Serious issues with L&D Forum

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Flattery is nice thank you, but I like actions over words.

I think simple solutions can often be the best. Report the thread for being a reoccurring rant, isnt there a rule like that for PPR? Also to add, I think L&D, and actually the whole site is much better now than it was when I joined, but I think the slow but steady progress was achieved because the goal of having a functioning online community was something everyone was on board with. Love and dating are by their nature emotive topics, and as such are not always rational, I think thats quite normal.

I've observed that women are offended by guys complaining that women will only date guys with money. It isn't quite as simple as that, but there is a grain of truth to it. I believe men experience greater stigma for being employment challenged than women. There is a stigma on people who are on disability or only work part time, and this stigma does fall disproportionately harder on men. Maybe it's not as bad now as it was in the 50s, but it still exists to some degree and I think men on this forum experience it. It isn't because women as a group are more prejudiced than men. It has little to do with anything women consciously decide as a group. It's simply due to the influence of traditional gender roles, the same ones that feminists claim are sexist. It isn't something deliberately imposed by either women or men, but both sexes are influenced by culture.

With that said, I suppose it is sexist to say "women only want money", or "women are materialistic". I don't think this is true at all. I think it comes up when the lonely guys complain because they are experiencing something. They are experiencing the effects of gender roles. Maybe men on here should be more conscious in trying to avoid phrases like the ones above that most of us would agree are offensive.

It is another thing though to just outright deny the reality of what men experience, that they are disproportionately rejected for being on disability or working only part time. To just outright dismiss this because the idea that it even exists is somehow sexist or offensive to women in turn offends men by silencing their ability to express certain frustrations. The knee-jerk denial and instant dismissal of their complaints invalidates their experience completely. This I think is a large source of hostility.

I get that it appears guys are singling out women as a group when they complain about their experiences, but I think the reality is this... guys say "women" a lot because they are heterosexual and thus aren't attempting to date men. If they did date men, you would probably see a lot more complaints directed at "men". In other words, I don't think the singling out of "women" as a group is really intentional. I suppose guys should be encouraged to substitute "people" for "women" when they talk about negative dating experiences. Maybe that would help. I just don't think prohibiting men from ever complaining about experiences is helpful as they will just feel as though they are being told their feelings don't matter and they should just shut up. I think it has to be a two way street for there to be understanding on both sides. I don't think telling people who vent to shut up helps anything. It increases hostility.

I really tried hard to word everything as carefully as possible so nobody jumps down my thought. I don't know if it is avoidable though. I'm trying my best.

Last edited by marshall on 08 May 2016, 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ok wise duck, I have a better idea:
You do it, make a thread based on that list, it is not copy righted and you have... less haters.

And your english is better and you are far more diplomatic.

Go! Fly duck to the mission!

(btw I noticed that users here either like a lot me or hate me a lot... but that's off topic).

Nope. Really, no. Just....no.

Retro, my views about this are the same regardless of gender/preference/disability/lack of disability, etc.

Did you even read the rest of what I said? I don't appreciate you quoting a single sentence with no context whatsoever.

Yup.



The context is right there on this page for anyone who cares to read it. It doesn't change the fact that what you said is incorrect.

If we're going to play this silly game, I'd say it's mathematically improbable that not even one woman in billions (bearing in mind he said "Some women" not all) don't trigger in the way he described.

(edited a plural to singular)

Why don't you be a rational adult and actually elaborate on what you find objectionable rather than taking quaint passive-aggressive swipes that contribute absolutely nothing. I can't say I didn't predict this kind of BS.

dismissive and insulting



We're discussing the population of WP, not the population of the world. I don't know of a single woman on WP who finds expressing a reality sexist. Can anyone provide an example?

I disagree that any women on WP find expressing reality sexist.



insulting and contributes nothing

The sneering nature of many posts on L & D for a long time have done so much to contaminate this subforum as a whole. I can't be bothered with it.

This may come as a shock, but people are free to dismiss and value your opinion less than you do in a public debate or in a discussion forum.

As for the second point, even if you move the goalposts to fit your comments there are 10's of thousands of WP registrations. None of us will be able to attest for all of one group here, not even the founder or existing moderators.

Come on, let's not do this, please.
Let's be sensible and leave this thread for what it was intended. Please don't contribute to the "people trying to win arguments in empty rooms" bit I wrote just a little while earlier. Sometimes it's nice to be proven wrong and be optimistic about things.

I have seen examples but I'm not going to dig them up.


I spent a lot of time writing what I wrote. You put minimal effort in responding. That is insulting.

I don't even understand why you wrote that. Obviously people have disagreements of opinion, why should that be shocking to me? It doesn't mean they need be insulting, and when they are I'm free to say so.



Surely then someone can give me an example of a post expressing reality to which a woman objected.

Alex, you opened this thread in good faith. It has been hijacked by point scoring and personal attacks. Time to lock it perhaps. Maybe this subforum as a whole could be suspended for a while, if that is possible, so that habitual posters who seem to compete for dominance over anyone who disagrees with them can reflect on the bigger picture during a time out and what they can personally modify to make it an agreeable place (if that is even possible).

PS: this post is not in response to any one post or poster.