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Janissy
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18 Jun 2010, 3:28 pm

Creature wrote:
[His social skills don't matter, I'm purely talking about his intentions and plans. They are just wrong. That they are common doesn't make them right, and they can still hurt women.]


Social skills do matter. If he really is a naive virgin with a social phobia, that makes Ancalagon's take just as likely and maybe more likely than billsmithglendale's. A naive virgin with a social phobia is definately the demographic to delude himself into thinking he has fallen in love with a pretty girl on the internet on the basis of a few conversations. You have concluded that his "I love you" and "you're pretty enough to be a model" are lies but how do you know they are? Granted, I also don't think it's possible to literally be in love after that short a communication. But a hormone-addled virgin could easily mistake a crush for love (or a hormone addled experienced person, for that matter). Your entire tirade is based on the presumption that he didn't mean these things because he wants sex- as though a desire for sex and having a crush were mutually exclusive. Read Alcagon's post again. It's a very plausible take on this.

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The guy I mentioned is an example, but yet I dislike him having these intentions. I don't like him doing this, just as I don't like my former bullies to be all happy and never having to experience any form of retribution for what they've done to me and other people. It isn't fair.


For heaven's sake, give him a break. There is nothing pathological or immoral about being a horny virgin. It's possible to have a crush on somebody (which to a horny virgin will feel like love) and want sex. Welcome to the adult world. Men aren't evil, immoral scumbags who need to be punished for having hormonal urges. Given where you found him, I highly doubt he's the player billsmithglendale makes him out to be. In any case, horniness is not evil and there is nothing he has done which would merit retribution.

Just for the record- because it isn't clear from either my username or my post- I'm a woman. So it's not like I'm posting this out of an ignorance of women's sexual status and vulnerabilities. I know them all too well. But this poor guy...I just don't see how he has done anything tyo warrant such a reaction.



Daemonic-Jackal
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18 Jun 2010, 4:07 pm

Creature wrote:
Please don't judge me too easily.....

Here is the problem. It's about justice.

I've met a person using a forum for people with some kind of handicap or difficulty, varying from physical handicaps to shyness, and we decided to meet eachother.This guy is now 22 years old and due to social phobia and past depression still a virgin, but yet he's very eager to have sex. I thought we'd meet as friends, but he started to act as if he was in love with me, continuing to do that over MSN after the meeting.

I have been in love once, for a couple of days, and therefore I know how you act in such a state and as people have fallen in love with me earlier (don't ask me why) I know how you look and act if you are. This guy was lying, no doubt about it. He even told me over MSN when he was drunk how much he wanted to get laid. Fine. He also gave compliments that were obvious lies, he probably thinks every girl wants to be model so he told me I'm so pretty that I should become a model. Give me a break.

This whole situation makes me angry because he wanted me to believe him and lose my virginity to him. My body is nothing but a mass of flesh and virginity is worth nothing, I think, but there are millions of girls out there who DO care, who DO add value to their virginity. He knows that and therefore it's quite a severe moral crime. A moral crime he committed to me. I do not want to tolerate this. Autistic = naive it seems, otherwise there wouldn't be that much 40-year-old creeps who try the same because they want to f*ck an 18-year-old. Yes, I've met several of them through forums, all blocked on my MSN list. Approaching little innocent girls.

It's nothing but a pathetic and pretty disgusting attempt of taking advantage of someone's weaknesses/disorder.

Furthermore, he could say the same stuff to another, more naive girl, and she would lose her virginity to a lying bastard who doesn't give a sh*t about her except for what's between her legs.

That's a moral crime and it diserves punishment. There are WAY too many moral crimes being committed, and I have a hard time allowing this moral crime to happen as the SO MANIEST without any form of retribution. Billions of moral crimes take place, just look at the amount of bullies.

I wish I could get back at him in some way......

Even though my (and other's) bullies will remain unpunished, how can I still let this happen? Justice in one case in a million is better than no justice at all. It would make the world an extremely, unimaginably small bit less unjust. It's perhaps nothing but a priciple.

Is there any way I can get equity for this? I have a hard time just letting this happen. I want to see justice, even more because he might now be trying to ruin the ''first time'' for another girl.


If anything it sounds as if your the monster who has serious issues here having turned this into a personal vendetta when you have no solid evidence to support anything you are saying.

Also you claimed to have been in love but only for a couple of days. How are you possibly in a position to pass judgement on anyone when you clearly don't know what love is yourself.


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18 Jun 2010, 4:57 pm

I agree with the posters who see it as mostly a non-issue. His behavior may be creepy and crappy, but the guy is young and, well, people make mistakes. Tell him what you think of his behavior, no if's and's or but's, and step away. You have a duty to protect yourself but absent any solid evidence that he is about to commit rape, statutory rape, murder, assault or another crime on the law books, his unsavory behavior to the next person is none of your business.

If that out-of-tune/offensive flirting was illegal I can't even count how many guy's lives I could have ruined ... and, you know, most of them ended up maturing into decent people after all, so I'm rather glad I never did anything beyond rejecting them.


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18 Jun 2010, 5:01 pm

Creature wrote:
Replying is useless... apparently you can't get that even though something isn't a legal crime, it still can be a moral one. That's why I spammed the word 'moral'. If it'd be a legal crime too I could leave that word out as it'd save me some typing.

The fact that I knew what he was trying doesn't make it better either. The crime ITSELF doesn't change.


The world tells us to watch out for ourselves when it comes to the concept of moral crimes. That is basically what the posters are telling you. It isn't your business what moral crimes a person commits as long as they aren't against you, and to the extent they are against you, the law does not allow remedy. You do your best to protect yourself but there is no other official buffer. So deal with your own feelings as you need to and move on.


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18 Jun 2010, 5:13 pm

Daemonic-Jackal wrote:
Creature wrote:
Please don't judge me too easily.....

Here is the problem. It's about justice.

I've met a person using a forum for people with some kind of handicap or difficulty, varying from physical handicaps to shyness, and we decided to meet eachother.This guy is now 22 years old and due to social phobia and past depression still a virgin, but yet he's very eager to have sex. I thought we'd meet as friends, but he started to act as if he was in love with me, continuing to do that over MSN after the meeting.

I have been in love once, for a couple of days, and therefore I know how you act in such a state and as people have fallen in love with me earlier (don't ask me why) I know how you look and act if you are. This guy was lying, no doubt about it. He even told me over MSN when he was drunk how much he wanted to get laid. Fine. He also gave compliments that were obvious lies, he probably thinks every girl wants to be model so he told me I'm so pretty that I should become a model. Give me a break.

This whole situation makes me angry because he wanted me to believe him and lose my virginity to him. My body is nothing but a mass of flesh and virginity is worth nothing, I think, but there are millions of girls out there who DO care, who DO add value to their virginity. He knows that and therefore it's quite a severe moral crime. A moral crime he committed to me. I do not want to tolerate this. Autistic = naive it seems, otherwise there wouldn't be that much 40-year-old creeps who try the same because they want to f*ck an 18-year-old. Yes, I've met several of them through forums, all blocked on my MSN list. Approaching little innocent girls.

It's nothing but a pathetic and pretty disgusting attempt of taking advantage of someone's weaknesses/disorder.

Furthermore, he could say the same stuff to another, more naive girl, and she would lose her virginity to a lying bastard who doesn't give a sh*t about her except for what's between her legs.

That's a moral crime and it diserves punishment. There are WAY too many moral crimes being committed, and I have a hard time allowing this moral crime to happen as the SO MANIEST without any form of retribution. Billions of moral crimes take place, just look at the amount of bullies.

I wish I could get back at him in some way......

Even though my (and other's) bullies will remain unpunished, how can I still let this happen? Justice in one case in a million is better than no justice at all. It would make the world an extremely, unimaginably small bit less unjust. It's perhaps nothing but a priciple.

Is there any way I can get equity for this? I have a hard time just letting this happen. I want to see justice, even more because he might now be trying to ruin the ''first time'' for another girl.


If anything it sounds as if your the monster who has serious issues here having turned this into a personal vendetta when you have no solid evidence to support anything you are saying.

Also you claimed to have been in love but only for a couple of days. How are you possibly in a position to pass judgement on anyone when you clearly don't know what love is yourself.


Because it was obvious. When on MSN he told me he was going to watch a film because he had to and that he felt awful about it while he was still on the computer when ''away'', but then playing World of Warcraft. He even introduced me to it as he wanted the reward, so later on I knew when he was online, and indeed, after I started to play too he never watched a film with his family members again. The reason he introduced me to that game was because he wanted a certain reward you get for making people to play and thereby spend money on the developers. It's an ingame advantage.

He even told me when drunk how desperate he was to have sex. That's quite an indication. He also behaved like a bad soap actor. I found out about numerous times when he claimed he was eager to come on MSN but that he couldn't that he was lying. Apparently I was/am too boring.


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18 Jun 2010, 5:20 pm

[quote="Janissy']



For heaven's sake, give him a break. There is nothing pathological or immoral about being a horny virgin. It's possible to have a crush on somebody (which to a horny virgin will feel like love) and want sex. Welcome to the adult world. Men aren't evil, immoral scumbags who need to be punished for having hormonal urges. Given where you found him, I highly doubt he's the player billsmithglendale makes him out to be. In any case, horniness is not evil and there is nothing he has done which would merit retribution.
[/quote]


I never said they are evil, immoral scumbags or that they need to be punished for hormonal urges. It's what they do with them.


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18 Jun 2010, 5:25 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
Creature wrote:
Replying is useless... apparently you can't get that even though something isn't a legal crime, it still can be a moral one. That's why I spammed the word 'moral'. If it'd be a legal crime too I could leave that word out as it'd save me some typing.

The fact that I knew what he was trying doesn't make it better either. The crime ITSELF doesn't change.


The world tells us to watch out for ourselves when it comes to the concept of moral crimes. That is basically what the posters are telling you. It isn't your business what moral crimes a person commits as long as they aren't against you, and to the extent they are against you, the law does not allow remedy. You do your best to protect yourself but there is no other official buffer. So deal with your own feelings as you need to and move on.


Indeed, moving on seems the only possible thing to do. The moral crime was still against me though; I simply didn't suffer from any consequences. But I do think it's unfair, the inexistane of some form of karma.


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18 Jun 2010, 5:53 pm

OP, how many people have to tell you that your perception of this situation is inappropriate before you're willing to accept that it may be based on inappropriate expectations and inaccurate conclusions? It seems as though you've resolved to abandon your plans for retribution against this kid, which is good. But you've shown absolute inflexibility in your evaluation of this situation. That kind of inflexibility will prevent you from incorporating new knowledge into your understanding of the world and people - and it will hinder your maturity into adulthood. I really encourage you to think about that.


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Daemonic-Jackal
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19 Jun 2010, 12:44 pm

Creature wrote:

Because it was obvious. When on MSN he told me he was going to watch a film because he had to and that he felt awful about it while he was still on the computer when ''away'', but then playing World of Warcraft. He even introduced me to it as he wanted the reward, so later on I knew when he was online, and indeed, after I started to play too he never watched a film with his family members again. The reason he introduced me to that game was because he wanted a certain reward you get for making people to play and thereby spend money on the developers. It's an ingame advantage.

He even told me when drunk how desperate he was to have sex. That's quite an indication. He also behaved like a bad soap actor. I found out about numerous times when he claimed he was eager to come on MSN but that he couldn't that he was lying. Apparently I was/am too boring.


Because it was obvious..........yeah because you can really tell when something is that clear over the internet (that's sarcasm by the way incase you dont get it)

Maybe regarding the film and world of warcraft, he changed his mind. As for wanting you to join it so he could get an ingame advantage whilst playing it online.......where is the crime in that? If a friend of yours asked for the same favour would you instantly assume they were just after a quick sh*g? Probably not. People get horny whilst drunk, that's human nature as the brakes come off for a lot of people under the influence of alcohol. I'm sorry but your 'evidence' is is nothing but trivial and you are clearly just twisting everything to fit your hasty and unjustified assumption. Did you ask him out right whether he was only after 'one thing' or not? Oh wait you didn't and even if you had you still wouldn't have believed him anyway as your conclusion of his character was already made up well in advance.

Go see a doctor or a therapist, you clearly have unresolved issues that need addressing.


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Creature
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19 Jun 2010, 5:27 pm

Daemonic-Jackal wrote:
Creature wrote:

Because it was obvious. When on MSN he told me he was going to watch a film because he had to and that he felt awful about it while he was still on the computer when ''away'', but then playing World of Warcraft. He even introduced me to it as he wanted the reward, so later on I knew when he was online, and indeed, after I started to play too he never watched a film with his family members again. The reason he introduced me to that game was because he wanted a certain reward you get for making people to play and thereby spend money on the developers. It's an ingame advantage.

He even told me when drunk how desperate he was to have sex. That's quite an indication. He also behaved like a bad soap actor. I found out about numerous times when he claimed he was eager to come on MSN but that he couldn't that he was lying. Apparently I was/am too boring.


Because it was obvious..........yeah because you can really tell when something is that clear over the internet (that's sarcasm by the way incase you dont get it)

Maybe regarding the film and world of warcraft, he changed his mind. As for wanting you to join it so he could get an ingame advantage whilst playing it online.......where is the crime in that? If a friend of yours asked for the same favour would you instantly assume they were just after a quick sh*g? Probably not. People get horny whilst drunk, that's human nature as the brakes come off for a lot of people under the influence of alcohol. I'm sorry but your 'evidence' is is nothing but trivial and you are clearly just twisting everything to fit your hasty and unjustified assumption. Did you ask him out right whether he was only after 'one thing' or not? Oh wait you didn't and even if you had you still wouldn't have believed him anyway as your conclusion of his character was already made up well in advance.

Go see a doctor or a therapist, you clearly have unresolved issues that need addressing.


Can't you read? I've met him in person.

By the way, he asked me first on MSN what my age was. Fine. 17. Immediately he asked me when I turned 18. He started to talk to me a lot more after my birthday.


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19 Jun 2010, 5:33 pm

HopeGrows wrote:
OP, how many people have to tell you that your perception of this situation is inappropriate before you're willing to accept that it may be based on inappropriate expectations and inaccurate conclusions? It seems as though you've resolved to abandon your plans for retribution against this kid, which is good. But you've shown absolute inflexibility in your evaluation of this situation. That kind of inflexibility will prevent you from incorporating new knowledge into your understanding of the world and people - and it will hinder your maturity into adulthood. I really encourage you to think about that.


I simply cannot find this alright behavior. This isn't alright, I spent some time explaining why. Because virginity etc matters to a lot of people. It matters much. I also fail to understand how you can find the behavior acceptable or appropraite just because it's common, or because I don't care that much. I'm a rare exception in this and my perception regarding sex doesn't matter when evaluating the morality of his actions.

How can one see this as acceptable behavior? Please explain this.


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Janissy
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19 Jun 2010, 5:57 pm

Creature wrote:
HopeGrows wrote:
OP, how many people have to tell you that your perception of this situation is inappropriate before you're willing to accept that it may be based on inappropriate expectations and inaccurate conclusions? It seems as though you've resolved to abandon your plans for retribution against this kid, which is good. But you've shown absolute inflexibility in your evaluation of this situation. That kind of inflexibility will prevent you from incorporating new knowledge into your understanding of the world and people - and it will hinder your maturity into adulthood. I really encourage you to think about that.


I simply cannot find this alright behavior. This isn't alright, I spent some time explaining why. Because virginity etc matters to a lot of people. It matters much. I also fail to understand how you can find the behavior acceptable or appropraite just because it's common, or because I don't care that much. I'm a rare exception in this and my perception regarding sex doesn't matter when evaluating the morality of his actions.

How can one see this as acceptable behavior? Please explain this.


Let's examine what you say he did:

Said he was in love with you: acceptable

Said you were pretty enough to be a model: acceptable

Drunkenly said he wanted to get laid because he was a virgin: in this particular context- inadvisable and unlikely to work but still on the border of acceptable.

You seem to think that a smitten man's attempts to seduce the woman he's fallen for are immoral. I don't agree with that. If you think a man should never attempt to say anything that might be taken as a sexual invitation to a woman he thinks he's dating, you are in for a whole lot of moral outrage. Most of the planet thinks that this is acceptable. The exception is Saudi Arabia. I suggest you move there.

Let's examine what he did not do; force himself on you.

And yet, you are acting as though he did, as though his mere yearning for sex somehow equated to moral? mental? rape. I've been in the trenches with some hardcore feminists (I'm middle aged) and only come across one who shared this view. And she never would have said "yes" to a meeting with a man so it was a moot point anyway.



Last edited by Janissy on 19 Jun 2010, 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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19 Jun 2010, 6:05 pm

Janissy wrote:
Creature wrote:
HopeGrows wrote:
OP, how many people have to tell you that your perception of this situation is inappropriate before you're willing to accept that it may be based on inappropriate expectations and inaccurate conclusions? It seems as though you've resolved to abandon your plans for retribution against this kid, which is good. But you've shown absolute inflexibility in your evaluation of this situation. That kind of inflexibility will prevent you from incorporating new knowledge into your understanding of the world and people - and it will hinder your maturity into adulthood. I really encourage you to think about that.


I simply cannot find this alright behavior. This isn't alright, I spent some time explaining why. Because virginity etc matters to a lot of people. It matters much. I also fail to understand how you can find the behavior acceptable or appropraite just because it's common, or because I don't care that much. I'm a rare exception in this and my perception regarding sex doesn't matter when evaluating the morality of his actions.

How can one see this as acceptable behavior? Please explain this.


Let's examine what you say he did:

Said he was in love with you: acceptable

Said you were pretty enough to be a model: acceptable

Drunkenly said he wanted to get laid because he was a virgin: in this particular context- inadvisable and unlikely to work but still on the border of acceptable.

You seem to think that a smitten man's attempts to seduce the woman he's fallen for are immoral. I don't agree with that. If you think a man should never attempt to say anything that might be taken as a sexual invitation to a woman he thinks he's dating, you are in for a whole lot of moral outrage. Most of the planet thinks that this is acceptable. The exception is Saudi Arabia. I suggest you move there.


Sigh. THis is completely out of context. I advice you to read the first post.

There's nothing wrong with attempting to get sex, what I do find wrong is lying about it to get it, thereby hurting someone.


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Janissy
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19 Jun 2010, 6:13 pm

Creature wrote:
Janissy wrote:
Creature wrote:
HopeGrows wrote:
OP, how many people have to tell you that your perception of this situation is inappropriate before you're willing to accept that it may be based on inappropriate expectations and inaccurate conclusions? It seems as though you've resolved to abandon your plans for retribution against this kid, which is good. But you've shown absolute inflexibility in your evaluation of this situation. That kind of inflexibility will prevent you from incorporating new knowledge into your understanding of the world and people - and it will hinder your maturity into adulthood. I really encourage you to think about that.


I simply cannot find this alright behavior. This isn't alright, I spent some time explaining why. Because virginity etc matters to a lot of people. It matters much. I also fail to understand how you can find the behavior acceptable or appropraite just because it's common, or because I don't care that much. I'm a rare exception in this and my perception regarding sex doesn't matter when evaluating the morality of his actions.

How can one see this as acceptable behavior? Please explain this.


Let's examine what you say he did:

Said he was in love with you: acceptable

Said you were pretty enough to be a model: acceptable

Drunkenly said he wanted to get laid because he was a virgin: in this particular context- inadvisable and unlikely to work but still on the border of acceptable.

You seem to think that a smitten man's attempts to seduce the woman he's fallen for are immoral. I don't agree with that. If you think a man should never attempt to say anything that might be taken as a sexual invitation to a woman he thinks he's dating, you are in for a whole lot of moral outrage. Most of the planet thinks that this is acceptable. The exception is Saudi Arabia. I suggest you move there.


Sigh. THis is completely out of context. I advice you to read the first post.

There's nothing wrong with attempting to get sex, what I do find wrong is lying about it to get it, thereby hurting someone.


I did read the first post. Didn't you read mine? You quoted them so you should have. I'll bold:

STOP ASSUMING HE WAS LYING WHEN HE SAID HE LOVED YOU AND THOUGHT YOU WERE PRETTY!

You have given no evidence that he was lying. Your statement that you "have been in love for a couple of days" and therefore know how all people in love will act is absurd, as daemonic-jackal pointed out. He's the demographic most likely to mistake this crush for love, as Alcagon pointed out. Some socially phobic, depressed virgin finally has a pretty girl agree to meet him. Of course he thinks he's in love. This poor guy. You are so unfair to him.



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19 Jun 2010, 6:15 pm

TBH, if he said you were too boring after butering you up - the guy sounds like an idiot and a liar.

BUT

All that is needed is for you to reject him harsly and never talk to him again. PROBLEM SOLVED. Chances are if he treated you like that and then said that behind your back, he will not change, and will get his arse bitten eventually.

FORGET ABOUT HIM. You're wasting your time on some, frankly, very normal idiot and for no reason. It's not a moral crime, A moral crime is stabbing an animal for no reason. He's just some idiot virgin who by the sounds of it is going to be one for a long time.

There is NOTHING you can do to "punish" him, he will do it to himself in the end.

STOP CARING.



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19 Jun 2010, 6:17 pm

Creature wrote:
Daemonic-Jackal wrote:
Creature wrote:

Because it was obvious. When on MSN he told me he was going to watch a film because he had to and that he felt awful about it while he was still on the computer when ''away'', but then playing World of Warcraft. He even introduced me to it as he wanted the reward, so later on I knew when he was online, and indeed, after I started to play too he never watched a film with his family members again. The reason he introduced me to that game was because he wanted a certain reward you get for making people to play and thereby spend money on the developers. It's an ingame advantage.

He even told me when drunk how desperate he was to have sex. That's quite an indication. He also behaved like a bad soap actor. I found out about numerous times when he claimed he was eager to come on MSN but that he couldn't that he was lying. Apparently I was/am too boring.


Because it was obvious..........yeah because you can really tell when something is that clear over the internet (that's sarcasm by the way incase you dont get it)

Maybe regarding the film and world of warcraft, he changed his mind. As for wanting you to join it so he could get an ingame advantage whilst playing it online.......where is the crime in that? If a friend of yours asked for the same favour would you instantly assume they were just after a quick sh*g? Probably not. People get horny whilst drunk, that's human nature as the brakes come off for a lot of people under the influence of alcohol. I'm sorry but your 'evidence' is is nothing but trivial and you are clearly just twisting everything to fit your hasty and unjustified assumption. Did you ask him out right whether he was only after 'one thing' or not? Oh wait you didn't and even if you had you still wouldn't have believed him anyway as your conclusion of his character was already made up well in advance.

Go see a doctor or a therapist, you clearly have unresolved issues that need addressing.


Can't you read? I've met him in person.

By the way, he asked me first on MSN what my age was. Fine. 17. Immediately he asked me when I turned 18. He started to talk to me a lot more after my birthday.


Yes I can read thanks for asking. :lol: You never stated that his drunken comments were in person or over the internet. Either way I don't see how that makes a difference, my original point still stands and your still treating him like the anti-christ when he hasn't even done anything wrong.

Also the fact he started talking to you more after you turned 18 was probably because he had got to know you better by that point, thats just common sense really, you should try it sometime.

I'm going to stop now, because talking to you is like talking to a brick wall.


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