4 easy rules will avoid 98% of sexual harassment accusations

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05 Mar 2013, 7:15 pm

I have a male friend who once got accused of touching a work colleague's knee when they were in his car - he must have accidentally brushed her knee as no way is he the type to do something like that but she was the exact type to think all men were after her and likely to try it on!

mikibacsi1124
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05 Mar 2013, 9:23 pm

This seems like a catch-22 though. I've been given advice from NT friends stating that if I don't make some attempt to show interest (i.e. flirting, compliments, light touching), I'll be sure to get cast off into the "friend zone". I guess the best suggestion would be to simply back off if it doesn't go well, and try to keep things as subtle as possible. But of course, we as aspies tend to struggle with subtletly and don't always get hints...

aspiemike
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05 Mar 2013, 9:53 pm

I got a great rule for all of you to avoid any harassment charges:

Have a smile on your face and make an attempt to make eye contact to say hello to them... If they are not smiling or they aren't paying attention to you, walk past them and simply leave them alone. Problem solved.

Tyri0n
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05 Mar 2013, 10:03 pm

mikibacsi1124 wrote:

Then either wait for them to initiate, or stick to OKC or similar venues, so you're clearer on whether someone is single/available. The more uncertainty you can cut out of the process, the better.

I either use online sites (a recent thing) or wait for girls to initiate interest (how I've done it in the past). The former probably gives you more options than the latter and, as I'm finding, is preferable to just about every other method.

Or have friends introduce you, which only works if you have a reliable source of close friends. I've had not-so-close friends introduce me to people deliberately, but we never hit it off, so I tend not to like this method either because it's too limiting, and there's too much potential for social repercussions if you just don't hit it off with any of the people your friend sends your way (pretty much guaranteed in my case).

bruinsy33
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05 Mar 2013, 10:25 pm

aspiemike wrote:

Good advice and unless you are willing to take the plunge and get rejected face to face don't try anything stupid that could get you in trouble.

ShamelessGit
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05 Mar 2013, 11:22 pm

Several of you basically accused Fnord of lying when you didn't know anything about the situation. I don't think that's fair.

I don't really have any experience with this at all. I've done stupid things like telling a girl that I thought she was hot (she told me in private that I wasn't allowed to say that, but treated me normally afterwards), but no harassment lawsuits or anything like that. I wonder why that is.

mds_02
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06 Mar 2013, 12:15 am

ShamelessGit wrote:

Several of you basically accused Fnord of lying when you didn't know anything about the situation. I don't think that's fair.

Agreed.

For what it's worth Fnord, I completely believe you. I've had something very similar happen to me, also involving someone I never interacted with beyond an occasional "hello" or "good morning."

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06 Mar 2013, 1:19 am

mds_02 wrote:

ShamelessGit wrote:

Several of you basically accused Fnord of lying when you didn't know anything about the situation. I don't think that's fair.

I believe it, too. I've known enough psychotic nutbags to know some people (mostly women in this case) just love - absolutely LOVE - causing drama. It's nothing to them to concoct a big story for them to cry over, be patted and petted with sympathy - then smile with evil glee as the innocent patsy is kicked out in shame. Yes, the plan worked perfectly - she was rewarded and some sucker she doesn't care about got hurt. She won't feel bad - he must've done something to someone to deserve being punished anyway... or maybe he looked at her funny once and she didn't like it, thus painful revenge was called for.

Yes... Life is good for the drama-llama.

:evil:

The_Face_of_Boo
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06 Mar 2013, 2:16 am

nessa238 wrote:

Tyri0n wrote:

nessa238 wrote:

Fnord wrote:

TornadoEvil wrote:

Philosoraptor wrote:

Fnord wrote:

The general rules are: Don't speak to them; Don't look at them; and Don't touch them / Keep your distance.

Ignore them, even when they say, "Hello" first (just say, "Hello" if you have to, but keep doing what you're doing).

If they need help with something at work, focus on the task, and then go your separate ways when the task is finished.

Carry a book or manual with you at all times, so that when you're in their presence with nothing to do, you will at least have something to stare at besides them.

Make no comments about or to them. If pressed for an opinion by a third party (who is likely trying to stir up trouble), just say "She seems nice" and leave it at that.

This sounds more like tips on how to avoid persecution by the Spanish Inquisition.

No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

No one expects to be brought up on charges of harassment, either.

Back in the day, I used to enter the office (at another company) by the front door and say, "Good Morning" to the receptionist. That was all of the contact I had with her on a daily basis. One day, I was called into the boss's office because the receptionist had filed a complaint of harassment against me, saying that my "constant attention" was "obviously flirtatious" and that I was causing a "hostile working environment". The boss told me to undergo a week's worth of sensitivity training or lose my job.

After the ordeal, I returned to work, using the loading dock to enter the building and saying nothing to anyone - I just did my job without speaking (if I could avoid speaking at all). A few weeks later, I was called into the boss's office again because the receptionist had filed another complaint of harassment against me, saying that my "silent treatment" was "obviously hostile" and that I was causing a "hostile working environment". The boss handed me a box, told me to collect my personal property and leave the building.

So, even if you do nothing, you can still be charged with harassment.

I find this story very hard to believe

I bet he stared at her boobs the first time, or commented on her appearance, and then insulted her, confronted her, or was rude/hostile the second time. I've even heard of men sending threatening letters in similar circumstances. Stories like this usually omit important details. If she was really vindictive, it's possible she said good morning, and he simply walked past her, or turned his back on her deliberately. But I think even this would be unlikely to result in sexual harassment charges.

Simply smiling and saying good morning is not sexual harassment. There must be more to the story.

Agreed

I just find it very hard to believe a simple 'Good morning' would cause such an excessive response

Unless it was said in the manner of Austin Powers ie in an OTT suggestive manner perhaps?

As for me, I hardly believe that any sane man would do those things at work and Fnord in particular never exhibited pervert, insanity or aggressive behavior here.

So you made up a whole new scenario with made up details in your head and applied it on Fnord's story as fact? Why? Why are you so unable to believe that a female is capable of doing such nasty things? It must be always be the male's fault no matter what?

Is it so impossible that the receptionist had a wicked mind and was the boss' mistress (and will do anything she asks for) for example? Or perhaps she just had a wicked mind and made false accusations?

Probably it's you Tyrion who did some of those pervert things in the past and projecting them on any male who faced a false harassment accusation.

BlueMax
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06 Mar 2013, 2:34 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

Probably it's you Tyrion who did some of those pervert things in the past and projecting them on any male who faced a false harassment accusation.

Hmmm... I don't think it's that... but it sure sounds like he says the same kind of things radical feminists do... perhaps he believe the same things? Like that all the ills of society are man's fault solely because there was once a patriarchy which must continue to be fought even though it was 99% dead 2-3 generations ago.

After all, law is a huge hotbed of radicalism these days - he sees first-hand how men get punished far worse than women do at the hands of the legal system.

I'll only tick people off more by talking about it any further... but the system and society are both really messed up right now.

The_Face_of_Boo
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06 Mar 2013, 3:00 am

BlueMax wrote:

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:

Probably it's you Tyrion who did some of those pervert things in the past and projecting them on any male who faced a false harassment accusation.

Hmmm... I don't think it's that...

Said that just to show him how easy one can accuses another of things behind the screen, exactly like he did.

Dan_Vincze
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06 Mar 2013, 4:02 am

BlueMax wrote:

After all, law is a huge hotbed of radicalism these days - he sees first-hand how men get punished far worse than women do at the hands of the legal system.

I find this statement baffling. See e.g. Wal-Mart v. Dukes, 131 S.Ct. 2541 (2011).

Anyway, the issue people have here is reasonable: whomever you listen to, the story doesn't make much sense. Either Fnord came into the office and engaged in an uncharacteristic series of bad behaviors for no apparent reason, or this woman fabricated the whole incident, to no benefit for herself and for no apparent cause to lie.
So, with no way of evaluating either party's credibility, there's no particular reason to believe either version of events.

periphery
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06 Mar 2013, 4:07 am

I guess no one young really talks like this anymore but I used to work in this cafe as a waitress and we had a 'regular' who would always refer to us (the staff, all female) as love and darling. It was just his manner of speaking like some older middle-aged men (and even women) do (and he was married as well so I knew it was mostly harmless) but being my early 20's obnoxious self it bothered me and so one day after he called me love I swung around and said to him 'you know some women would consider that sexual harrassment'. I can't remember what he said but he was quite offended. I probably shouldn't have said that since he was a customer and all but anyway. If you happen to use those terms as part of your regular speech, I'd say don't do that!

Last year I think something happened to me that could be constituted sexual harassment: I hadn't long started at my new job and I was painfully shy/anxious and really quiet. Well there was this guy in my team that sat 2 bays across from me that started this kind of 'game' where everytime he walked past my desk (which was often since my desk was on the way to most things) he'd say ''hi periphery''. Not really knowing how to handle it I just started saying "Hi Jim'' back everytime he walked past. And the other girls that sat near me used to laugh at how silly it was since we were greeting each other up to 20 times a day. Anyhow he'd also tease me about being ''too quiet'' by saying things like ''stop typing so loud'' and stuff like that. All this wasn't the issue really. One day he walks past my desk and says his usual ''hi periphery'' but after I said hi back he goes ''you were great last night'' and I was just sooo dead embarrassed I could have died. I'm sure he saw me turn bright red and not being the type to be able to think quickly on my feet I couldn't come up with a quick witted response to defuse the situation which made it worse. Anyway I could have reported him because it really was an inappropriate thing to say but at the end of the day I know that he was mostly harmless about it and there wasn't any maliciousness there it was just inappropriate so I let it drop. I think he knew he'd reached the line because he never said anything like that again luckily.

That's all. Sometimes I do feel bad for guys having to worry about so much being misconstrued, although I do think if you have strong values and are a true moral person for the most part you'll be ok. Just treat females like you'd treat other men, or your mum or sister, and you'll be ok.

It is a shame there are some women out there willing to exploit situations just so they can get the better of them though. Not saying that's all sexual harassment claims, or even the majority but I do think that there are a minority of people that are more in it for personal gain than anything else and unfortunately everyone has to hope that they don't ever come across those people (including women because they're just as likely to do something wrong at work -even unintentionally-but then put the blame on *you* or *anyone else* to avoid taking it themselves. And yes, there's men that do that too. It sucks but then so do most people.

The_Face_of_Boo
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06 Mar 2013, 4:25 am

Quote:

''you were great last night'

Be honest, did you sleep with him? Dined with him? Dated him? It sounds like he was boasting about something. Otherwise, it's a bad joke.

It was very inappropriate to say either way.

periphery
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06 Mar 2013, 4:44 am

No he was married (although still younger than me) ...but we hadn't even had lunch together at work, let alone seeing each other outside of work!
He's just immature and a bit of an attention seeker as all.

The_Face_of_Boo
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06 Mar 2013, 5:01 am

He's a total bull then.

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