Learning some PUA skills is never helpful

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You don't.

You leave people alone.

And oh, one more point: Leave alone those putting earphones.

Women superficial enough to fall for stupid sociopaths and narcissists are part of the problem. They're suppliers/enablers, a lot like drug dealers. If they say "but I love him more than anything" even as they're being abused, then I don't think it's blaming the victim to say they're shallow and getting exactly what they deserve.

Oh, so you are one of that guys mis-mentioning a place people visit for doing sports, with a place people visit to socialize. ^^ Causing me in the end to avoid going to gyms, because of me feeling uncomfortable.

Please dont mismention me, I dont intend you to have a bad purpose, but actually I really dont understand what makes a supermarket a worser place for flirting then a gym. The one thing I visit for buying groceries, so I am not interested in anyone trying to flirt with me, and the other thing I visit for doing sports, so its in my oppinion as well a bad place for flirting. Both are places people visit with the intend to do a certain task, which they are focused on. So both are in my oppinion bad places for flirting, because its simply disturbing people with their task.

Making a blanket statement is never helpful

Seriously though.
If you were to look into PUA wanting to find some useful stuff you would find some useful stuff.

The other day I was skimming through a book that is recommended by just about every other PUA out there just for fun.

What were the first chapters on?
a) how girls are evil
b) how you should always manipulate a girl
c)why starting a friendship in hopes of something more is never a good idea and nice guys^tm are to blame for their short comings.

You guessed it. It was C.

The book is publicly available(was never for sale) and I could lead you to it should you wish to expand your knowledge but basically it said that you should always try to approach a girl as soon as posible.
Why? because while rejection hurts it is better than trying to postpone asking someone out and then blaming the other person for not returning your feelings when you could have asked them out as soon as you had some feelings and got done with it.

Next chapters now
Were they about?:
a) how girls are evil
b) how you should always manipulate a girl
c)why attempting to remain unchanged/replicate the relationships you have with your paternal units on a romantic relationship is the worst idea you could have.

It was c again.
It is hardly groundbreaking stuff but it is something a lot of guys would probably benefit from reading as long as they kept a certain distance from the book and ignored some sections that are plain out misogynistic.

mmmhmmmm.

You also have to keep a distance from some feminist websites due to their own bias. That doesnt stop me from reading them either.

It is all in keeping things balanced imo.

i don't need any more misogyny in my life for "balance", thanks. i get more than enough of that as it is just walking down the street on a given day.

you know why i get harassed when i walked down the street? because of a**holes who read PUA garbage, and a**holes who think it's appropriate to hoot at women on the street because "everyone likes a compliment", right?

I didnt state anyone needed more misogyny in their life for balance.

I did state that trying to keep a wide variety of sources for your reading can be quite benefitial as long as you are able to determine what may be valid, what needs to be taken with a grain of salt and what should be ignored.

PUA has to be taken with a grain of salt.

Sadly it is the only place I have found where some thing like Nice Guy Syndrome isnt sugar coated but given a decent explanation/pointers on what you should work on(and no this pointers arent misogynystic).

If I could get those explanations outside of PUA I wouldnt even skim through those books

Also from my skimming I can tell you that PUA teaches men to basically attempt to show women that you are somehow abobe them. Males that take the time to hoot at you are either reading it wrong or just plain stupid.

To be fair, I think sexist douchebags have existed long before anyone heard of PUA. There's also false dichotomies going on. I don't know why acting confident has turned into acting like a jerk. A lot of jerks aren't as confident as they pretend to be anyways. They're fake.

So it happens that a lot of "nice guys" are either not assertive enough or too desperate. The niceness itself isn't the problem. It's the other things that just happen to be correlated some of the time (but not all the time), which lead to the "nice guy" stereotype. Jerks don't have a problem with not being assertive enough, but they have a problem with being jerks.

And my point is that some of this guys lacking a backbone may benefit from doing a slight research on the area(it is a very wide area where there are plenty of different approaches) as long as they dont just eat up whatever is written on a book and disregard the words that come out of bitterness from the writers.

you heard it guys: if you lack a backbone, go look up some "literature" by emotionally manipulative future (or current) sex offenders. that should help you learn how to be more "assertive"--as long as you skip over all the emotionally manipulative sex-offense instruction bits, which are really only 95-98% of said literature. i'm sure you'll find some great pointers in the other, less misogynistic 2-5% of the material.

definitely excellent advice.

You heard her as well.

People are taking advantage of you most of the time?

Let it happen.

Do not. I repeat do not by any means try to broaden your reading/ change the way you act.

It will all sort itself out magically at some point or something

Also the situation has changed a lot lately. What was considered to be the worst books ever years ago because it didnt blame everything on women(to the point of driving the author away from the community) is now one of the books most will recommend at least looking up.

Last edited by spongy on 25 Mar 2014, 5:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

yes, because i definitely stated quite explicitly that doing any sort of research and reading ANYTHING about how to develop self-confidence or assertiveness is a complete waste of time, and if you are being taken advantage of you should just get used to it because f**k you anyway. i'll just go grab a quote of me saying that earlier in this thread and post it here to remind everyone:

oh, wait a second....

because we all know in our hearts that the best advice when you are being taken advantage of is: learn how to take advantage of other people and switch places with the a**hole bullies, so you can be an a**hole bully too.

Here is a fun fact.

I stated at the beginning why I thought PUA could be helpfull.

There is no sugar coating and if your attitude sucks the writer will outright tell you your attitude sucks and why it sucks.

As stupid as it may sound I find having my attitude confronted quite refreshing/benefitial.

Can you please provide any non-PUA book that will question the nature of Nice guys^tm or similar on a non-bs manner?

If it wasn't for PUA articles and stuff written on the internet, I wouldn't know what to look out for in protecting, and possibly educating some of my younger female friends. I wouldn't know how to deal with other men trying to be clever as well. I am actually thankful that people post this PUA stuff so that I know what to look out for and deal with as well (being another guy you know)

I have found men trying to do the following with me and my current girlfriend, only to have it not work:

1. Wait til I'm not around her to ask her to drink/talk/dance. While not that big an issue, I can tell when a guy has the "I want you" look in his eyes. I have yet to have someone try doing number 2 when it comes to conversations.
2. The smarter and more clever ones aren't actually going to try and disrespect her (not at all). If they know you're the boyfriend, the goal is to disrespect you and make you react in a poor manner (either directly or indirectly). They may believe this will win them the girl.
3. Isolate the both of you from eachother. Sometimes goes hand in hand with number 1. More often than not, wing people are involved.

I have yet to see this happen here as no guy has ever tried to make me feel socially awkward around my girlfriend either. Everytime I came back to introduce myself to them, I get the "oh, you must be the boyfriend. Ok, you guys have a good night." Only once did a guy watch me and her all night because he was too uncertain that we were being honest. He even followed us out after we left the venue from that night which even creeped me out. Other guys aren't as confident as I thought they might be.