy as you make it out to be.



Yea, good luck with that.

A girl is showing great interest in me lately , when I asked her why she's liking me she was like "because you're a nice person".

Then she told me I wasn't nice to her at times, made her nervous and mad few times and almost made her cry before (I threatened her to cut contact with her over what appeared an unacceptable behavior she did - it was a misunderstanding tho), so go figure.

Well obviously how common it is depends on how you define it. I'm pretty sure that 99% of males everywhere see themselves as "nice guys". And if you challenge them on it, I suspect that the vast majority of them will tell you that they are "nice guys" because of some level of basic human empathy or courtesy that they have, at least in certain contexts. It's like the Chris Rock routine about African-American fathers who want credit for doing something they're just supposed to do. "I take care of my kids!"

If you think about the word "nice", it could mean just about anything. I mean, it basically just means "pleasant". It's more about surface than substance. But people sometimes use it as a substitute for "good", as in "a good person". To me, there is a world of difference between the two things.

I mean, Tony Soprano described himself as a "nice guy". And he was! In certain contexts, at least. Didn't make any difference to the people he killed.

You are not the only one who doesn't really know or realise.
I actually know a fair few people who do not know or realise, and they generally get taken advantage of, cheated on, or otherwise at least feel that they have been, even if that technically wasn't the case. At best they place themselves in an unequal position to the other, which often creates an imbalance and makes them feel insecure in that position or situation.

People will take advantage of ignorance or naivety more than usual especially in dating and relationships, no matter what sex or gender you are.



Re: bolded part (Off topic but interesting)

There was actually a study on extreme altruism and what makes people heroes. They found that such people had very similar traits to psychopaths in many respects except for about 3 major ones. The traits in common plus extra ones would lead to why someone may break the law in order to save someone else's life. Extreme empathy was one of the key differences, whereas a disregard for the law and official rules and lack of impulse control was something they had in common with psychopaths.

http://www.science20.com/rogue_neuron/a ... oism-60137

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/lit ... e-altrusim

^



Mystery is solved if one thinks evolution.

btw, I don't see a source to a study in that article, kjas.

It was there originally when I first read it years ago but I think the link is broken now.
But for those interested this book does contain some information from them in it: http://global.oup.com/academic/product/ ... u&lang=en&

That's BS. You pick a very specific element that is common in psychopaths and any other social group and... TACHAN!! !! Look what I discovered.

We can make more studies like this:

- Altruistic people have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both use to break rules.
- Autist people have similar traits to psychopaths => Beacause both have low empathy.
- Smart people have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both use to be successful in their professional life.
- Alfa males have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both have high levels of testosterone.
- Borderline people have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both use to be manipulative.
- Drug addicts have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both have poor behavioural control.
- Civil servants have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both have no creative talent.
- Women have similar traits to psychopaths => Because both have migraines.
- Small kids have similar traits to psychopaths => Because.... well, because everything.

Simplistic, but he makes a good point, Kjas.

Psychopaths are human beings too, not aliens, so it wouldn't be OH MY GOSH THIS IS SO SURPRISING if they have things in common with other groups of humans.