My problems with girls..

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Zinnel
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19 Mar 2012, 9:27 am

Wolfheart wrote:

It's not so much the confidence itself that helps them, it's the persistence. The persistence to ask girl after girl out without taking rejection personal or letting it effect them to a degree.

When a very confident person gets rejected, they simply say to themselves it's their loss, I know there's someone else for me because I value myself. They have the ability to move on and continue to have a positive and healthy approach to dating.

When a less confident person gets rejected, they internalize that rejection and take it to heart, allowing it to affect them for some time before being able to recover and approach someone else. Even when they do make an approach on someone else, they have internalized that negativity so their approach isn't as effective or as persistent as it could be.

Persistence though is not something strickly done by jerks/as*holes/whatever. Its done by alot of nice people as well too male and female, and even thoughs people with high level confidence often end up being over shadowed by the jerk/as*hole.

It should be noted that most of the "nice vs jerk" debate really only applies to teenagers and the high school/middle school culture.

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hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 1:46 pm

tronist wrote:

when i think back about all of the relationships ive witnessed, a lot of girls have dated as*holes. i think it has to do with confidence, honestly. lets face it, most as*holes are confident. right? its like the definition of an as*hole, someone who is extremely confident and doesnt give a **** about anyone else, what they think, or what they are saying. i think, in terms of confidence, the average as*hole will always have more confidence than the average nice guy.

this being said, theres definitely more attributes that go into what people are looking for, however, like attraction, and how people generally date people around their IQ, etc. i mean, deep down, were all just cavemen and cavewomen, really. escaping the human condition of finding people attractive or not really isnt possible, especially not in this day and age.

not all as*holes are confident, no. in fact many (most?) as*holes are insecure.

what percentage of men would you say are as*holes? if you're seeing "a lot" of women dating as*holes then it must be a high percentage.

we aren't completely driven by our instincts - our instincts are moderated by conscious thought. which is why men aren't all going after women that look like Megan Fox, and women aren't all going after men who look like Brad Pitt.

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Trigas
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19 Mar 2012, 1:48 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

not all as*holes are confident, no. in fact many (most?) as*holes are insecure.

This

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CrazyStarlightRedux
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19 Mar 2012, 1:53 pm

tronist wrote:

when i think back about all of the relationships ive witnessed, a lot of girls have dated as*holes. i think it has to do with confidence, honestly. lets face it, most as*holes are confident. right? its like the definition of an as*hole, someone who is extremely confident and doesnt give a **** about anyone else, what they think, or what they are saying. i think, in terms of confidence, the average as*hole will always have more confidence than the average nice guy.

this being said, theres definitely more attributes that go into what people are looking for, however, like attraction, and how people generally date people around their IQ, etc. i mean, deep down, were all just cavemen and cavewomen, really. escaping the human condition of finding people attractive or not really isnt possible, especially not in this day and age.

I think IQ comes into play for many things.

You say about guys being a***holes, but from what I have witnessed, most aren't very intelligent, and I seem to see girls who date these a***holes aren't all that intelligent either, so the IQ thing definitely rings true.

You also get a***holes who are really clever and woman with a high IQ attracted to them. Many intelligent a***holes don't seem to appear attractive though, but since their IQ makes up for it, the woman would't care.

I think it's all to do with the IQ of people rather the confidence. I seem to be rebellious people date each other all the time since they seem to like breaking rules since they merely don;t understand what civil obligation means.

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hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 2:00 pm

i think i am starting to understand something. please correct my assumptions as necessary.

most males think that they are the "nice guy". they also think that a large proportion of women go for as*holes. since those girls are not dating the same man, it would mean that a large proportion of men are as*holes.

there is a mathematical problem here. most men see themselves as nice and other males as as*holes YET the men who seem to be as*holes are also calling themselves "nice guys". these men can't simultaneously be both nice guys and as*holes...

therefore, the only logical conclusion is that assholery is subjective, and it is based on an us/them mentality. the men who call themselves "nice guys" on the board (aka "us") are primarily single, therefore they label the men who are dating to be the as*holes (aka "them").

i think we could see the same phenomenon if we were talking about anything.... like for instance employment. a person who cannot find a job could attribute it to being too nice and not cutthroat enough. they could discuss it on some forum with other unemployed people and they would logically label all employed people (them) as as*holes because they must have been cutthroat jerks to get a job instead of "us".

in conclusion, getting dates has absolutely nothing to do with being an as*hole or nice guy, because the entire premise is flawed. no single person is a competent judge of assholery because they are using THEMSELVES as the benchmark for niceness and DATING SUCCESS as the benchmark for being an as*hole.

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Zinnel
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19 Mar 2012, 2:12 pm

Megan Fox isn't attractive in the first place :eew:

and your right most as*holes are not confident individuals and eventually/hopefully women see that

but most women I've talked to who have dated men like that, say almost 100% of the time "they didn't seem that way when they first met them and were attracted to them"

which has been my point from the very beginning, its easier to appear confident(even if you are a very confident person anyways) by acting like a jerk.

Again though most women past their teens hopefull gain enough experience in their lives to beable to distinguish true confidences and what just appears to be confidences. The truth is most women who find themselves falling for jerks, can't make that distinction.

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hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 2:16 pm

you're saying two opposite things at once. you are saying:

the men were nice to the girls at first

and

they were acting like jerks

these two things cannot be true at the same time.

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Zinnel
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19 Mar 2012, 2:20 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

you're saying two opposite things at once. you are saying:

the men were nice to the girls at first

and

they were acting like jerks

these two things cannot be true at the same time.

NO

the man appeared confident at first, which the woman found attractive

and

then the man no longer appeared confident, and the woman noticed how much of an as*hole he really was

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Last edited by Zinnel on 19 Mar 2012, 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CrazyStarlightRedux
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19 Mar 2012, 2:21 pm

I think it's the pack mentality. The majority who are single are complaining about the minority (at least in this case).

I wouldn't say all guys who date are a***holes, but the small number of a***holes seem to obtain some form of a relationship with a woman...but I seem to see that the girls themselves can be somewhat bitchy...so it goes both ways I think.

Nice girls can complain about the a***hole woman obtaining guys too.

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hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 2:23 pm

that wasn't what you said. you said this:

Zinnel wrote:

but most women I've talked to who have dated men like that, say almost 100% of the time "they didn't seem that way when they first met them and were attracted to them"

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hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 2:24 pm

CrazyStarlightRedux wrote:

the problem is that there are a lot of single as*holes too.

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CrazyStarlightRedux
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19 Mar 2012, 2:26 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

the problem is that there are a lot of single as*holes too.

Yeah, that is definitely true, but this is a Love and Dating forum where such people don't exist at first glance. :lol:

Would be interesting to see a thread that says "I'm an a***hole, why can't I find a girl/guy!"

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hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 2:29 pm

CrazyStarlightRedux wrote:

hyperlexian wrote:

the problem is that there are a lot of single as*holes too.

Yeah, that is definitely true, but this is a Love and Dating forum where such people don't exist at first glance. :lol:

that's exactly what i was saying with my post (like you said too, with the pack mentality). even the members who call themselves "nice guys" or "nice girls" have GOT to notice that some of the single men (and women) on the board are not nice at all.

i don't really think that there is a dividing line between "nice people" and "as*holes". i think it's a false dichotomy.

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Zinnel
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19 Mar 2012, 2:30 pm

CrazyStarlightRedux wrote:

What I'm trying to say is how confidence aka. the appearence of confidences can change how others view people

most cult leader are not confident people but they appear confident to their followers

guy who appears confident will be for the most part will be considered a cool popular guy, even if hes really just an as*hole, his behavior wont be evident as long as he appears confident to others.

For the record im not saying every cool popular guy is an as*hole.

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Zinnel
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19 Mar 2012, 2:33 pm

hyperlexian wrote:

that wasn't what you said. you said this:

Zinnel wrote:

but most women I've talked to who have dated men like that, say almost 100% of the time "they didn't seem that way when they first met them and were attracted to them"

Yeah they didn't see them as an as*hole when they first met them

they just saw the confidence, which most women are attracted to

I'm sure you've heard the term love is blind right?
it doesn't just mean you can fall in love with anyone

it means you can be enwrapped by someone and not see them for who they truely are. For alot of women confidences can be this enwrapping force. Just like how a woman's looks can have the same effect on alot of men.

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Last edited by Zinnel on 19 Mar 2012, 2:42 pm, edited 3 times in total.

hyperlexian
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19 Mar 2012, 2:34 pm

Zinnel wrote:

CrazyStarlightRedux wrote:

What I'm trying to say is how confidence aka. the appearence of confidences can change how others view people

most cult leader are not confident people but they appear confident to their followers

guy who appears confident will be for the most part will be considered a cool popular guy, even if hes really just an as*hole, his behavior wont be evident as long as he appears confident to others.

For the record im not saying every cool popular guy is an as*hole.

yes, being popular and confident is actually completely separate from being an as*hole. one does not indicate the other. confidence does attract women, but a confident man may or may not be an as*hole.

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